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Old 02-21-2009, 09:32 PM
 
95 posts, read 217,318 times
Reputation: 41

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Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
I don't know why what I said is confusing. Its all over the media , the why and the results. It is credit that motivates people to go out and buy. That is why we are in such a mess now , no credit , for no body , no body buying , no confidence in the system. The World is in a tail spin to the ground. Things are worse in this country than in Canada. They have more restrictions on their banking industry , the most stable in the world as of now. We need to model our system more like Canada , but , its too late. The next banks to go under will be BOA , and Citibank. Within a couple of months I think.

In a more stable monetary system , people save for a rainy day, not in the US. The largest spender is the Government , its people were just following by example. Every thing is controlled by the Fed., which is NOT a Government Agency. It is just a big bank , distributing funds to smaller banks . Everything changed in 1913 , after the depression in 1898-1907. As much as I dislike Ron Paul , he is right about what needs to be done. Start over , with a new system based on the Gold Standard.

People will always live beyond their means in this Country , the Government has encouraged the practice. One of the reasons we have had such a robust economy , was because Americans spend without abandon. Now its all over , its too late to turn back. The poor are throwing rocks at the rich , just as they did in 1932. It will take inflation on a huge scale to provide a fix. You must agree , if home values were inflating as before , would we have a problem now ,?.. the answer is NO.... In the end , hyperinflation sets in , and we go down again , that too is coming , its just delaying the fall , we do need to wipe out all debt , and , start over , its the only way.
You know, there was a time in the history of this country that people didn't have credit as we have it today. They might have had credit at the local stores and that was kept on a piece of paper on one of those (I can't remember what they called it) things with a long thin nail on a stand that were used to hold papers ( I hate it when that happens). But that was all. No plastic, no Bank of America card, no Master card, no Diners Club, No American Express, no charges from every store under the sun. Just cash. When folks had a little extra, it might have been used for a treat for the family or - Heaven forbid - put into a savings account. Now, if people wanted a "big ticket item", they saved up for it. Cars and houses they got credit for only with a substantial down payment.

So, yes, maybe we should start over again and have a no credit society. No money, no purchase. 50% down on homes and 30% down on vehicles.

To trishguard,
Thank you, I did try and contact my creditors (credit cards) to see if they would lower my interest rates and possibly my minimum payment and they also said that I'd have to be behind on my payments (I used to pay more than the minimum, sure could use that extra money now). It really amazes me.
Since no one wants to talk to me until I'm far behind on my payments, I guess I'll take the lawyers advice and file for bankruptcy and stay until they throw me and my family out.

And unemployment doesn't pay for very much.
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Old 02-21-2009, 11:05 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,578 posts, read 13,479,866 times
Reputation: 2708
Quote:
Originally Posted by SSWM View Post
You know, there was a time in the history of this country that people didn't have credit as we have it today. They might have had credit at the local stores and that was kept on a piece of paper on one of those (I can't remember what they called it) things with a long thin nail on a stand that were used to hold papers ( I hate it when that happens). But that was all. No plastic, no Bank of America card, no Master card, no Diners Club, No American Express, no charges from every store under the sun. Just cash. When folks had a little extra, it might have been used for a treat for the family or - Heaven forbid - put into a savings account. Now, if people wanted a "big ticket item", they saved up for it. Cars and houses they got credit for only with a substantial down payment.

So, yes, maybe we should start over again and have a no credit society. No money, no purchase. 50% down on homes and 30% down on vehicles.

To trishguard,
Thank you, I did try and contact my creditors (credit cards) to see if they would lower my interest rates and possibly my minimum payment and they also said that I'd have to be behind on my payments (I used to pay more than the minimum, sure could use that extra money now). It really amazes me.
Since no one wants to talk to me until I'm far behind on my payments, I guess I'll take the lawyers advice and file for bankruptcy and stay until they throw me and my family out.

And unemployment doesn't pay for very much.
Lots of safety net items are coming. Its not over yet. You may get a second chance , if the outrage from the people is large enough , and , the Banks are forced to write down some of the principle. The Government will issue vouchers to the Banks to cover the banks short fall, or , part there of.
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Old 02-22-2009, 02:05 PM
 
2,153 posts, read 4,902,735 times
Reputation: 643
Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
The next banks to go under will be BOA , and Citibank. Within a couple of months I think.

.
If BOA goes under, who would i make my mortgage payment to? The Government? Yes you are correct, I am one of the stupid people making my payments every month.
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Old 02-22-2009, 05:31 PM
 
901 posts, read 2,614,986 times
Reputation: 562
Quote:
Originally Posted by elikhom View Post
Oh please, it was greed not only from bankers but millions of people who thought were going to make a quick buck or achieve the "American dream" without having to put any effort on it, yeah an I'm including thinking before signing in that effort.
I agree. I saw on the news the other day a woman saying how she can't pay her mortgage payment. She took out a loan on her house that she said she knew she would not be able to pay back (her own words). Now she's asking for assistance. Stories like that make me upset. Am I supposed to feel sorry for her? Well, I don't.

As far as help for others, it's a case by case basis for me. Some people really didn't bite off more than they could chew. Still, tradgic things happened to them. Others were just greedy.
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:09 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,578 posts, read 13,479,866 times
Reputation: 2708
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam82 View Post
I agree. I saw on the news the other day a woman saying how she can't pay her mortgage payment. She took out a loan on her house that she said she knew she would not be able to pay back (her own words). Now she's asking for assistance. Stories like that make me upset. Am I supposed to feel sorry for her? Well, I don't.

As far as help for others, it's a case by case basis for me. Some people really didn't bite off more than they could chew. Still, tradgic things happened to them. Others were just greedy.
You must realize , many people were offered Free houses. ( no Money Down ). If you were a renter down on your luck , what would you do ... you bet , you would do the same. Just getting a few years in a home you can call your own , was worth it to those people....... criminal blame lies on the Corporate bankers , that told their people , " go out and sell this paper " It will make us a lot of money "
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:13 PM
 
Location: State of Superior
8,578 posts, read 13,479,866 times
Reputation: 2708
Quote:
Originally Posted by bls5555 View Post
If BOA goes under, who would i make my mortgage payment to? The Government? Yes you are correct, I am one of the stupid people making my payments every month.
BOA will be nationalized , just like AIG already is. No change in your payments , just keep em coming... ( there may be a sur charge for some folks in addition , to compensate the offset for those who will get a free ride, they have not worked out that wrinkle yet ).
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Old 02-22-2009, 08:15 PM
 
901 posts, read 2,614,986 times
Reputation: 562
Quote:
Originally Posted by darstar View Post
You must realize , many people were offered Free houses. ( no Money Down ). If you were a renter down on your luck , what would you do ... you bet , you would do the same. Just getting a few years in a home you can call your own , was worth it to those people....... criminal blame lies on the Corporate bankers , that told their people , " go out and sell this paper " It will make us a lot of money "
The woman on the news story took out a home equity loan on a house that she already had for years. As I mentioned, she knew should would not be able to make the payments from the beginning. Does that make sense?
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Old 02-22-2009, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
2,193 posts, read 4,453,524 times
Reputation: 1072
Quote:
Originally Posted by cleasach View Post
These "no income verification" loans, too, were the fault of the people who took the loans.
But who created the no income verification loans? Someone created them because they knew the sheeple would fall for it. It was all over tv, the news, bush uttered it as well, 'the american dream', the dream of home ownership. The people are very emotional about homes and home ownership, and the elite knew this. So they crafted commercials, advertisements, loans, and easy credit. And they took the bait.

The people need to get their heads out of the sand as it's the only way to get out of this mess.
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Old 02-22-2009, 09:57 PM
 
3,720 posts, read 4,447,173 times
Reputation: 4741
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheenie2000 View Post
But who created the no income verification loans? Someone created them because they knew the sheeple would fall for it. It was all over tv, the news, bush uttered it as well, 'the american dream', the dream of home ownership. The people are very emotional about homes and home ownership, and the elite knew this. So they crafted commercials, advertisements, loans, and easy credit. And they took the bait.

The people need to get their heads out of the sand as it's the only way to get out of this mess.
Yet I and many others didn't fall for it. I want to own my own home very badly too, but I'm a cautious person. I don't live on a wing and a prayer.
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Old 02-23-2009, 08:04 AM
 
Location: Tampa, FL
2,638 posts, read 10,521,141 times
Reputation: 3537
Quote:
You must realize , many people were offered Free houses. ( no Money Down ). If you were a renter down on your luck , what would you do ... you bet , you would do the same.
We were renters and we most certainly did not do the same. We watched local housing prices skyrocket right about the time my husband and I would have liked to buy, but even the "fixer-uppers" were insanely inflated and getting worse every day. I don't care what the realtors claimed about being forever priced out of the market, I was not paying that kind of price for that product in this town. Renting was far cheaper.

They sure did offer us a "free" house with an astounding pricetag and a tempting low monthly payment, but I said to myself... there are no free lunches, so what's the catch? ARM, what does that mean? Ah... adjustable rate. So what happens when the rate adjusts? Hmmm. Then I said, no thanks. We'll keep renting, save our pennies and wait for prices to come back to Earth. Finally we are nearing the point where we can find something modest and livable where P&I and taxes and insurance would be roughly equal to what we pay in rent. If we wait a little longer it might even be cheaper than rent. I have very little sympathy for people who refused to heed that old adage "if it sounds too good to be true, IT IS."

These same people who snickered nastily at renters for "throwing their money away" are having to eat their words. So many people were running around town like they were royalty, spending money they didn't have on crap that they didn't need while looking down their noses at people who lived within their means. Maybe if they'd have been saving instead of making minimum CC payments and sucking the bubble equity out of their homes they would have a fallback position now that it's all gone to hell. They need to learn some personal responsibility and stop pointing fingers at everyone else for their poor decisions and expecting people who made good decisions and lived frugally for years to pay to support their extravagant lifestyles. It's the grasshopper and ant story all over again.

Sure, the banks had a hand in this, but it all comes back to supply and demand. If there had been no demand for these loans (on the back end but also on the front) then they wouldn't have continued to offer them. Everyone in the chain is responsible for their role in this calamity, but of course no one wants to own up and instead they expect people who didn't hop on the ponzi scheme to bail them out. It's pathetic.
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