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Old 01-09-2017, 09:19 AM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
351 posts, read 139,596 times
Reputation: 524

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I saw Goat on PPV a couple of weeks ago and afterward my wife and I got into a big argument.

For those not familiar with movie (no spoilers), it starts off with a young man (17 or 18) giving the wrong guys a ride (there were two of them), and getting severely beaten and robbed. I'm talking, SEVERLY beaten. Put in the hospital beaten. They took his money, stole his car, and left him in a field.

And the young man didn't defend himself. At all. The guys didn't have guns or any weapons that I could see. The young man didn't really even try to get away. He didn't throw any punches. I didn't raise his hands to ward off punches. He just begged and pleaded and took the beating.

I commented that I found it hard to believe that he didn't make any effort defend himself. My wife said that it's hard to know what you'll do in a stressful situation like that. I said she was wrong. I said I KNOW categorically that I would not have taken a beating like that. I would have fought back. I would have thrown punches. I would have run out into the field. Anything. That's not to say that I wouldn't have also got my ass kicked. But I wouldn't have rolled over and taken that beating.

And the argument was on. It got quite heated. I ended up saying that if she really, truly believed that, in any reality, I would have taken the beating like the guy did in the movie, then she didn't really know me.

I think part of the problem I had with the young man is that he had NO situational awareness. He gives these two sketchy guys he didn't know a ride, in the middle of the night. One of them even commented he was a little surprised that he was giving them a ride. They tell him to drive out to the middle of nowhere, and he does it. The guy seemed completely clueless. The police investigating afterward didn't understand either. They thought it was a drug deal gone wrong because they couldn't figure out why he would give two strangers a ride the way he did.

I think I can understand why my wife thinks the way she does. She's never seen me become physically aggressive. I don't get in fights. But I'm also very physically capable, and she knows it. I work out, a lot, and I'm great shape.

But we've been together for 20 years. She knows me. She knows my personality. It just surprised me that she wouldn't take my word for it that I wouldn't have behaved the way the young man did.

What say you? I'd like to hear from men and women on this. Men...would you have taken the beating? Women, do you think your husbands/significant other would have taken the beating?

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Old 01-09-2017, 10:00 AM
Status: "Most annoying poster on cd - 1986pacecar" (set 27 days ago)
 
2,233 posts, read 1,190,733 times
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I have not seen this show you are speaking of, but I would never just sit there and take a beating. I am female and I would fight to the death to survive a situation like this. Well...first off, I would never give two strangers a ride out to the middle of nowhere. I am constantly aware of my surroundings and people around me. I don't let my guard down at any time.

That is not to say that there are people who wouldn't just give up and not fight back. I'm sure in stressful situations there are people who would stop thinking clearly and just roll over and die.

I am not one of those people.
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Old 01-09-2017, 10:06 AM
 
2,620 posts, read 1,073,772 times
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If you have never been in a particular situation, or even a similar situation, then you have no way of knowing exactly how you will respond. Many of our innate responses are involuntary. Your brain, your subconscious, could completely shut down. You could go into shock. There's no way to know until you've experienced something similar. You may believe you will respond a certain way, but it could be pure movie-fuelled fantasy.
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Old 01-09-2017, 12:28 PM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
351 posts, read 139,596 times
Reputation: 524
Quote:
Originally Posted by FluidFreedom View Post
.....but I would never just sit there and take a beating. I am female and I would fight to the death to survive a situation like this.
^^^^^^ She gets it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hertfordshire View Post
If you have never been in a particular situation, or even a similar situation, then you have no way of knowing exactly how you will respond. Many of our innate responses are involuntary. Your brain, your subconscious, could completely shut down. You could go into shock. There's no way to know until you've experienced something similar. You may believe you will respond a certain way, but it could be pure movie-fuelled fantasy.
That's the argument my wife made. For some people, that might be the case. In my case, it's absolutely, flat wrong. While I've not seen that kind of situation, I have seen very stressful situations. And I've seen what happens to people in bad situations who hesitate. One of my favorite movie quotes from the original Point Break, Bodhi said: "Fear causes hesitation, and hesitation will cause your worst fears to come true."

Do I know exactly how I would respond? Perhaps not. Am I sure I wouldn't take a beating like that? Absolutely. Not one whit of doubt in mind. In that situation, I would be immediately, overwhelmingly aggressive. Some responses are involuntary....including the "fight or flight" response. Wouldn't nature select for individuals who didn't turtle up in the face of danger? Who's brain didn't "shut down" when faced with the hungry lion? It seems most people would either try and run or try and put up some kind of fight. The guy in the movie just laid on the ground and begged and pleaded, which I think might have made the assailants even more aggressive toward him.

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Last edited by Bill790; 01-09-2017 at 01:27 PM..
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Old 01-09-2017, 12:47 PM
 
2,620 posts, read 1,073,772 times
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Arguing my point of movie-fuelled fantasy by presenting a clip from a movie doesn't really help your case. LOL
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Old 01-09-2017, 01:03 PM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
351 posts, read 139,596 times
Reputation: 524
Quote:
Originally Posted by hertfordshire View Post
Arguing my point of movie-fuelled fantasy by presenting a clip from a movie doesn't really help your case. LOL
Copy....point taken!

I included the line because it really is one of my favorite movie lines. And it speaks to my point. Hesitate in a stressful situation, and you're screwed. I wouldn't hesitate.

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Old 01-09-2017, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Austin, TX
2,600 posts, read 4,163,618 times
Reputation: 1975
I have never seen this show either but I know my husband would never just lay down and take a beating. He would fight with every fiber of his being till he was unconscious.

As a female, I would do the same.
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Old 01-09-2017, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Pittsburgh
17,576 posts, read 18,295,096 times
Reputation: 32990
Quote:
Originally Posted by hertfordshire View Post
If you have never been in a particular situation, or even a similar situation, then you have no way of knowing exactly how you will respond. Many of our innate responses are involuntary. Your brain, your subconscious, could completely shut down. You could go into shock. There's no way to know until you've experienced something similar. You may believe you will respond a certain way, but it could be pure movie-fuelled fantasy.
Right, and I was recently listening to a podcast that discussed the "battered wife" defense. For a while, before the psychology was understood, a lot of (predominately male) law enforcement and prosecutors couldn't understand why a woman wouldn't defend herself in the heat of an abusive situation, but rather would wait until later and just snap. People think they're going to act like Rambo in a situtation, but "freeze" is really an addition to "fight or flight."
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Old 01-09-2017, 04:47 PM
 
Location: Pacific Northwest
616 posts, read 170,396 times
Reputation: 1258
I do see both sides here, however, I'd like to think I'd put up a fight to get away from the attackers. Even if I ended up bloody and bruised at the end, I just can't see myself lying there and taking it. I'd be kicking, biting, pulling hair, screaming...just whatever it took to defend myself against them.
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Old 01-10-2017, 10:07 AM
 
Location: Northern Virginia
351 posts, read 139,596 times
Reputation: 524
Quote:
Originally Posted by another_hot-day View Post
I have never seen this show either but I know my husband would never just lay down and take a beating. He would fight with every fiber of his being till he was unconscious.
It kills me that my wife doesn't know that about me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fleetiebelle View Post
People think they're going to act like Rambo in a situtation, but "freeze" is really an addition to "fight or flight."
It's not about being "Rambo." It's about not rolling over and letting somebody do whatever they want to you. It's about not allowing yourself to be brutalized by somebody. I acknowledge that some people would freeze. I'm also saying that I know, categorically, that I would not freeze.

It reminds me of an episode of 6 Feet Under that aired in 2004. David is carjacked, kidnapped, beaten, robbed and brutalized for almost the whole episode. It's very difficult to watch. A little different in that the bad guy (Jake) had a gun. My wife and I got into a similar argument after that episode of SFU. I couldn't believe David would continue to allow it to happen. When he had ample opportunity to fight back (Jake had his back turned, got distracted, etc...). Or run. Or do anything. He kept trying to think his way out of the problem.

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