Torn between Franklin TN and Dallas (Grapevine Tx) for relocation (Columbia: sales, homes)
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Torn between Franklin TN and Dallas (Grapevine Tx) for relocation
I'm leaving the god forsaken hell hole known as the "Big Apple" to start a family with my spouse. We did a LOT of homework on where to relocate, and the contenders were Dallas TX (Grapevine) and Franklin TN (or proximal areas in Williamson county). We visited both places, and unfortunately LOVE both and are having a very tough time deciding which one we'll move to this summer.
If there is anyone here who has lived in both Dallas TX and Nashville TN, I would love to hear how you think the two places compare, which you prefer and why.
Dallas (specifically Grapevine) and Franklin are very different, but their pros and cons cancel out in such a way that neither is a clear winner. We love the town feel of Franklin, yet it has so many amenities within a short drive that it doesn't feel "small". Dallas has more shopping/dining/employment options since it's a large metro area, but it has a lot of traffic and sprawl. Both are family oriented, have good schools, friendly people, and wonderful homes to start a family in...
I'm leaving the god forsaken hell hole known as the "Big Apple" to start a family with my spouse. We did a LOT of homework on where to relocate, and the contenders were Dallas TX (Grapevine) and Franklin TN (or proximal areas in Williamson county). We visited both places, and unfortunately LOVE both and are having a very tough time deciding which one we'll move to this summer.
If there is anyone here who has lived in both Dallas TX and Nashville TN, I would love to hear how you think the two places compare, which you prefer and why.
Dallas (specifically Grapevine) and Franklin are very different, but their pros and cons cancel out in such a way that neither is a clear winner. We love the town feel of Franklin, yet it has so many amenities within a short drive that it doesn't feel "small". Dallas has more shopping/dining/employment options since it's a large metro area, but it has a lot of traffic and sprawl. Both are family oriented, have good schools, friendly people, and wonderful homes to start a family in...
What to do, what to do?
I stayed in south dallas for about a year, and i absolutely loved it. The thing i liked most is that the people in dallas where generally alot nicer then what i am used to seeing around here missouri. Theres alot of opportunities in dallas and a lot more comming. almost everything is generally cheaper in dallas and the jobs pay far better than what i've seen in the MO. I never really had a problem in dallas, especially stayin in my own bussiness. The only thing i did not like about dallas was the traffic, but if you get used to it, learn the times and side routes you will be good, but the traffic is some of the worse in the country.
Franklin hands down, but I can't really pinpoint one specific reason. Dallas has a lot of sprawl and I can't really distinguish the suburbs from each other because they all seem very similar to me.
Franklin is well managed and seems to have charm of its own without having to rely on Nashville, although it is great to have Nashville and its amenitities so close by. The conspicuous consumption doesn't seem as bad in Franklin as Dallas.
A big thing to consider is schools. As much as I think our state legislature is crazy (legislation this week to require students not to wear baggy pants--that could have been left to local schools and I didn't realize it was a problem inside of the schools since most have dress codes) I also think this administration and the last administration are really raising the bar on education so that TN can start to compete with wealthier states. The standards have improved dramatically in the last few years with the adoption of the core curriculum. My mother teaches in Texas and it seems every year her district is cutting more and more teachers/support/staff. We haven't experienced that in TN.
One thing I still can't grasp is our taxes. Both Texas and TN don't have income tax and have fairly high sales tax. However, our property taxes in TN are LOW. Property taxes in Texas run about 1-3% of a home's value every year. TN property taxes are incredibly low when you consider we have no income tax.
I moved from Dallas to Nashville last year. I had lived in Nashville for 6 years in the late 90's to early 2000's and we prefer Nashville. If you grew up in the Northeast (I grew up in Massachusetts), the difference is more stark in Nashville than in Dallas, especially in regards to religion. It is in relative terms "in your face" in the South. That is, up north, religion is very private but in the South, its the centerpiece of life. At first it was a shock but after a while, you will either embrace it as we did, or remain uncomfortable. I like Nashville because it isnt enormous but big enough to have everything and if you need a big city, Atlanta is 4 hrs and Chicago is a 7 hour drive. Texas was friendly but I would call it polite friendly where as I find Nashville to be genuinely friendly. My mom just visited from Mass and noticed that as well.
If I could decribe Dallas in one word, its vanilla. Yes it has everything but I found Dallas to be dull, cookie cutter cities with strip malls of the Best Buys etc. My mom's one word to describe Dallas was highways. Its so massive (the metroplex is about 3500 sq miles) it takes an hour to get everywhere. Shopping is top notch with the Galleria and Northpark. After about 3 years, we just decided we would like to come back to Nashville. We didnt hate Dallas and could live there fine if we had to but just didnt love it.
One other note, Nashville is hot but Dallas is hot as H-E-double hockey stick. its around 100 from end of May well into September. Its in the low 50's in the winter (leaves fell on our trees in early December and come back early February).
Dallas definitely has the transportation advantage with DFW but Dallas traffic is as you would expect for a place with 6 million people. It took me an hour 15 to an hour and a half to go 23 miles on 12 lane highways to work.
Dallas advantages:
- Bigger city = more of most things (shopping, restaurants, museums, sports, etc.)
- DFW has direct flights pretty much everywhere in the country and to a number of international locations. Flights out of BNA (Nashville) are very limited. We need to fly to Boston in a couple of months. No direct flights mean that it will be an all-day event through Chicago or Atlanta. Not a big deal if you rarely travel by air, but it can be a hassle.
- Dallas has a small but expanding rail system. (I actually tried the system and thought it was pretty pathetic compared to NYC, but they do have one and it might get better. Nashville does not have one and has no plans to build one.)
- Dallas is close to Fort Worth, which I actually think is a really cool city. In fact, if you're considering Dallas, you might take another look at Fort Worth. It's got a real Western feeling, but also awesome cultural amenities (museums, concert hall, zoo, parks, etc.)
- Milder winters. Flat roads mean driving is less treacherous if the weather does get bad.
- Better ethnic food
Nashville advantages
- Less traffic, although rush hour is still really rough given the population growth Nashville has experienced and will continue to experience.
- Friendlier feeling (stereotype, but often true, depending on where you go)
- More country music and related culture (if that's your thing, Dallas can't compete)
- Better 'American' and BBQ food
- More beautiful scenery (if you like forested hills -- disadvantage to the hills is that driving is a nightmare on the rare occasions we have ice or snow in winter)
- Better park system
- Cooler summers (still MUCH hotter than NYC, but our high temps might be in the mid-90s when Dallas is over 100. But we compensate for that with colder winters)
We looked at both areas when relocating out of NYC a couple of years ago. I'm happy we chose Nashville, but I think we could have been in happy in Dallas or Fort Worth too. I think you will have less culture shock if you move to DFW as it is one of the 4-5 biggest cities in the country. I'd pick Nashville if you want a more relaxed, laid back mid-sized city lifestyle.
I'm leaving the god forsaken hell hole known as the "Big Apple" to start a family with my spouse. We did a LOT of homework on where to relocate, and the contenders were Dallas TX (Grapevine) and Franklin TN (or proximal areas in Williamson county). We visited both places, and unfortunately LOVE both and are having a very tough time deciding which one we'll move to this summer.
If there is anyone here who has lived in both Dallas TX and Nashville TN, I would love to hear how you think the two places compare, which you prefer and why.
Dallas (specifically Grapevine) and Franklin are very different, but their pros and cons cancel out in such a way that neither is a clear winner. We love the town feel of Franklin, yet it has so many amenities within a short drive that it doesn't feel "small". Dallas has more shopping/dining/employment options since it's a large metro area, but it has a lot of traffic and sprawl. Both are family oriented, have good schools, friendly people, and wonderful homes to start a family in...
What to do, what to do?
My family lives in Dallas (Grapevine/Bedford area) and I live in the Nashville area. I'll start by talking about infrastructure and population since that's so important to me now (being stuck in daily Nashville work traffic for upwards of an hour each way has me beyond frustrated). I'll speak of restaurants and neighborhoods in a little while and can answer questions if you have them.
Dallas is a very large city (9th in the US for population), but it doesn't always feel that way. It's a big city that has that can have that small town feel in certain areas. Its highway infrastructure is beyond impressive and while there is a crap-ton of construction going on (they are currently involved in the largest and most expensive highway construction project in the country as a result of the stimulus money), they are really planning for the future. If there's a wreck on one highway, there are two to three more to get you where you need to go.
Nashville is smaller compared to Dallas (25th in US for population) and always has that small town feel which I love. The majority of people here are very friendly and their isn't as much road rage as there is in Dallas (I just got back from Dallas two weeks ago and got cut off and flicked off no fewer than 20 times). One thing that kills Nashville for me is it's incompetent infrastructure leaders. We might have the dumbest people in office out of any city in the country. We are ranked 7th in most dangerous traffic and 2nd in time wasted in the car. And there doesn't appear to be any improvement in the near future, regardless of what people say. Construction projects take YEARS to complete, and the highways that need it most (40, 24, 440, 65N) are miles from being started. I don't consider expanding a highway one lane here and there good infrastructure changes. Dallas is having a highways expanding to upwards of 10 lanes each way at certain spots! That's planning for the future. Nashville moving from two to three lanes on 440 is stupid. That's just fixing what should have been done 10 years ago, and avoiding the current and future issue.
My family lives in Dallas (Grapevine/Bedford area) and I live in the Nashville area. I'll start by talking about infrastructure and population since that's so important to me now (being stuck in daily Nashville work traffic for upwards of an hour each way has me beyond frustrated). I'll speak of restaurants and neighborhoods in a little while and can answer questions if you have them.
Dallas is a very large city (9th in the US for population), but it doesn't always feel that way. It's a big city that has that can have that small town feel in certain areas. Its highway infrastructure is beyond impressive and while there is a crap-ton of construction going on (they are currently involved in the largest and most expensive highway construction project in the country as a result of the stimulus money), they are really planning for the future. If there's a wreck on one highway, there are two to three more to get you where you need to go.
Nashville is smaller compared to Dallas (25th in US for population) and always has that small town feel which I love. The majority of people here are very friendly and their isn't as much road rage as there is in Dallas (I just got back from Dallas two weeks ago and got cut off and flicked off no fewer than 20 times). One thing that kills Nashville for me is it's incompetent infrastructure leaders. We might have the dumbest people in office out of any city in the country. We are ranked 7th in most dangerous traffic and 2nd in time wasted in the car. And there doesn't appear to be any improvement in the near future, regardless of what people say. Construction projects take YEARS to complete, and the highways that need it most (40, 24, 440, 65N) are miles from being started. I don't consider expanding a highway one lane here and there good infrastructure changes. Dallas is having a highways expanding to upwards of 10 lanes each way at certain spots! That's planning for the future. Nashville moving from two to three lanes on 440 is stupid. That's just fixing what should have been done 10 years ago, and avoiding the current and future issue.
With that said, I am mainly speaking of rush hour traffic. Dallas probably has more traffic overall as in weekends and non-rush hours. It takes me around the same time to get downtown from both Franklin and Grapevine on a Saturday.
Infrastructure: Dallas wins with no question for work days. Maybe Nashville on the weekend. If you choose to work (or not work) in Franklin and not Nashville, you won't have to worry about what I typed.
There are more restaurants in Dallas, but that's because it's bigger. Franklin has tons of original and quaint dining options though, as does Nashville and its surrounding cities. I do feel like Nashville has more local choices within a convenient driving distance though so I'd lean towards Nashville for dining.
Entertainment definitely depends on your style. Dallas has the NHL, NBA, NFL, MLB, and MLS. Nashville has NFL and NHL. However, Nashville is more music based so if you are into the music scene, Nashville without a doubt.
A big thing to consider is schools. As much as I think our state legislature is crazy (legislation this week to require students not to wear baggy pants--that could have been left to local schools and I didn't realize it was a problem inside of the schools since most have dress codes) I also think this administration and the last administration are really raising the bar on education so that TN can start to compete with wealthier states. The standards have improved dramatically in the last few years with the adoption of the core curriculum. My mother teaches in Texas and it seems every year her district is cutting more and more teachers/support/staff. We haven't experienced that in TN.
Thanks, this is actually extremely important to us and it's good to hear TN proactive with the education programs, the state has a lot of appeal and improving schools is a great way to attract more families not to mention lay a good foundation for higher education- that leads to more opportunities. It's not reassuring to know that Texas is having some problems with their system, like TN the quality of the schools can very greatly depending on which neighborhood you're in but it makes me wonder: if we pick a good school district, how long will it last before the cutbacks start to downgrade the stronger districts?
We're fed-up with the dense urban atmosphere and we're willing to sacrifice shopping/dining choices for a nice place with a good quality of life. With Dallas we'd be giving up less amenities and have more employment opportunity (which is not immediately important), but the trade off is traffic, ugly sprawl, and denser neighborhoods with less land. Believe it or not the DFW airport isn't as much of a boon- it's not a Delta hub, and my spouse is still looking at connecting flights unless his assignement is in a city with a major airport. Nashville has less direct flights but it's soooo close to several delta hubs (Atlanta, Detroit, Cincinnati) and there's direct flights to La Guardia aiport. Do when you think of it that way, again neither city airport has much of an advantage for our situation.
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone. Every good aspect and bad aspect of each city has equal weight, every perk gets cancelled out somehow. I'm slightly leaning towards TN but not by a landslide- likewise my spouse seems to be leaning towards Dallas ever so slightly. The cooler summer, green hill country, change of seasons in TN is a very nice perk. We're not fans of summer heat, and we LOVE winter but none of the states in the northeast have reasonable taxes so we can't stay.
Then there's the problem that we'd probably go insane if we have to endure another year in NYC. We need to get out for our own good.
Thanks, this is actually extremely important to us and it's good to hear TN proactive with the education programs, the state has a lot of appeal and improving schools is a great way to attract more families not to mention lay a good foundation for higher education- that leads to more opportunities. It's not reassuring to know that Texas is having some problems with their system, like TN the quality of the schools can very greatly depending on which neighborhood you're in but it makes me wonder: if we pick a good school district, how long will it last before the cutbacks start to downgrade the stronger districts?
State revenue is up. I think it speaks volumes that there weren't massive cuts over the last 4 years in k-12 spending when the state and counties were struggling because of the economic downturn. No mass lay-offs in any of the area counties as far as I'm aware. Closest thing was Columbia County came close to not starting the school year 2 years ago because they couldn't come up with a budget but there was a last minute compromise.
A lot of the counties take pride in their schools, especially Williamson. The schools are beautiful and full of volunteers. They could always use more money and there was a bit of a debate last fall when the Super said he wanted to add foreign language instruction at the elementary level (particularly Mandarin). The home values are high in Williamson because of the schools and most residents realize this and are willing to fund the school. That said WC doesn't have a lot of tax increases. They just increased taxes last year for the first time in about 10 years (I'm not positive on that number but we definitely don't have tax increases yearly).
School quality varies greatly in TN and it mostly comes down to demographics, just like the rest of the country.
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Torn between Franklin TN and Dallas (Grapevine Tx) for relocation
