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Old 10-29-2013, 10:44 PM
 
Location: CA, U.S.A.
628 posts, read 1,119,787 times
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I'm going to say it now so make no mistake as to my opinion on the matter:

I...LOVED....TWILIGHT the entire movie series.

I loved it for many, many, many reasons such as it's combination of supernatural things with romance, but the reason that is relevant to this thread is that the Twilight Movies actually portrayed a "wild-animal shifter" type of person as NOT "A MINDLESS BLOODTHRISTY KILLING MONSTER", sure Jacob may joke about it saying to Bella, "What I'm not the right kind of monster for you?" but none them are ACTUALLY "monsters" in the "typical werewolf portrayal movie sense", they retain their ability to "think" and are NOT "overcome with mindless bloodlust that comes from nowhere".~

Although actual Quileute Tribal answer to the movies is that they ARE descended from wolves who were turned into Humans by a wandering Transformer being literally, but that shift seemed to be more or less PERMANENT and they say they do NOT have the ability to shift from one physical Human form to another wolf form and back when ever they want like shown in the movies.~

Sources:

The Real Quileute Tribe Are Not Werewolves | The Mary Sue

The Buffalo Post Blog Archive Yes, fans of “Twilight” and “New Moon,” Quileute tribal legend has wolves. But werewolves? Not so much

Quileute Tribal information:

Quileute Nation - History

Many Native American cultures do have some kind of "spiritual shifting" present in them, where the "spirit" shifts but not the "body", this is done for many reasons but many times for "self-journeys".~

I'm SO "SICK" of these horrible portrayal of werewolves in movies: IT MAKES NO SENSE, other than as a "plot" element to pit the "werewolf" or "werewolves" against "everyone else".~

Think about it: wolves don't just randomly kill things and leave behind an "untouched" or "half-eaten" carcass: do you HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT BEING A WOLF IS LIKE IN THE WILD?! WOLVES SOME TIMES ONLY EAT ONCE A MONTH, DO YOU THINK THERE IS REALLY GOING TO BE "ANYTHING LEFT OF THAT CARCASS OTHER THAN CHEWED-DOWN GNAWED AT "BONES"?~

What about the Human-side: if we really had the "chance" or the "power" to kill people when ever we wanted, would we just kill ANYONE ALL THE TIME? Are we really suppressing this "urge" enough to the point where if "our control" is "broken" that we would go on a "random killing spree with no sense to it"?


I want to see MORE movies that go off of more "protector" or "non-evil" werewolves or just "not mindless bloodthristy monster werewolves" seen in ACTUAL traditions, legends, and folklore.~

For example:

The Irish Werewolf

Faoladh (Werewolf)

The Irish Werewolf is considered a protector and guardian of villages and the people who live there. They called themselves in their native tongue the "faoladh" or "conroicht". If you attacked them or "surprised them" while they were in their wolf form, many times they would run away because this makes them turn back into Human form and they are more vulnerable in their Human form.

I'm not sure how much damage it would take to make them turn back into their Human form, but probably a lot. I've heard it wasn't uncommon for them to eat the occasional sheep or "farm animal", but they didn't do this often enough to be considered a nuisance or "menace" and I'm pretty sure most people would be grateful a sheep or some kind of "food offering" once in awhile because they were hungry is all a Werewolf would ask to protect your village.~

Eventually, even before the "spread" of "Christianity", some people started considering the Irish Werewolves as being cursed for some reason, but I would take that with a grain of salt since people tend to get jealous and/or fearful of things they don't understand or that they want to be apart of but for some reason aren't (such as lack of knowledge). But even though they were eventually considered "cursed", this still didn't change their "protector" and "great warriors to be called upon in times of need" status.~

Source: Faoladh (Werewolf)

Last edited by ColorsWolf; 10-29-2013 at 11:20 PM..
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Old 10-29-2013, 11:13 PM
 
Location: SLC, UT
1,571 posts, read 2,285,363 times
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I went to the Grizzly and Wolf Discovery Center in West Yellowstone two weeks ago, and saw a wolf there kill a bird, play with it for a second, then stick it into a hole next to a rock. And when asked, the lady who worked there said that they're always doing that with birds, mice, rats - anything they can catch. They never eat it - they just play with it for a second, and then put it somewhere and leave it there to rot.

Also, there was the Beast of Gevaudan (actually multiple wolves), who killed many humans, ripping their throats out, and only partially eating some of them.

The International Wolf Center states: If prey is abundant, wolves may not consume an entire carcass, or they may leave entire carcasses without eating. This is called "surplus killing" and seems inconsistent with the wolves' habit of killing because they are hungry. Surplus killing seems to occur when prey are vulnerable and easy to catch - in winter, for instance, when there is deep snow. Since wolves are programmed to kill when possible, they may simply be taking advantage of unusual situations when wild prey are relatively easy to catch They may return later to feed on an unconsumed carcass, or they may leave it to a host of scavengers.

You're being a little silly, though. Werewolves aren't real, so why does it matter how they're portrayed?
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Old 10-29-2013, 11:32 PM
 
Location: CA, U.S.A.
628 posts, read 1,119,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MisfitBanana View Post
I went to the Grizzly and Wolf Discovery Center in West Yellowstone two weeks ago, and saw a wolf there kill a bird, play with it for a second, then stick it into a hole next to a rock. And when asked, the lady who worked there said that they're always doing that with birds, mice, rats - anything they can catch. They never eat it - they just play with it for a second, and then put it somewhere and leave it there to rot.

Also, there was the Beast of Gevaudan (actually multiple wolves), who killed many humans, ripping their throats out, and only partially eating some of them.

The International Wolf Center states: If prey is abundant, wolves may not consume an entire carcass, or they may leave entire carcasses without eating. This is called "surplus killing" and seems inconsistent with the wolves' habit of killing because they are hungry. Surplus killing seems to occur when prey are vulnerable and easy to catch - in winter, for instance, when there is deep snow. Since wolves are programmed to kill when possible, they may simply be taking advantage of unusual situations when wild prey are relatively easy to catch They may return later to feed on an unconsumed carcass, or they may leave it to a host of scavengers.

You're being a little silly, though. Werewolves aren't real, so why does it matter how they're portrayed?
Interesting, but no amount of "research" is going to determine "how wolves think" without establishing a clear, reliable, and stable method of communication outside of our own Human species and they are not "programmed" as they are not "machines" constructed by us Humans so your analogy fails.~

So we can only "guess" at best as to "what is most probable based upon outside observations" in relation to those outside of our own species.~

Logically the behavior you describe wouldn't be typical in any sense of the word and it wouldn't be logical to be common in occurrence either.~

While this behavior may indeed occur, it is acknowledged as rare.~

Source: Living With Wolves - About Wolves - Questions About Wolves

Your final sentence has no bearing here since "movies" were never meant to be a portrayal of all things "factual" at all times and instead more of a form of "entertainment".~

Also in relation to your faulty logic: the absence of proof does not prove the nonexistence of some thing.~

Also things are not limited in existence to be within the realm of your experience.~
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Old 10-30-2013, 12:05 AM
 
Location: SLC, UT
1,571 posts, read 2,285,363 times
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Riiiight, so it's "research" (quotes suggesting that it's not real) even if it's conducted by professionals who commit their entire lives to wolf conservation, but your thoughts on wolves are absolutely true because you really want werewolves to be real. Wolves have been observed killing without eating what they kill. Humans have historically been attacked, killed, and often not eaten by wolves. And while you're now saying that no one can really tell what wolves are "thinking," you're ultimately the one who was writing as if you know how wolves are in the wild and are telling people about their habits, acting as if it's absolute (ie: "do you HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT BEING A WOLF IS LIKE IN THE WILD?! WOLVES SOME TIMES ONLY EAT ONCE A MONTH, DO YOU THINK THERE IS REALLY GOING TO BE "ANYTHING LEFT OF THAT CARCASS OTHER THAN CHEWED-DOWN GNAWED AT "BONES"?~").

Obviously, you're emotionally invested in this. It sounds like you want your fantasy to come to life (or at least to the big screen). Hate to break it to you, but a ruggedly handsome man who has a deep dark secret is not going to take a sudden interest in you, being the only person to truly recognize your inner beauty, transform in front of you, bite you (hating to hurt you, but knowing what gifts his bite will bring to you), and transform you into a human-protector and his immortal mate.

There are a lot of books you can read that deal with werewolves (although the authors usually don't make them absolute human-protectors, though they're certainly not written as insane human killers, either). But if you want your werewolf fantasies to come to the big screen, you may need to write your own movie. There doesn't seem to be a big market for it. And please realize, that while Twilight was popular, it was all about the vegetarian vampires. The werewolves were secondary - not only to the overall story, but also to most of the readers/viewers.

And ha ha to your last couple of lines. You're in the same category as people who believe in Nessie and Sasquatch. You bring up the idea of faulty logic, well, hate to tell you, but believing in something just because no one can provide absolute proof that it doesn't exist is far more faulty. Can you prove that they do exist? Nope. Literally no one can. When absolutely no proof exists, and yet you claim a possible existence, then the burden of proof is on you to prove that the wolf-men in your dreams are actually real.

But hey, did you know that there are pegasuses? It's super true. And sparkles come out their butts. If you tell me they don't exist, I'm going to say that you are exhibiting faulty logic, since you have no proof that they don't exist. When I find my sparkle pegasus, I'm going to call him Bernie.
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Old 10-30-2013, 06:25 AM
 
Location: Henderson, NV, U.S.A.
10,281 posts, read 6,220,562 times
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Quote:
Werewolves as NOT "Mindless Bloodthristy Killing Monsters"
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisfitBanana View Post
I went to the Grizzly and Wolf Discovery Center in West Yellowstone two weeks ago, and saw a wolf there kill a bird, play with it for a second, then stick it into a hole next to a rock. And when asked, the lady who worked there said that they're always doing that with birds, mice, rats - anything they can catch. They never eat it - they just play with it for a second, and then put it somewhere and leave it there to rot.
ok, wolves just want to have fun, so scratch the mindless. bloodthirsty? check. killing monsters? from the bird's point of view - check.
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Old 10-31-2013, 05:39 AM
 
Location: Henderson, NV
1,091 posts, read 1,216,905 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColorsWolf View Post
Interesting, but no amount of "research" is going to determine "how wolves think" without establishing a clear, reliable, and stable method of communication outside of our own Human species and they are not "programmed" as they are not "machines" constructed by us Humans so your analogy fails.~

Also in relation to your faulty logic: the absence of proof does not prove the nonexistence of some thing.~

Also things are not limited in existence to be within the realm of your experience.~
I myself have spent many years researching werewolves and other creatures, but sadly, life is too short. I've spent many sleepless nights lying in bed with my window open, hoping against hope that Kate Beckinsale will come in and bite me, extending my life to where I could continue my research for all eternity as one of the undead. I doubt that her and I will ever meet (restraining order and all) but still, I keep my hopes alive.

I've found that the movie 'Teen Wolf' is (to date) the most accurate portrayal of true lycanthropy........if I only had more time.................
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Old 10-31-2013, 04:17 PM
 
Location: CA, U.S.A.
628 posts, read 1,119,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthfrodo View Post
I myself have spent many years researching werewolves and other creatures, but sadly, life is too short. I've spent many sleepless nights lying in bed with my window open, hoping against hope that Kate Beckinsale will come in and bite me, extending my life to where I could continue my research for all eternity as one of the undead. I doubt that her and I will ever meet (restraining order and all) but still, I keep my hopes alive.

I've found that the movie 'Teen Wolf' is (to date) the most accurate portrayal of true lycanthropy........if I only had more time.................
Thank you at least you are willing to have a conversation about this without getting upset over all of this.~

Some people just refuse to step outside the realm of their experience and are unwilling to even discuss the possibility of such things.~

As a man whom I admire for this piece of wisdom once said, "One sure mark of a fool is to dismiss anything that falls outside his experience as being impossible." - Farengar Secret-Fire from The Elder Scrolls: Skryim (for the PC Video Game)
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Old 10-31-2013, 08:59 PM
 
Location: CA, U.S.A.
628 posts, read 1,119,787 times
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The reason I mention legends such as The Irish Werewolf is because of the portrayal of werewolves in those legends is different from the most "mainstream" of portrayals.~

Whether or not these legends are in fact "true" is not what this thread is about.~

I think many people would agree that the "mindless bloodthristy killing monster werewolf" theme has been done so many times it's become a cliche'.~

In fact it has been done so many times, some people actually believe the only 'correct portrayal' of werewolves in movies is "actually this": which is completely ridiculous as these are simply portrayals of legendary creatures and they can be portrayed in any way the movie creators and directors want.~

I enjoy movies that go away from these early 'stereotypes' of werewolves: where the werewolves in these movies at least have some kind of 'control' over themselves, any murderous behavior is more likely because the person "chose" to murder people and not simply "blamed it on their condition".~
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:05 PM
 
Location: where people are either too stupid to leave or too stuck to move
3,997 posts, read 5,724,435 times
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i do notice that werewolf movies usually involve vampires and they always make the wolf the inferior supernatural creature.. for a while it was okay but now its just tired...

i'd try this new show called "The Originals" they are venturing into the werewolf pack/family and they are usually people who know how to control their nature and nice in comparison to the bloodthirsty murderous vampires...

this maybe childish but Teen Wolf (the tv show) really portrays characters as multi faceted characters
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:12 PM
 
Location: CA, U.S.A.
628 posts, read 1,119,787 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by L'Artiste View Post
i do notice that werewolf movies usually involve vampires and they always make the wolf the inferior supernatural creature.. for a while it was okay but now its just tired...

i'd try this new show called "The Originals" they are venturing into the werewolf pack/family and they are usually people who know how to control their nature and nice in comparison to the bloodthirsty murderous vampires...

this maybe childish but Teen Wolf (the tv show) really portrays characters as multi faceted characters
This is true about Teen Wolf at least to a degree: they still have trouble controlling themselves during their first full moon but they can learn how to control themselves with time and effort even during a full moon.~

I only wish they had more seasons on Netflix: I have no idea other than reading the Wikis what is happening beyond season 2 and please don't tell me as I already spoiled some of it by reading what happens to Jackson in season 3.~

I agree about the Vampires and Werewolves thing, Vampires got a considerable make-over in image over the decades: why not Werewolves?~

And please save it if any one is going to reply to this part of my message and believes "werewolves just can't be sexy": have you seen some werewolf or "werewolf like" movies that have been made including the TV series Teen Wolf?~ They can be REALLY sexy.~

Saying that "werewolves can't be sexy because of their characteristics as creatures" is matter of opinion as there are MANY people who are turned-off by the sight of blood or any of the other "vampire creature characteristics".~
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