Do Not Move To New Jersey!!! (salary, jobs, retirement)

[njkate]

Originally Posted by tahiti

i know i'm making my town seem like nirvana (or maybe nashville ), but my taxes have risen very little over the past 2 years - maybe 3%? why? people DID get fed up, and vetoed several spending initiatives. the town committee got wise and now touts the budgets as "the smallest increase in 'x' number of years". this isn't uncommon in morris county - the past few elections a LOT of towns struck down budgets - people had enough!

It was the reassesment that hit a lot of people hard
Houses started selling for 400K and were only being taxed on 150K
Another fall out from that big real estate bubble
I wonder what people do now that things are levelling out...

[Summering]

Just to add a little spice to this conversation........
Taxes in Pa are growing in leaps and bounds too.
At least Sparta got to "vote" on a school. Here in Pa..........we just watch them
rise up. You wake up one day and to schools that are going where once trees were.
These schools are about 4 stories tall, with indoor pools.
We don't vote on schools! Wow, now that took some getting use too. I am not sure I stll think it has settled in my mind. They get built everywhere......those union workers will never be out of a job
I didn't live all that far from Sparta. In fact we held a shower for one of my girls at the restaurant in Lake Mohawk.
Sparta is a wealthy place, where people can afford those taxes. If not I guess they would move..........I doubt it puts a dent in some of those pockets.
My taxes being over 5,000 here in Pa are not that big of a savings really, from living in NJ. I just have more land here, and I am closer to family who moved this way also.
It is not a bargin in taxes........some people come here thinking so........then they find out later on, as they sit and write out the "Big Ole' school tax check"

[stmaarten]

Originally Posted by mike0421

My sweet Jesus lord. $13,500? Think about this: if you pay these taxes over the duration of a 30 year fixed mortgage, 13,500 x30 = $405,000. In essence, this is why I left NJ. The town, in effect, is asking you to pay the cost of another home just for the privilege of owning a building and land. Then, if you choose to live there longer, the tax remains. So, really, you don't really own your property, even after the duration of the loan. The town will put a padlock on your door so fast it will make your head spin. This, to me, is the definition of hubris. I know we must all pay taxes, but how can Sparta justify this price?

It's amazing to me, for people whom I consider to be amongst the most sophisticated in the country, why the citizenry can't push back against these bastards and demand a better system of government. 13,500 just plain sucks. Whenever I read a post like this, I can really relate to it. It sounds like StMaarten was forced out. I can't blame him/her.

That's EXACTLY what happened. When we had our house built (we wanted to leave Bergen Cty for numerous reasons, mostly overcrowding), we were told, by our realtor and the town tax assessor, that our taxes would NOT EVEN COME CLOSE to $8500 in Sparta. The home was approx. 3500 sq.ft., on a good sized lot, not the .25acres that we were living on before. The house cost approx. 80,000 LESS than the split-level we sold in Bergen. So, we considered $8500 to be reasonable, considering what we were getting.
When the home was finally completed and our first tax bill arrived, I almost had a heart attack! The bill was $10,800. I called the town and was told that the taxes had just gone up because of the need to add onto or build a new school. (They couldn't even give me a reasonable answer!) The next year, yet ANOTHER tax hike, this time $1100, so that our tax bill was now $11,900! This went on year after year until we just couldn't take the sheer corruption of it all! At $13,500 we put our foot down, had enough and left. Now, you might say, well didn't you do your research before you went into the contract to have the home built? All I can say is that friends and family thought I was out of my mind NUTS, in fact, with the level of research I did. I would go to town masterplan meetings, talk to the town counsel, talked to the tax assessor, etc., etc. Everyone claimed that taxes would go up, but "not that much". Then came the revelation that we were "grossly under assessed!" Although they were starting to asses the older homes first, we were told that eventually we'd be re-assessed as well!
Then there was the blatant corruption of several town depts. that were embesseling money, then more tax hikes, new school referendums. Eventually, four other people in our development moved because they just felt lied to.
I found out recently, thanks to NJTina's link, that the people that bought our home are now paying over $14,000 in property taxes. They just raised the taxes another five hundred dollars!!! WHY??? For the construction on the High School? How long are they going to use that as an excuse?
Although this situation may be specific to Sparta, other towns, that friends or family are living in are experiencing similar profound tax hikes. Some towns are just more corrupt than others, I suppose.
I met someone here in Charlotte recently, who lives in a very large home in a very nice community. He is married and has three boys and is (I am guessing) around 45 years old. He's retired...wanna know why? Because he's collecting TWO pensions from NJ! There you go....some of your hard earned tax dollars are leaving the state! I'm certainly not implying that when someone retires they should remain in NJ to spend their pension. But TWO pensions?!? I'm sure the guy has worked hard for 20 years, saved his money and sold his house for a bundle, but I still can't justify it. That should seriously pi$$ the taxpayers of NJ off! It's sheer craziness what happens to the tax money in NJ! And there's absolutely NOTHING you can do about it. Sure you can vote someone else into office, but they're usually master liers, just like the ones that came before.
I'll put this disclaimer in again: I LOVE NJ! Loved living there. Still have tons of friends and family there (some are beginning to pack up to leave as well). I still miss the place at times, but I REFUSE to be bled dry anymore!
All these threads about how diverse and fantastic Jersey is, are all true. But in some areas, it comes at an incredibly high price. And please don't tell me that I should have moved to "X" town where the taxes are lower. I had no intention on paying $13,500 in taxes in the first place! I'm far more frugal than that! I am a modest person, own two cars (NO SUVs), send my kids to public school and am far from label-conscious. Just trying to raise my children with decent moral standards surrounded by like-minded people. I really don't ask for much.
I have no hatred for New Jersey, just for its politicians.

[njkate]

StMaarten

You have valid points...take a look at this....wonder how many pensions some of these get:

NJ.com: Everything Jersey

click on public payrolls
then multiple job holders..here's a sampling:

DAMIAN G MURRAY Agency 2006
Salary
LACEY TOWNSHIP $53,625
SEASIDE HEIGHTS BOROUGH $51,000
DOVER TOWNSHIP $50,240
STAFFORD TOWNSHIP $40,161
LITTLE EGG HARBOR TOWNSHIP $39,432
BEACHWOOD BOROUGH $24,174
LAKEHURST BOROUGH $19,224
ISLAND HEIGHTS BOROUGH $10,376
Star-Ledger Databases
Active Public Employees
Multiple-Job Holders
Retirees
State Employees
Licensed Educators
All-in-One Name Search


New Jersey By The Numbers

[Badfish740]

I saw a bumper sticker once that said, "I love my country, but I fear my government!" I think I could say the same about New Jersey...

[stmaarten]

Originally Posted by njkate

StMaarten

You have valid points...take a look at this....wonder how many pensions some of these get:

NJ.com: Everything Jersey

click on public payrolls
then multiple job holders..here's a sampling:

DAMIAN G MURRAY Agency 2006
Salary
LACEY TOWNSHIP $53,625
SEASIDE HEIGHTS BOROUGH $51,000
DOVER TOWNSHIP $50,240
STAFFORD TOWNSHIP $40,161
LITTLE EGG HARBOR TOWNSHIP $39,432
BEACHWOOD BOROUGH $24,174
LAKEHURST BOROUGH $19,224
ISLAND HEIGHTS BOROUGH $10,376
Star-Ledger Databases
Active Public Employees
Multiple-Job Holders
Retirees
State Employees
Licensed Educators
All-in-One Name Search


New Jersey By The Numbers

OMG! nevermind the salaries! Look at the MONTHLY pension amounts!
I'm in even more shock than I was before!
Thanks for the link, NJKate!

[Diane Giam]

Originally Posted by Summering

I'm remembering that the people in line don't talk to ya'......
Ya' just can't get a smile outta them. In order to get a smile.........
you must move. You must move South.........
Then in the South when you get in line, someone will finally say "hello" .........
" How big is your house,how many windows do you have, what do you drive,
and where does your husband work?"
Perhaps, plastic or paper?

No one asks those Questions. Its just that every time you randomly spoke to someone you didn't know in Manalapan, they pretended that they didn't hear you. If you do that here, an entire conversation evolves.
My friend says that sometimes she feels invisable. There are some nice people there, but unfortunatly the bad outnumer the good.
I'm not saying the entire state, I always felt that they felt that they were better than me. I don;t feel that way here.

Manalapan, Circa 1995, even mentions my church, to bad it just grew to much-http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=990CE6DD1230F933A05757C0A9639582 60&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=print
Diane

[AnesthesiaMD]

Originally Posted by tahiti

yup. and I'm of the mindset "i can have a smaller house, much lower taxes, less cleaning , and STILL have the benefit of the school system"

my cousin lived in west orange in a new house at the time ('98 ish). Sold in 2001 - taxes were over 20K. house was "only" about 3300 sq ft. WEST ORANGE PEOPLE!! I'm sorry, there are nice sections, but not $20K nice. The people who bought the house certainly didn't seem to mind though!

And for a school system that's mediocre (and I'm being generous when I say mediocre).

My taxes are equally high in Livingston, but at least I can justify it with a good school system. Every time I write that check, I tell myself that sending my kids to private school would be more expensive. It still stings though.

[JerZ]

Originally Posted by Summerling

Originally Posted by Summering View Post
I'm remembering that the people in line don't talk to ya'......
Ya' just can't get a smile outta them. In order to get a smile.........
you must move. You must move South.........
Then in the South when you get in line, someone will finally say "hello" .........
" How big is your house,how many windows do you have, what do you drive,
and where does your husband work?"
Perhaps, plastic or paper?

Originally Posted by Diane Giam

No one asks those Questions.

Well, except for you.

[ottomobeale]

You forgot that the sprawl is so large that there is not a single tree left.