Am I crazy to uproot my family from Chicago & move to Nashville? (Hendersonville: high school, ferry)

[TNRyan23]

Originally Posted by MantaRay

I've seen the Indian Lake development. I haven't seen where those "mega amount of houses and apartments in the area" are going to have pedestrian-friendly connections to the site. It's nice and all, but it doesn't incorporate the surrounding residential neighborhoods the way Providence does.

I don't want to hi-jack the thread into a Hendersonville vs. Mt. Juliet thread, Tell me what neighborhoods are incorporated with being "pedestrian-friendly" ? I know of one area that's considered as a 55+ community that's about a mile or so behind Target, JC Penny, ect.. I don't call a 1-2 mile walk as being pedestrian friendly and this is a thread from a few years back that I even posted in...

http://www.city-data.com/forum/nashv...estions-2.html

talking about the poor quality of the houses they slapped together in Providence.

Originally Posted by MantaRay

I was just on the riverfront in downtown Nashville a couple weekends ago. I saw plenty of sidewalks. I also saw this big pedestrian bridge stretching across the Cumberland River that was formerly the Shelby Street bridge. And from Germantown down through Bicentennial Mall down to the riverfront, guess what- sidewalks. Seems like I heard something about a Shelby Bottoms Park and pedestrian bridge at Two Rivers. Once Mt. Juliet gets its greenway system built out, it will be for me a matter of walking out of the front door of my Providence home, biking the greenway to the Metro Star station on Division St., taking the Star downtown, and biking wherever else I want to from there- with all the sidewalks and pedestrian bridges. That sounds pretty pro-pedestrian to me.

OF COURSE Downtown has sidewalks, What major U.S. city doesn't have sidewalks ?!? Once you get to suburbs like Madison, Inglewood, Mt. Juliet, Hendersonville, ect, ect you'll see sidewalks on the main roads like Gallatin Rd. but nowhere else. The sidewalks near schools seem to die about 50 feet past the schools property. Thank you for the lessons on the pedestrian bridge, if not for the 70 Titans games I've attended where I had to cross that bridge and your words of wisdom, I would have never known about it. Also, I know all too well about Shelby Park, When I first moved to Nashville my girlfriend and I were propositioned to "swing" several times at that park.

Originally Posted by MantaRay

As far as the Metro Star, we'll just have to see what becomes of it. I say as the Nashville metro area grows, it will generate more ridership. I used to drive to downtown Nashville every day years ago and pay for parking, and even all those years ago it cost me more than $41 a month in gas and parking to do that. And that's not even considering the cost of maintenance on a vehicle due to the miles driven back and forth to downtown. So when all the costs are considered, no, I don't think it would be cheaper to just drive. And unless gas prices stay where they are and never go up any more, I don't really see that changing.

Riding the Metro Star would be fine and well for people that work on 1st or 2nd ave. Riding the Metro Star would however suck for people that work in West End or on any other side of Nashville. It would be cheaper and more time efficient to just drive rather then catch the Metro Star downtown then catch a bus, then transfer, ect, ect.. PLUS, according to their website http://www.musiccitystar.org/tickets...html#schedules The last train from Downtown Mon-Thursday is 5:45pm, What if you rode the train but want to get together with friends after work on a whim ?

Originally Posted by MantaRay

Providence is the best new shopping area in the entire metro, with the exception of The Avenue in Murfreesboro.

That's YOUR opinion.

Originally Posted by MantaRay

Great, then it's a lot like the Mt. Juliet vicinity with Percy Priest Lake and parks like Long Hunter State Park and Hermitage Public Use Area, each of which has hiking/bike trails/greenways in its vicinity

It's not like that at all, Hendersonville sits on Old Hickory Lake. You can walk to the lake from most parts of Hendersonville unlike Mt. Juliet where you have to drive to Hermitage or Antioch.

Originally Posted by MantaRay

I don't buy into the whole "best schools" thing anyway. I did a comprehensive write-up on these boards before about why the concept is misleading, but I'll summarize here for the sake of time. The "best schools concept" is built on aggregate standardized test scores, which 1) on the one hand have been PROVEN (as in with evidence) not to be reliable predictors of collegiate success (they are just political tools for schools to give themselves a report card), and 2) only reflect the percentage of students with actively involved parents. If two schools have 100 students and one has 80 with actively involved parents and the other has 95, the school with 95 is going to have higher average test scores and be deemed "better" than the one with 80. But those 80 students perform on standardized tests just as well as the 95- the 95 don't really have an advantage by going to that school, the 80 have just as good a shot at getting into good universities because they scored just as well as the 95. It has nothing to do with the school building or the teachers or the principal. And again those scores don't equate to collegiate success anyway. Parental involvement DOES, and the same student with the same parents has that whether he goes to the school with the 80 or with the 95 students with actively involved parents. And collegiate success is the whole point of the secondary schools process anyway, and those 80 have the same shot as the 95. Any of those kids will be ok running the city in the future.

So based on the data and the reality, I don't put a whole lot of stock in the "School X is better than School Y because of higher standardized test scores" nonsense. I would be even less compelled to once I'm retired. Both areas have schools wherein students can do equally as well scholastically and in getting accepted into good universities if they have actively involved parents.

Having said all that, I can see where Hendersonville is similar to Mt. Juliet. But the idea that Hendersonville is 100% better than Mt. Juliet is pretty out there. I stand a better chance of being able to walk from my home to the store and to retail in Providence, and I'll stand a better chance of being able to walk out of my front door with my bike and get to downtown Nashville from Mt. Juliet, whether that's biking to the Metro Star and taking it downtown or biking the back roads to the Stones River Greenway and then biking downtown from there. That's pedestrian quality of life in my book. That's not Hendersonville being 100% better than Mt. Juliet.

Tell you what, Put your kids (if you have any) In a Metro school and talk to me about the greatschools rating.

One of the biggest reasons I moved to Hendersonville to begin with was because I wasn't happy with the education my son was getting at Rutland Elementary in Mt. Juliet (about 1 mile from Providence) My options were to return to Madison or East Nashville and put my son in a Metro School, or move to Sumner County and put him in what is IMHO, The BEST school district in Middle Tennessee. That was a no brainer.

I have nothing against Mt. Juliet. I hope you love it there and have a great life man ! I just have to laugh when someone compares Mt. Juliet to Hendersonville.

I would put Hendersonville right up there with Brentwood, Franklin, and Green Hills as far as quality of life.

[MantaRay]

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

I don't want to hi-jack the thread into a Hendersonville vs. Mt. Juliet thread, Tell me what neighborhoods are incorporated with being "pedestrian-friendly" ? I know of one area that's considered as a 55+ community that's about a mile or so behind Target, JC Penny, ect.. I don't call a 1-2 mile walk as being pedestrian friendly and this is a thread from a few years back that I even posted in...

Then apparently you aren't aware of the options in neighborhoods if you just know of the 55+ community. So let me take a moment to inform you. There is the Autumn Ridge neighborhood of 2,600 to 3,400 square foot homes. There is the Arbor Springs neighborhood of 1,900 to 3,000 square foot homes. There is Bradford Park which offers vintage style homes of 1,377 to 1,833 square feet. There's Legacy Park, offering 1,600 to 2,200 square foot homes and a neighborhood park. And there is The Village, which offers the rear facing garages and neighborhood park. Most of the homes in those neighborhoods have front porches as well. There are also a couple of townhome developments and apartment complexes in Providence. Those neighborhoods are about half a mile or less from Providence Marketplace. AND there is Lake Providence, the 55+ community which was the "one" you're aware of. All of these neighborhoods are connected via sidewalks and trails to the Providence Marketplace and are thus an easy walk or bike ride to the Providence Marketplace. An easy walk or bike ride to the retail section on trails specifically built for walking and biking = pedestrian friendly.

The last time I walked half a mile it took about 10 minutes casually walking and 8 minutes at a decent pace. The last time I biked a mile I was finished before the song stopped playing. An easy walk or bike ride to the retail section on trails specifically built for walking and biking = pedestrian friendly. Providence = pedestrian friendly. And once Mt. Juliet gets its greenway built from Providence to its developing town center and along Division St., all of Mt. Juliet will = pedestrian friendly.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

OF COURSE Downtown has sidewalks, What major U.S. city doesn't have sidewalks ?!?

I wasn't the one saying Nashville is the land of no sidewalks.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

Once you get to suburbs like Madison, Inglewood, Mt. Juliet, Hendersonville, ect, ect you'll see sidewalks on the main roads like Gallatin Rd. but nowhere else.

You might only see sidewalks in Hendersonville along main roads like Gallatin Rd., but I assure you that those neighborhoods I mentioned in Providence have sidewalks in them AND connecting them to each other AND to the Providence Marketplace. Hence the pedestrian friendliness. And all those roads are not main roads. Mt. Juliet's main road, N. Mt. Juliet Rd. and S. Mt. Juliet Rd., has sidewalks as well. So whatever the state of Hendersonville, in Mt. Juliet, you'll see sidewalks on the main roads AND somewhere else too, particularly if you live in Providence.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

The sidewalks near schools seem to die about 50 feet past the schools property. Thank you for the lessons on the pedestrian bridge, if not for the 70 Titans games I've attended where I had to cross that bridge and your words of wisdom, I would have never known about it. Also, I know all too well about Shelby Park, When I first moved to Nashville my girlfriend and I were propositioned to "swing" several times at that park.

I mentioned Shelby Bottoms Park. Shelby Park already existed before Shelby Bottoms Park was created. Nonetheless, the greenways and pedestrian bridges and parks which connect Percy Priest Dam to downtown Nashville is within 6 miles of Providence, provinding the area's most impressive and extensive pedestrian bikeways in the entire metro within a stone's throw of Mt. Juliet. Plain and simple, the pedestrian connection from Mt. Juliet to downtown Nashville is superior to every other Nashville suburb outside the Briley Pkwy/I440 loops save Hermitage.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

Riding the Metro Star would be fine and well for people that work on 1st or 2nd ave. Riding the Metro Star would however suck for people that work in West End or on any other side of Nashville. It would be cheaper and more time efficient to just drive rather then catch the Metro Star downtown then catch a bus, then transfer, ect, ect.. PLUS, according to their website http://www.musiccitystar.org/tickets...html#schedules The last train from Downtown Mon-Thursday is 5:45pm, What if you rode the train but want to get together with friends after work on a whim ?

Then you'll get to find out how much of a friend your "friends" really are- if they'll give you a ride home. Furthermore, driving a car is usally going to be quicker than public transport obviously, but cheaper after gas and parking and maintenance costs- I wouldn't count on it. When I retire and move to Mt. Juliet, riding the Metro Star to hang out downtown definitely won't suck for me. And as somebody who went to high school in downtown Nashville, getting to West End won't be a problem if I feel like going to hang out at the Parthenon.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

That's YOUR opinion.

Likewise, Hendersonville being 100% better than Mt. Juliet is yours.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

It's not like that at all, Hendersonville sits on Old Hickory Lake. You can walk to the lake from most parts of Hendersonville unlike Mt. Juliet where you have to drive to Hermitage or Antioch.

You can walk to the lake from Indian Lake Village if you want to take a chance on hanging out in some stranger's back yard. Otherwise, it's a little over 2 miles down Indian Lake Blvd. and Gallatin Rd. to Drakes Creek Park. Unless you live on the lake in Hendersonville, you're driving to the lake, especially if you've got a motor boat or kayak. Where's the closest boat launch to Indian Lakes Village? There are at least two within 6 miles of Providence- one at Hermitage Public Use Area, one at Long Hunter State Park. Hendersonville doesn't offer better lake access for the boat owner versus Mt. Juliet unless you own a lakefront home. It especially doesn't if you're looking at living in the Indian Lakes or Providence developments for the walkable proximity to retail.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

Tell you what, Put your kids (if you have any) In a Metro school and talk to me about the greatschools rating.

A metro school isn't going to tell me whether standardized test scores are a good predictor of collegiate success or not. Studies of COLLEGES will. Such studies have shown that high standardized test scores are not an accurate predictor. The reason- schools begin to teach to the test, and teaching to the test doesn't guarantee a student has grasped the principles necessary to do college level work. That isn't just my say-so, that's the result of actual investigative study on the college level. Schools can try to make themselves feel as good as they wish, data is data and reality is reality and the reality is that the data shows that test scores don't predict collegiate success, so it's really a bogus measure of how well a school prepares its students for collegiate level work.

Originally Posted by TNRyan23

I have nothing against Mt. Juliet. I hope you love it there and have a great life man ! I just have to laugh when someone compares Mt. Juliet to Hendersonville.

Wasn't it you who broached the comparison in the first place? Does this mean you were laughing at yourself? Anyway, when I'm biking the Stones River Greenway to downtown Nashville along the most extensive (and scenic) series of greenways and pedestrian bridges in all of the Nashville area, I'll feel good in having chosen Mt. Juliet, knowing I wouldn't be able to realistically do the same thing from the Hendersonville area. At least not without taking my life into my hands by trying to dodge traffic on my bike. I'm not about to try biking down Gallatin Rd. to get to downtown Nashville. That ride is dangerous and not so scenic. The ride from Percy Priest Dam, not so dangerous and incredibly scenic. The 440 acres of Indian Lake Village is nice, but I'll take the 1,000 acres and growing of Providence.

I have nothing against Hendersonville. I just have to laugh when somebody first says Hendersonville is 100% better than Mt. Juliet and follows that with saying they have to laugh when someone makes that comparison, as if they forgot it was they who made that comparison in the first place.

[vivelafrance]

From Indian Lake to the Park at Drakes Creek on the Drakes Creek portion of Old Hickory Lake is several hundred feet....not miles. Look at a map of Hendersonville...the vast majority of the city lies on 2 large peninsulas of Old Hickory Lake, you are hardly more than a mile from the lake at ANY point in the city. In Mt. Juliet you have to drive 6 miles to a boat dock...you said it yourself....there's one about 1 mile from Indian Lake and tons of Lake Front park space within a couple hundred feet!


Anyway, it's pointless to argue about how "sprawly" a development is when it is a NEW development on previously unused land. It's all sprawl. The type of developments that really make a difference are redevelopments which take land that is already in use and make it better. An example of this would be the Town Center Project of Hendersonville.

The Streets of Indian Lake/Indian Lake Village and Providence are basically the same development with different names. Providence came first and Indian Lake is still building. If you look behind the Cinema at Indian Lake you will see posters advertising condos and live/work buildings with offices on the first floor and residences above. Kennesaw Farms has the same plan...town center, live/work office park, condos/townhomes, apartments, single family homes with rear facing garages. There are others too. The Glenbrook Retail Center has many of the same store types as Providence with a different layout.

[Pimpy]

One of the biggest problems with Mount Juliet is that there is NO nightlife there. To do anything on a Friday or Saturday night, you have to drive to downtown or at least Hermitage, where the night spots are questionable at best.

Hendersonville has Anchor High Marina, which stays PACKED on the weekends, especially in the summers. There is also Barefoot Charlie's, which is gaining in popularity and always has a packed parking lot on Friday and Saturday nights. Even Brixx, which stays open until 1am every night, and Buffalo Wild Wings (opening in a couple weeks) beats anything MJ has to offer. For a true "night on the town," a trip to Lower Broad or 2nd Avenue is still necessary, but at least there are options in Hendersonville for those weekends when you don't want to deal with the hassles of going downtown (parking, cover charges, tourists, fights, etc.)

Regarding the greenway system connecting Mt. Juliet to downtown. It sounds nice and all, but come on, MJ is 20 miles from downtown. How often are people going to take a casual stroll or even a bike ride all the way to 2nd Avenue? If you're in the physical condition of the average American, you won't even make it all the way, and even if you do, you'll be too tired to do anything when you get there.

[MantaRay]

Originally Posted by vivelafrance

From Indian Lake to the Park at Drakes Creek on the Drakes Creek portion of Old Hickory Lake is several hundred feet....not miles.

The site is on Indian Lake Blvd at Vietnam Veterans Pkwy, on the southern edge of VV Pkwy. Drakes Creek Park where the lake begins is at the corner of Gallatin Rd. & Cherokee Rd. (north of that point at the baseball fields it's just a creek, not a lake) It's about 1/3 mile from the park/tennis courts just to Indian Lake Blvd. and then about 1 2/3 mile up Indian Lake Blvd. to the site just before VV Pkwy.

Do this- type in Callender Ct. & Indian Lake Blvd as a starting location and Gallatin Rd. & Cherokee Rd. as an ending destination in the map site and see how far it tells you the distance is.

Originally Posted by vivelafrance

Look at a map of Hendersonville...the vast majority of the city lies on 2 large peninsulas of Old Hickory Lake, you are hardly more than a mile from the lake at ANY point in the city. In Mt. Juliet you have to drive 6 miles to a boat dock...you said it yourself....there's one about 1 mile from Indian Lake and tons of Lake Front park space within a couple hundred feet!

Where's the boat getting put in? Callender Ct. & Indian Lake Blvd. to Drakes Creek Park at the tennis courts on the lake is 2 miles, but there doesn't appear to be a boat slip there. Where's the boat slip- in what park, on what road? Let's do a google map or live search map distance search and find out if it's feet or miles to drive from Callender Ct. & Indian Lake Blvd. to whatever Hendersonville boat slip you find.

Originally Posted by vivelafrance

The Streets of Indian Lake/Indian Lake Village and Providence are basically the same development with different names. Providence came first and Indian Lake is still building. If you look behind the Cinema at Indian Lake you will see posters advertising condos and live/work buildings with offices on the first floor and residences above. Kennesaw Farms has the same plan...town center, live/work office park, condos/townhomes, apartments, single family homes with rear facing garages. There are others too. The Glenbrook Retail Center has many of the same store types as Providence with a different layout.

Absolutely, and my point was never that Hendersonville is bad. My point was to dispute the notion that Hendersonville has Mt. Juliet beat 100%.

[MantaRay]

Originally Posted by Pimpy

One of the biggest problems with Mount Juliet is that there is NO nightlife there. To do anything on a Friday or Saturday night, you have to drive to downtown or at least Hermitage, where the night spots are questionable at best.

None of the suburbs compete with Nashville's nightlife. Hermitage, Mt. Juliet, Hendersonville, Franklin- none of them have the action of the Nashville core. They all have that same "issue." Want sympony- gotta go to Schemmerhorn. Want a play- gotta go to TPAC. Want an awesome 4th celebration- gotta go to the riverfront. Want a Predators game- gotta go to the Gaylord Center. Want a Nashville Sounds game- gotta go to Fort Negley. Wanna watch Vandy play Tennessee- gotto go down to West End. If nightlife was my big concern, then give me a townhouse or refurbished single family home in Germantown or a townhouse or condo near Centenniel Park and call it a day. Driving to decent nightlife activities is an automatic when you decide to live in the burbs. Unless you're content with the local Barefoot Charlies or Buffalo Wild Wings (which to me is no subsitute for symphonies and plays and hockey and baseball and concerts and 2nd Street and West End but to others may be.)

[Pimpy]

Originally Posted by MantaRay

None of the suburbs compete with Nashville's nightlife. Hermitage, Mt. Juliet, Hendersonville, Franklin- none of them have the action of the Nashville core. They all have that same "issue." Want sympony- gotta go to Schemmerhorn. Want a play- gotta go to TPAC. Want an awesome 4th celebration- gotta go to the riverfront. Want a Predators game- gotta go to the Gaylord Center. Want a Nashville Sounds game- gotta go to Fort Negley. Wanna watch Vandy play Tennessee- gotto go down to West End. If nightlife was my big concern, then give me a townhouse or refurbished single family home in Germantown or a townhouse or condo near Centenniel Park and call it a day. Driving to decent nightlife activities is an automatic when you decide to live in the burbs. Unless you're content with the local Barefoot Charlies or Buffalo Wild Wings (which to me is no subsitute for symphonies and plays and hockey and baseball and concerts and 2nd Street and West End but to others may be.)

Did you read my entire post or just the first paragraph? I said exactly what you are saying, namely that a true "night on the town" requires a trip into Nashville.

However, for those weekends when you want to go out, listen to some live music, socialize, enjoy an adult beverage and meet pretty girls WITHOUT having to deal with the hassles of downtown Nashville, Hendersonville at least offers several options. Mount Juliet, from what I have seen, does not.

[vivelafrance]

Even if it's 2 mile from Indian Lake to the closest boat dock, that's still 4 miles closer than Providence. Plus MANY residential developments in Hendersonville are actually on the lake or within one mile of a boat dock. The center of Mt. Juliet is pretty far from the lake, in comparison. Really, just look at a map of the two cities...

Hendersonville is even called "The City By the Lake" and advertisements for residential developments in Nashville call it "Nashville's North Shore." There is no comparison between the amount of Lake Front Property/Parks/Boat Docks/etc. between Hendersonville and Mt. Juliet. Mt. Juliet is a short Drive to two different lakes, but you could definitely not easily walk or bike to both lakes in a short distance. This is not the case in Hendersonville.

[MantaRay]

Originally Posted by Pimpy

However, for those weekends when you want to go out, listen to some live music, socialize, enjoy an adult beverage and meet pretty girls WITHOUT having to deal with the hassles of downtown Nashville, Hendersonville at least offers several options. Mount Juliet, from what I have seen, does not.

They both are pretty weak options to me for an ongoing basis. I'd have just as much fun going to Red Robin and a movie at Providence as I would going to Barefoot Charlie's. I mean they're both ok, but both would get old pretty quick if they were more than a once a month thing. Differentiating between those two types of options is like differentiating between a gnat's right and left eyelash.

[MantaRay]

Originally Posted by vivelafrance

Even if it's 2 mile from Indian Lake to the closest boat dock, that's still 4 miles closer than Providence.

Actually I charted 2 miles from that location to Drakes Creek Park where the lake begins. I didn't see any boat ramp there, which is why I asked the question WHERE is the boat ramp so we can map it and see how many miles it actually is? I found one boat ramp in Hendersonville Park on Sanders Ferry Rd., which maps 6.6 miles.