INto the Wild by Sean Penn (filming, Columbia, Hollywood, short)

[BlueWillowPlate]

Originally Posted by warptman

The sad thing about this book and movies is that you and I know that there will be some Macandles wannabes out there that come to Alaska and think they can live off the land. It is tough living up here and this book will bring the masses to Alaska. That'll be good for tourism, but I hope and pray that no one else dies like this fool.

Originally Posted by daytripper

Just what we need....more Cheechakos ( greenhorns) The Civil Air Patrol
would be would not appreciate having to look for these fools when they end up lost.

Well, Chris died in '92, the story was originally published in Outside Magazine in '93, the book (which was excellent) came out back in '96.
Since then, have there been many situations similar to that of McCandless?

I guess the movie could bring another wave of pilgrims coming out to the bus.
I'm thinking that Alaska can handle that--and the profit--and probably already is.

One very good thing: Twenty percent of the royalties generated by sales of the book are being donated to a scholarship fund in Chris McCandless' name.

[daytripper]

Originally Posted by b. frank

I wish people would stop picking on the memory of Alexander Supertramp.

Maybe he was a fool and a potential pain in the ass for rescue workers.
So what? His life was worthy of a book and a movie because he was an interesting character who lived the way he wanted which put him at odds with the mainstream.
I wish more people would do what they want to do in life, even if they end up dead for it. The Civil Air Patrol members should quit their jobs if they don't want to rescue foolish, unprepared people. We create services like theirs because we live in a free nation where we are free to be as stupidly adventurous as we want.

I hope you understand the Alaska Civil Air Patrol are volunteers-- not
paid employees. Get a grip.

[b. frank]

Originally Posted by daytripper

I hope you understand the Alaska Civil Air Patrol are volunteers-- not
paid employees. Get a grip.

What the Air Patrol earns for their service wasn't my point.

I feel that I have a grip. OK - I understand the principle that people should be prepared when they do potentially dangerous things. I can see why a rescue agency would be angry over this story and wish for less people to put themselves in danger. Still, as we all know, people will do that and everybody has to deal with the consequences. One story won't change that much one way or another.

What really bugs me is that I don't believe that Chris deserves all of the criticism that he gets. He died because he was unprepared but he almost didn't. The foolish part was that he actually planned on being unprepared - that was the whole point for him. Still, I think that is his prerogative and he didn't do too poor a job, he just made crucial mistakes. He died. Isn't that punishment enough for him and his family? Does he really have to be painted as the World's Most Inept Survivalist as well?

[laysayfair]

Originally Posted by b. frank

What the Air Patrol earns for their service wasn't my point.

I feel that I have a grip. OK - I understand the principle that people should be prepared when they do potentially dangerous things. I can see why a rescue agency would be angry over this story and wish for less people to put themselves in danger. Still, as we all know, people will do that and everybody has to deal with the consequences. One story won't change that much one way or another.

What really bugs me is that I don't believe that Chris deserves all of the criticism that he gets. He died because he was unprepared but he almost didn't. The foolish part was that he actually planned on being unprepared - that was the whole point for him. Still, I think that is his prerogative and he didn't do too poor a job, he just made crucial mistakes. He died. Isn't that punishment enough for him and his family? Does he really have to be painted as the World's Most Inept Survivalist as well?

Why would some guy going into the wild stop at the bus?
He wouldn't have lasted as long as he did if it weren't for the bus and what it offered.
From reading the book I think he had some mental/psychological problem that looks to others as "freedom" and "free-thinking" but was really an undiagnosed "tic", some kind of "tourettes syndrome" where he has to keep moving (instead of cursing). I do feel terribly sorry for him. I think he needed help and never got it.

[b. frank]

Originally Posted by laysayfair

Why would some guy going into the wild stop at the bus?
He wouldn't have lasted as long as he did if it weren't for the bus and what it offered.
From reading the book I think he had some mental/psychological problem that looks to others as "freedom" and "free-thinking" but was really an undiagnosed "tic", some kind of "tourettes syndrome" where he has to keep moving (instead of cursing). I do feel terribly sorry for him. I think he needed help and never got it.

That bus was situated IN the (relative) wild. He stopped because it made sense. Why does every step he made need to be an object of criticism?

Perhaps you would be happier if he dealt with his "tic" by sitting behind a desk in some office every day and visiting a shrink once a week to discuss how smothered he feels. He could be currently driving his middle-aged body back and forth from work to home daily and watching movies about other people who lived a free life (or are they all crazy, too?). I find that scenerio equally as sad as venturing into Alaska and dying young.

I think that people's reactions to this story speak volumes about how the observer views life. I happen to feel that the spirit behind Chris's motives should be encouraged and celebrated - not stifled and deemed sick.

[laysayfair]

Originally Posted by b. frank

That bus was situated IN the (relative) wild. He stopped because it made sense. Why does every step he made need to be an object of criticism?

Perhaps you would be happier if he dealt with his "tic" by sitting behind a desk in some office every day and visiting a shrink once a week to discuss how smothered he feels. He could be currently driving his middle-aged body back and forth from work to home daily and watching movies about other people who lived a free life (or are they all crazy, too?). I find that scenerio equally as sad as venturing into Alaska and dying young.

I think that people's reactions to this story speak volumes about how the observer views life. I happen to feel that the spirit behind Chris's motives should be encouraged and celebrated - not stifled and deemed sick.

...or he could have gotten help so that he was making choices instead of being driven. Then he could have still lived his life in the wild making good, rational choices that led him to a long, happy life.

[BlueWillowPlate]

Originally Posted by b. frank

I think that people's reactions to this story speak volumes about how the observer views life. I happen to feel that the spirit behind Chris's motives should be encouraged and celebrated - not stifled and deemed sick.

I agree.
I don't think he was ill.
And I think that it is interesting that towards his end, he reverted from "Alexander Supertramp" back to his original name, the one his parents gave him.
If he had been rescued, Chris' story might have had a very different ending; he would have learned something about himself but gone on to lead a fulfilling life.
As it was, I think he did learn something; it is tragic (especially for his family) that he died.
Like so many of us, Chris felt the urge, went to the edge, and he was one of the ones who didn't come back.
Thing is, a lot of complacent people out there are alive--but not living.

[recycled]

This was an excellent movie, I just saw it yesterday on cable / movie on demand. Sean Penn put together a film that haunted me more that just a little bit. I had a lot of the same issues going through my head as the main character Chris / Alex when I was in my early 20s (which was in the 1970s).

I had a not so great home-family life, and I was anxious to leave everything I knew behind for awhile. One summer while in college, I went out to the great plains and got a job on a custom harvest / combine crew cutting wheat from Oklahoma to Montana and the Dakotas. I spent another summer on a road trip by bus and by catching rides, hauling my pack and staying where ever I could find a place crash down without spending much money. I took another road trip in the 70s solo from California through Mexico, Central and South America. I was gone for over 7 months, a grand adventure that had plenty of danger and risk. For some reason, some of us when in our 20s feel immortal and immune to danger that would cause others to pause or turn back. In my case I made it home from my grand adventure unscathed.

At the end of my trip I was anxious to get home and get on with living back in the real world. In the case of Chris / Alex, after a time in the wild he decided to head back to the real world too, but his miscalculations prevented him from going back and cost him his life. It's one thing to be on your own in a different country surrounded by people who have little in common with you. There is still a way out, somebody can help out if you are in trouble or in need. In the wild, nature is unforgiving and ruthless to the lone animal or human - survival hinges on a very small margin for error.

[cremebrulee]

Originally Posted by Rhiannon29

Yeah, this was an issue I had with the story behind the movie. I found it a little hard to sympathize with him because he seemed like he was exhibiting the very traits he loathed in his parents: selfish, arrogant, etc. And the abuse issue with his parents, I read, was made up for the movie (another reason for me to read the book). Someone correct me if I am wrong. But it was almost as if Penn had to justify his not letting his family know where he was, i.e., they were abusive drunks so they deserved to be worried to distraction about their only son. Almost everyone has an complaint about their upbringing, and his was no worse than anyone else's.

It saddens me greatly that if he had of planned his venture better, he could have been around to tell us about his journey and what he learned first hand.

I don't think, when we're young, we realize the impact we have on our parents feelings....not until we're older, or, have children of our own, do we fully understand why our parents became upset with some of the things we had done.

Yes, it was sad, but I don't believe he deliberately set out to do this because of his dysfunctional parents. Also, to the poster who wrote, Boo Hoo he had a somewhat bad childhood...yes, we all had troubles when we were kids...some of us turned out ok, some of us have scars, some of us didn't have dysfunctional parents and we still were thoughtless and cruel when it came to our parents feelings. Everyone is different...each of us...and as far as Christopher was concerned, was it right what he did, NO, but I don't believe he did it to get even, I believe in my heart, he went there because he was so strongly drawn to travel and see the wilderness.

Again, I have experienced, that restlessness in my soul for want of travel, wilderness, the sea, oceans....and again, I will state, unless you experience that tug of war within, you will never be able to understand, that complete yearning deep inside, to break away from the constraints of society.

As I've read all your posts here....I've noted exactly why, I always wanted to break away from society...we are all so caught up in our own way of thinking, the moment someone thinks and does differently from our beliefs, we've got to anaylze his reasons to death...and if his believes do not conform to ours, then well, he must have been a bad person.

For example, just browse these threads and see how many people become so angry when someone else doesn't agree with their beliefs...and to the point of publically humiliating another human being for their beliefs...I mean people are not only stagnated by their own lack of knowledge, they are controlling and actually believe, because someone else doesn't agree with them, then, it must be a personal attack against their characters...so they come back on again and again, and try to make a fool out of that person by telling them how stupid they are....when in fact, they are actually proving how closed minded and selfish they really are. I mean, that is the thing that Christopher was so far above...he didn't fuss or fight or try to prove his point, he simply lived it by example....which very few of us can do. He allowed others their thoughts, and ideas of what life should be, but chose to do what he best wanted to accomplish.

No one knows what this boy was thinking....but I do know that he certainly wanted to articulate his very own destiny, instead of allowing society to do it for him....he definately wanted to acheive something of balance, between himself and nature. It is a deep emotional bond of meaningful connection of intimacy with self and all that is pure and untouched by man. An irresistable force which doesn't allow one to ignore...he wanted to taste the salt of the earth, reach out and touch the stars.

Did any of you actaully notice how down right happy he was...he wasn't nuts, because he didn't conform to your ideas of what life should be. He wasn't selfish, because he didn't grow up, become a doctor or whatever his parents wanted him to do, or get married and live his life working a job, buying a home with the white picket fence, and having children...like most of societies human beings are raised to believe is not only a necessity, but normal. I will say this, he surely did some planning, to get to that point, b/c he knew his parents hold on his was so strong, if he didn't do it the way he did, they would have stopped him. And they certainly did try, didn't they, and wouldn't we? We all think we know whats best for our kids, when in fact, we don't.

For him, it wasn't normal...it was like being trapped in a cage...his soul longed to find his ultimate purpose, and that purpose wasn't doing what all of us have done...which is followed in the footsteps of our parents, grew up, went to school, got married, got a job, had kids, worked worked worked and then died.

sheesh, while that is great for some of us, it isn't enough for others, and I was one of those persons. I felt I was made to grow, and although I didn't understand it, b/c I was already conditioned, it didn't fit...it didn't feel right or comfortable...I hated society...hated the that they taught one thing yet, treated other human beings cruelly and when other human beings, like artists, did something out of the norm, they were banned from society. I didn't like the fact that so many people down on their luck, mentally retarded, mentally handicaped people were mocked, pushed to the bottom of the chain so to speak...I hated the audacity of society, to judge, to actually believe they could judge others, when they never stopped long enough to look in the mirror.

Remember when the manager of that fast food place told him he had to wear socks....and he quit? That is only a very small example of what I'm trying to explain.

Humanity is a profound mystery. We share desires that are universal, yet unique to our species but if others think and feel differently then us, we condemn them, or label them selfish, insane, etc.

Christopher painted his own canvas, being aware there was something much bigger. He chose to step outside of the coat of society, and explore for himself....He will knew why and how and what it is exactly that we can’t understand, even after staring for hours at his canvas, even after days of solitude and soul-reflection. He looked inside and knew what was really going on in his very own desires and dreams. Let me repeat that, HIS desires, HIS dreams, not yours, not his parents, but his...and he planned for a long time....he was his own person, not influenced by the thoughts of others...it was his own language, so to speak...

was there a price to pay, yes, a very grave price...with his life...and if in fact it was true, that he ate the wrong berries, and died due to the effects of that poison, which caused starvation....then, a grave mistake it was...a life threatening mistake.

No one really knows what he was thinking, not even those who were interviewed who knew him briefly...they interpreted their own ideas of whom they thought he was, (remember we only see what we think we know) but did they really know him, or did they interpret the Christopher that they thought he should be. We humans' do not really know the soul of another...not even when we're married, we don't always know who that person really is.

Try playing whisper down the alley and see jsut how the true intent of the story gets all turned around.

Christopher was his own person, and he knew that his parents would have probably stopped him from completing the real journey that he had to experience....and yes, he died, but my son could die tomorrow to, due to his job as a police officer. Did I want him to chose that career, no. Did I want him to join the military and risk his life, no...but what I did want, more then anything else, was for him to LIVE HIS LIFE and complete his journey...his very own personal Journey/destiny...one of which was not mine.

Can any one grasp what I'm trying to explain....?

I think when we so used to being who are parents were, b/c we were conditioned by them and their thoughts, feelings, actions, beliefs...it is so difficult to try and understand others who do things differently...so, we become afraid, and judge them...but really, at the end of the day, no one, but no one, can know, what Christopher was feeling, when he finally made it, to that place in the wild....and he was perfectly happy....and probably more fulfilled that most of us are, who live a lifetime and are never happy, never follow our dreams or complete our desires and wants....I think, Christopher was one human being that really understood happy, as I have...it is a completedness commune with nature, to understand the sounds, and actually know who you are...those impulses of actually fulfilling the cravings of life....instead of laying them aside. I have been fortunate enough, to spend many many hours alone, in communion with nature, the ocean, sea....wilderness....and I tell you with all my heart and soul....it is a life giving force that fulfills the depth of man....it is to me, a real understanding of God....to actually listen instead of talking.

I hope I don't sound compleltely off my rocker to you...but Christopher for a brief moment, lived, really lived.

[JustT&Me]

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

Can any one grasp what I'm trying to explain....? ... Christopher for a brief moment, lived, really lived.

Yes. Absolutely.