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I am first and foremost, a rock guy. However, I am also a hip hop fan. In fact, I haven’t been as excited for a music artist as I am right now for Kendrick Lamar. I believe he has brought the art of the concept album back. He is very creative and a master at his craft. I love all his records from Section 80 to DAMN.
I understand how some rock fans loathe hip hop, as they prefer the format of a group of musicians coming together in a studio and recording an album.
Why do you think hip hop has taken over? Could it be the way that hip hop artist release their music lends itself better to the streaming format? Or could it be that music streaming has now expanded the music listening base, whereas in the past you had to go physically to a record store and buy an album? (Notice that physical record consumption (i.e., cd sales) rock still dominates)?
Rock n Roll died when it lost the "roll"... the soul. Sometime in the late 1980s. I think Guns N Roses killed it, TBH. Not much left of it now except the old-timers. And a small number of alternative type bands who've gotten loyal followings.
Hip hop still has an earthy, gutsy feel, it's still street level at the source.
I think rock pretty much has been dead since the early 2000's. The stuff they have had since is just lame, with a few hits here and there. Rock also does not have the diversity of listeners as hip-hop does.
There is also a question of how they classify the music, which can increase/decrease the number of sales; we are talking a wide spectrum of types of music really.
So why it took over? I think;
-more diverse group of listeners
-it is still evolving and in general newer than rock, so that attracts
-they market pretty well
-it is played in clubs everywhere and has a much better beat, and the club thing has the hip-hop trend going on now
-both are diverse groups of types of music, so depending on how to classify, one can increase/decrease in sales
-difficult to determine real number of listeners, which is different than sales, but linked to the fact it has to do with the number of people interested; I have not bought anything in 15 years at least, yet listen for free online.
I am first and foremost, a rock guy. However, I am also a hip hop fan. In fact, I haven’t been as excited for a music artist as I am right now for Kendrick Lamar. I believe he has brought the art of the concept album back. He is very creative and a master at his craft. I love all his records from Section 80 to DAMN.
I understand how some rock fans loathe hip hop, as they prefer the format of a group of musicians coming together in a studio and recording an album.
Why do you think hip hop has taken over? Could it be the way that hip hop artist release their music lends itself better to the streaming format? Or could it be that music streaming has now expanded the music listening base, whereas in the past you had to go physically to a record store and buy an album? (Notice that physical record consumption (i.e., cd sales) rock still dominates)?
There are likely to be multiple, complicated factors. I do have to point out an irony. Rock N' Roll's roots are in southern Jazz or "Rhythm and Blues" music among African Americans back in the segregated era. Elvis Presley's adoption of the genre made it mainstream among white teens of the late 1950s. From there, it just grew.
Ironically, many 70s and 80s rockers and their fans probably disdain Hip Hop music because of its African American "roots". But Rock N' Roll can be traced back to "African American roots" of Jazz and Blues. Even Jerry Lee Lewis, the white piano player of Rock N' Roll, made that obvious in his biographical film.
Racism was far more common among teens of the 1970s and 80s. For that older generation of "Rockers" I can predict the racism behind the scenes that they feel against "Hip Hop" preferred by their children's generation. Many of them are probably horrified from the reality of interracial couples at clubs with Hip Hop music. But those older "white Rockers" would be naive in failing to acknowledge Rock N' Roll's roots in Jazz/Blues from African American musicians. Paul McCartney Explains How the Beatles Wouldn't Exist Without Chuck Berry | Beatles music radio
-difficult to determine real number of listeners, which is different than sales, but linked to the fact it has to do with the number of people interested; I have not bought anything in 15 years at least, yet listen for free online.
Good point. I wonder how, for example, a service like Spotify, which offers a free version, is taken into account in streaming numbers.
[quote=grad_student200;48899363]Racism was far more common among teens of the 1970s and 80s. For that older generation of "Rockers" I can predict the racism behind the scenes that they feel against "Hip Hop" preferred by their children's generation. QUOTE]
This is a really good point too. I was on a flight to New York, and this kid sitting next to me, perhaps 10 years old, Caucasian, from what appears to be a middle class family, was listening on his Ipad Lamar, Asap Rocky, etc....I was surprised, first that his dad would let him listen to that (As much as I like hip hop I would not let a 10 year old listen to some of the songs), and second, that the kid liked that music.
Racism was far more common among teens of the 1970s and 80s. For that older generation of "Rockers" I can predict the racism behind the scenes that they feel against "Hip Hop" preferred by their children's generation. Many of them are probably horrified from the reality of interracial couples at clubs with Hip Hop music. But those older "white Rockers" would be naive in failing to acknowledge Rock N' Roll's roots in Jazz/Blues from African American musicians. Paul McCartney Explains How the Beatles Wouldn't Exist Without Chuck Berry | Beatles music radio
I can attest to your statement about racism being more common among teens of the 1970s and 80s because I never will forget how back in 1970 when I was in 9th grade and went to a predominately all white school, some kids ragged on me and mocked Aretha Franklin's soulful version of Bridge Over Troubled Waters compared to Simon and Garfunkel's.(And which is one of the reasons why I wanted to go a predominately black public school.) However, I think that older "white Rockers" know about Rock N' Roll's roots in African-American Jazz and Blues, therefore, I don't think that ignorance is a factor for these older white Rockers' attitude towards black music.(Even though that ignorance may have existed when they were teens.)
But in saying that... and being African American myself, I don't believe that racism is always the reason for not liking today's Hip Hop music. However, the reason why I think that a lot of older people(be they black, white or whatever) don't like Hip Hop music is because for the most part, Hip Hop music is crude, rude, undignified, and disrespectful. And unfortunately, a lot of younger people wouldn't know this because that is the standard and the social norm that they grew up with.
However, in the late 60s and early 70s, when the United States was changing from institutionalized racism and black people were coming into their own... (i.e. embracing their identity, being proud of their natural hair and letting it grow out, creating new music in the music industry, etc.), there was a strong sense of pride, dignity, and self-respect in the black community, and black music reflected that. And you can hear that in the black music in the 1960s and the 1970s, and even the 1980s... but somewhere in the 1980s when Rap and Hip Hop was starting to take off, the emphasis in black music was more about the hard knocks of the ghetto life. Also, I remember back then that I and a lot of my friends would say that when we were coming up, we were trying to get 'out' of the ghetto(not that I or most of my friends actually grew up in the ghetto), but now, with this new black music, it sounds like people are trying to go back to the ghetto.
But the bottom line is that the reason why a lot of older adults don't like Hip Hop music is because Hip Hip music panders to the lowest common denominator in human beings. Or in other words, instead of appealing to human dignity and human self-respect and the respect of others, this music appeals to the baser aspects of human attitude and human behavior.
Last edited by William Taylor; 07-20-2017 at 02:09 PM..
But the bottom line is that the reason why a lot of older adults don't like Hip Hop music is because Hip Hip music panders to the lowest common denominator in human beings. Or in other words, instead of appealing to human dignity and human self-respect and the respect of others, this music appeals to the baser aspects of human attitude and human behavior.
Hip hop was bigger than rock in the late '80s, before grunge emerged and took back the sceptre.
Rock will reign again.
Grunge steamrolled over hip hop and metal as well. new rock nowadays is very sanitzed and corporate, by the numbers musicThe days of Guns and Roses and Motley Crue raising hell in hotel rooms and writing songs abou it are largely gone, but trends do come and go I agree.
Good news is that the old rock and hip hop have timeless songs that still garner a reaction from fans when heard.
From my point of view, hip hop is not music and never will be.
Rock is.
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