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Old 09-14-2008, 11:52 AM
10,869 posts, read 41,139,178 times
Reputation: 14009


Originally Posted by brokerdave View Post

You are not purchasing a hard good. You are entering a contract and receiving a service. This is not a camera or baseball. Is not already manufactured and ready to sell based on supply and demand.

We'll still have to disagree on this concept. The mortgage "broker" is merely a means to access someone else's money on your behalf, and the result is a contracted purchase/use of that money for your use. For example, I've walked into way too many RE offices where the lenders have their current daily offer sheet for lending rates/points clearly stated; they're playing a relationship sales business at what they hope will be competitive rates. That's why brokers are spending a lot of their day calling their "contacts" in the RE side of the business, looking to sell the product they have available (which is money to lend).

The end result of the mortgage broker's work product is a "hard good", not a speculative investment on the order of purchasing stocks, bonds, securities, etc. ... which are highly variable in their outcome and are using your own money.

A stockbroker with a successful track record is no better today then the investment advice he's paid to render at the time; I've seen a lot of successful stock brokers with a great track record make bad recommendations, too.

Nobody, that's nobody, in the investment sales business has a guaranteed lock on a perfect, let alone a great track record. That's why names and personalities are in flux at a lot of industry leading mutual funds, where the guys with a good track record try to sell that expertise to others for a piece of the action.

How do you know what experience they have?


NOTHING in life is free. The same goes for any broker or bank/union. You may negotiate all you want, unless you have millions in an account, banks DO NOT work with you and make special exceptions. In the end your still going to pay the same fee's one way or another.

The Alt-A, ARM and Subprime's were offered through banks. Broker's did not make these products. These products didnt cause they sitaution we are in. A small percentage of people who got them did.

I'm not asking or suggesting that anybody get their mortgage for free. I'm simply stating that it doesn't hurt to shop for the best possible deal and lowest costs as a consumer.

I didn't make any comment about the lending industry's current problems .... so why introduce that now?

So what do you get for going to someone more experienced? Just because you have a great down payment and credit score doesnt mean you get the best rate.

How do you know what someones best rate is?

What if a 30 years is best? Or are you just assuming that a 30 year is best for everyone? How about a 40 year? What if his plan is only to live there for 1, 3, 5, 7, 10, 15 or <30 years? Why pay a higher interest rate for a longer term loan if you aren't going to be there? Or if they plan on taking money out in a few years to "leverage" thier cashflow? What if they are looking for the best way to minimize there monthly obligations? Or looking for a tax shelter? What if they want to make double payments? Do they know the benefits of making extra payments? What if they are self-employed? Should they escrow or not? Are discount points important? What advantages and disadvantages do they have?

There is a reason why brokers exist and why they compete with banks everyday. If banks were so respectful of there customers they wouldn't lose so many loans. They are higher priced, they advertise to there already large customer base. Send out an advertisement saying since your a preferred customer, special loan with this apr, if you qualify. A lot of people get these and think they are special and preferred, they don't get a better deal. The bank just preys on loyalty.

Like stated before, you get what you pay for, plain and simple.
Again, we get to disagree here. I've shopped loans many times in 40+ years of borrowing for mortgages, and the "higher priced, more experienced" broker did NOT necessarily have the best deal for me.

FWIW, I've also done deals with BANKS where they had the best terms, fees, and conditions for my note. They are not automatically bad guys because they aggressively sold to a captive market.

And, I've gotten great deals from aggressive mortgage brokers, and some very bad offers from them, too.

It pays to shop
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Old 09-14-2008, 01:02 PM
82 posts, read 281,776 times
Reputation: 14
and don't pay anything upfront. get your packages mailed or emailed and look it over. If you like what you see and are comfortable with them then send it back with a check for an appraisal
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Old 09-14-2008, 05:21 PM
Location: Charlotte
52 posts, read 116,624 times
Reputation: 23
In the end, most everything is negotiable. I am a banker and luckily work for a lender that does not charge junk fees. Our rates and closing costs are always very low. With that being said, there are times when I am working with a client that is shopping around for their mortgage with more than just me. Occasionally they will find a better deal elsewhere. I always hope they will come back to me and let me know the deal they are being offered. Lots of times, the deal is better because the market changed for the better within hours of talking to me. Sometimes, the deal they are being offered just seems too good to be true with a company that I have never heard of (and we normally know how they turn out). Either way, I always take the deal to our secondary marketing desk and we usually work something out where our deal is the best. Of course, there have been many times where I have worked for free on a loan. Obviously I do not like to do this, but it usually pays for itself down the road with referals.
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