HOA says "Part-time residents may not leave security shutter down." (Naples: townhouses, neighborhoods)

[Vesuvius]

In a neighborhood of both year-round and part-time residents. The community is gated at the entrance, and is partially walled or fenced. There are townhouses and modest size single-family homes. The homes do not back up close to each other, only water or woods, and a good distance from community clubhouse, playground, and pool. Nice spacing throughout.

Some houses have a roll-down hurricane/security shutter installed on the back lanai covered porch alcove where the sliding door is located. They average 8 feet on the townhouses, up to 10-12 feet on the singles. Most of the lanais are screened with pool cages. The hurricane/security screens are fairly unobtrusive, hardly noticeable unless you're right on the homeowners' property. All shutters were installed with HOA Board approval.

There were a couple of break-ins, and a car stolen a few years ago which inspired some neighbors to install security systems, and these shutters. Of course, they are very convenient during hurricanes too, instead of wrestling with large panels.

Many residents close the shutter every night, and open it during the day. Some close the shutter while traveling, as we do, and others close the shutter when they go back to their primary homes in the spring.
We spend summers up north at our lakehouse, and to see the kids & grandkids. We have always had the shutter closed while we're gone.

NOW ~ this HOA board has decided that they don't like the part-time homeowners leaving this single hurricane/security shutter down in their absense. They are trying to institute a rule that states part-time residents may not leave the shutter down while they are not in the home (which seems unfair to single them out), and includes people away from their homes for a long period of time.

I've never heard of an HOA trying to place a rule like this. I've seen these shutters kept down during the off-season throughout Naples for YEARS. We sold our older home of 12 years (where we kept our shutter down in the summer), to move into this newer neighborhood a few years ago. We had great people on our old HOA board who never mentioned a rule like this. They still don't, as told to us by friends on that board who we still visit in that neighborhood. (Actually, I mentioned this proposal to them, and they think it's stupid!)

I understand that, according to the Florida state law, ALL hurricane shutters need to be removed from the windows 7-10 days after a hurricane has passed. We all make sure that's done.

Since we're only talking about one shutter on the back porch, which is used for not only weather, but security, does the HOA have the legal right to create and enforce such a rule? They're threatening violations and fines if this passes.

Or, is there a Florida state / Collier county law anywhere that states an HOA cannot interfere with a homeowner's right to secure their property?

Thank you for any information you can provide!

[markjames68]

HOAs have a lot of power in Florida, and if it's part of the CC&Rs it's something that can even put a lien on your property if fined and not paid. If it's just a "rule", they can still fine you.

Unfortunately with some HOA boards the concept of logic is lost. You have a bunch of cranky retired people with nothing to do and they start thinking of ways to enforce their power. As someone said on the board previously, they're often run by "PIPs" - previously (self-)important people.

In my community my next door neighbor has a roll down fabric shutter covering the lanai and leaves it down when not there. I personally don't have a problem with it (I'm the only person who could potentially see it). But HOA rules are HOA rules.

You mention "they are trying to institute a rule" - if they haven't, I suggest getting a bunch of homeowners banded together NOW to let the board know it's not acceptable. Or to provide guidance as to what IS acceptable.

[MyITGuy]

Originally Posted by Vesuvius

I understand that, according to the Florida state law, ALL hurricane shutters need to be removed from the windows 7-10 days after a hurricane has passed. We all make sure that's done.

Since we're only talking about one shutter on the back porch, which is used for not only weather, but security, does the HOA have the legal right to create and enforce such a rule? They're threatening violations and fines if this passes.

You answered your own question then IMO. ALL - but one, is not ALL.
Note: County/City law cannot supersede state law and this "Security" method could be a violation of fire code as it blocks a major point of ingress (to fight a fire)/egress (Allow occupants to escape a fire).

Yes HOA's do have the legal right to create/enforce such rules in order to maintain the standards of appearances/care that people bought into the community for.

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by MyITGuy

You answered your own question then IMO. ALL - but one, is not ALL.
Note: County/City law cannot supersede state law and this "Security" method could be a violation of fire code as it blocks a major point of ingress (to fight a fire)/egress (Allow occupants to escape a fire).

Yes HOA's do have the legal right to create/enforce such rules in order to maintain the standards of appearances/care that people bought into the community for.

It's a fair point about egress - if the home has only one other exit (front door) aside from the lanai the board could argue that leaving it down also hinders safety.

This is one of things that are challenging about being snowbirds in HOA communities. My personal suggestion if safety is a concern is to install cameras and a security system. But of course, approved as needed by the HOA

[AZgarden]

If your shutter is down for a few months, that might tell thieves that no one is home ??

[Vesuvius]

Originally Posted by markjames68

HOAs have a lot of power in Florida, and if it's part of the CC&Rs it's something that can even put a lien on your property if fined and not paid. If it's just a "rule", they can still fine you.

Unfortunately with some HOA boards the concept of logic is lost. You have a bunch of cranky retired people with nothing to do and they start thinking of ways to enforce their power. As someone said on the board previously, they're often run by "PIPs" - previously (self-)important people.

In my community my next door neighbor has a roll down fabric shutter covering the lanai and leaves it down when not there. I personally don't have a problem with it (I'm the only person who could potentially see it). But HOA rules are HOA rules.

You mention "they are trying to institute a rule" - if they haven't, I suggest getting a bunch of homeowners banded together NOW to let the board know it's not acceptable. Or to provide guidance as to what IS acceptable.

Thanks, Markjames68!
Yes, many of us are banding together to dispute this resolution before it passes. Some of these homeowners have these security shutters, some don't yet have no issue with them and don't like this particular group's push to strong-arm residents. Makes us all wonder, "what's next?" You're 100% right ~ seem to be plenty of "PIPs" here!

[Vesuvius]

Originally Posted by MyITGuy

You answered your own question then IMO. ALL - but one, is not ALL.
Note: County/City law cannot supersede state law and this "Security" method could be a violation of fire code as it blocks a major point of ingress (to fight a fire)/egress (Allow occupants to escape a fire).

Yes HOA's do have the legal right to create/enforce such rules in order to maintain the standards of appearances/care that people bought into the community for.

Yes, good points.
Collier county fire code does specify that the entirety of hurricane shutters must be removed as to not block access to the structure in case of fire.
I'm still searching for the legality of preventing a homeowner from using a HOA approved security shutter for it's intended use. Lots of laws, statutes and codes researched...haven't found one addressing this one yet.

[Vesuvius]

Originally Posted by markjames68

It's a fair point about egress - if the home has only one other exit (front door) aside from the lanai the board could argue that leaving it down also hinders safety.

This is one of things that are challenging about being snowbirds in HOA communities. My personal suggestion if safety is a concern is to install cameras and a security system. But of course, approved as needed by the HOA

For sure ~ great point re: egress.
Since the house is a one story home, it would be easy to lift any other window in the home in case of fire, or certainly the front door.
It's a fine point to search out, especially after never having an issue with this before, and observing this method of securing a home being used in Naples for years. We did install security cameras to watch the home & our lakehouse in our absence.

[Vesuvius]

Hey everyone, thank you for taking the time to respond!

[markjames68]

Originally Posted by Vesuvius

Thanks, Markjames68!
Yes, many of us are banding together to dispute this resolution before it passes. Some of these homeowners have these security shutters, some don't yet have no issue with them and don't like this particular group's push to strong-arm residents. Makes us all wonder, "what's next?" You're 100% right ~ seem to be plenty of "PIPs" here!

To give you an example -

When buying in my community, the neighborhood HOA didn't have a rule against parking in the driveway overnight. Out of all of the neighborhoods as well as the master, only one did (this is a "double gated" community - one to get into the development, one into their neighborhood).

So no problem parking in the driveway, right?

Nope. Rule was passed prohibiting it, set by the master HOA. Started to get grief from the management company. Let the HOA president know, and his answer was "you bought in this community you should know the rules". Of course, it wasn't a rule before I purchased

HOAs that are dominated by retirees tend to be the worst, especially part-time residents for a full-time buyer and vice versa because they look out for themselves. Much of the rules prohibiting something are actually illegal, but who has the time to research and fight them?