Is leaving the right thing to do? (Camden, Bayonne: mortgage, real estate)

[BobKovacs]

Originally Posted by SWB

I'm an optimist. There was a major article in this morning's Scranton Times-Tribune about how some Federal funding is now in place for the line. Now all that has to be done is for PA & NJ elected officials to cut through red tape and get this project completed.

Like I said, we'll all be dead by then. They couldn't cut through a piece of red tape with a laser-guided chainsaw...............

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by nic529

your absolutely right..I couldn't agree more. I'd rather spread my happiness. It just seems like you take it so personally - but your not even in NJ. Its somewhat mind boggling. If ya know what I mean....

It's because I like NJ, even if it doesn't like me back. Most people read into my tone the wrong way all the time and assume I'm merely here to troll or attack, and that is NOT the case. If the cost-of-living wasn't so drastic, I'd even consider moving to Princeton, Red Bank, or another NJ community with a great walkable downtown atmosphere someday. When I see so many negative comments about it, I can't help but wonder why folks who hate the state so much are hellbent on staying. As I said before, nobody is chaining these people to Hoboken, Passaic, or Pennsauken. They can do like the rest of those who were unhappy with NJ did and move to North Carolina. When someone comes onto your state forum with high hopes of a fresh start in NJ and sees nothing but unhappiness, they'll be drug right down with that. Depression is contagious; happiness is infectious---which is why I don't understand why more folks can't make an honest effort to point out the GOOD in Jersey instead of the gloom and doom. One awesome thread I participated in was that "Favorite NJ song" thread, as folks could beam with civic pride while discussing their favorite Garden State songs. This forum needs more of THAT and less of the Corzine-bashing, housing-bashing, salary-bashing, traffic-bashing, McGreevey-bashing, liberal-bashing, pollution-bashing, (SWB-bashing...LOL!), etc.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by BobKovacs

Like I said, we'll all be dead by then. They couldn't cut through a piece of red tape with a laser-guided chainsaw...............

...but another member told me Governor Corzine was Santa. Certainly Santa is capable of fitting a commuter rail line in his big sack to bring down the chimney?

[nic529]

Originally Posted by SWB

I do take it personally because, believe it or not, my photo tours have inspired a few folks to move here. I just spoke to one a few weeks ago as a matter of fact, and they are quite happy. Never underestimate the power that optimism and civic pride can have. Most on this forum think I'm annoying for tooting Scranton's horn so much, but for the 0.1% who find my yammering useful, then I'm providing a good service. Similarly, if more folks would post more "feel-good" threads about NJ and reasons to MOVE THERE instead of to flee, more folks might be inspired to give it a shot. This could involve more photo tours, relating positive experiences about parks/concerts/entertainment, or anything really to get people inspired by NJ again. I'd actually ask BobKovacs, Tahiti, or somebody else to consider posting a "Sticky" thread sometime on the NJ forum for only GOOD news about NJ where folks can go for a good "pick me up" with photos of children building snowmen in Sparta, stories about how much money you won in AC, the latest boutique to open in Red Bank, the deer you saw in Montague, etc. The overwhelming tone of this state forum is one of despair---that could and SHOULD be changed! Give people a reason to visit your state and stimulate its economy, not flee.

I can understand what your saying. I just don't understand why you would be so interested in NJ. I mean ...hey....thanks for the help and all....really. But what you need to take into consideration is what is happening here and people need an outlet. And they (we) should be able to do this without having to explain ourselves to someone who lives out of the state in a more econimically friendly environment. Do you see what I mean? The rate at which this state has gone down in the last several years is too fast for most of us to be able to comprehend. Sometimes people need to gripe......and yes...I'm sure that here on the NJ board you find a lot of those....because there are A LOT of people feeling a big pinch quickly. So don't take it personally...it doesnt have anything to do with you or your state. Sometimes people just need to hear....."wow..that sucks"

But if you don't like hearing people complain and so on...I wouldn't keep visiting the NJ board - lots of people are going to - and honestly they have a right to.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by TheEmissary

Actually, all of America can be boiled down to city (dumpy or newer), old suburbs, new suburbs, exurbs, and country. It's like that no matter where you go! (Prices may vary!)

Personally, my favorite downtown area anywhere is "Grandview" on Ghost Whisperer". It's actually the old set of "Back to the Future". It also doesn't hurt to see Jennifer Love Hewitt wandering around talking to herself!

What am I saying! I'm a trekker - Time for a drink at Quark's Bar on DS9!

Isn't Ghost Whisperer based on Saratoga Springs, NY?

[nic529]

Originally Posted by SWB

It's because I like NJ, even if it doesn't like me back. Most people read into my tone the wrong way all the time and assume I'm merely here to troll or attack, and that is NOT the case. If the cost-of-living wasn't so drastic, I'd even consider moving to Princeton, Red Bank, or another NJ community with a great walkable downtown atmosphere someday. When I see so many negative comments about it, I can't help but wonder why folks who hate the state so much are hellbent on staying. As I said before, nobody is chaining these people to Hoboken, Passaic, or Pennsauken. They can do like the rest of those who were unhappy with NJ did and move to North Carolina. When someone comes onto your state forum with high hopes of a fresh start in NJ and sees nothing but unhappiness, they'll be drug right down with that. Depression is contagious; happiness is infectious---which is why I don't understand why more folks can't make an honest effort to point out the GOOD in Jersey instead of the gloom and doom. One awesome thread I participated in was that "Favorite NJ song" thread, as folks could beam with civic pride while discussing their favorite Garden State songs. This forum needs more of THAT and less of the Corzine-bashing, housing-bashing, salary-bashing, traffic-bashing, McGreevey-bashing, liberal-bashing, pollution-bashing, (SWB-bashing...LOL!), etc.

Because unless you can afford a $500k house ....there really isnt a whole lot of good to be talking about. Honestly...and people shouldnt be coming here thinking they are going to find a decent house in a good neighborhood for 250k cuz its not going to happen. Especially where the jobs are.

I'm sure the people who live in this state who are not living paycheck to paycheck like the majority of us, are very happy and they have lots to do. But for the average middle class family its not an easy thing to do. And when things get hard for those people moving here based on all these "great" things and they don't see that they can't move on up here because their paychecks can't keep up with the cost of living increases - do you want to be the one they blame? Right now it is not the best place...unfortunately its the truth. If I thought for a minute that in 5 years things will be better and we just need to keep trucking until then - I wouldn't be considering to leave the state. But - I don't see that.....and the people who do - are in my opinion - living in a dream world. Its going to take a long long time to turn this state back around. And they haven't even started yet.

[ScranBarre]

Originally Posted by nic529

I can understand what your saying. I just don't understand why you would be so interested in NJ. I mean ...hey....thanks for the help and all....really. But what you need to take into consideration is what is happening here and people need an outlet. And they (we) should be able to do this without having to explain ourselves to someone who lives out of the state in a more econimically friendly environment. Do you see what I mean? The rate at which this state has gone down in the last several years is too fast for most of us to be able to comprehend. Sometimes people need to gripe......and yes...I'm sure that here on the NJ board you find a lot of those....because there are A LOT of people feeling a big pinch quickly. So don't take it personally...it doesnt have anything to do with you or your state. Sometimes people just need to hear....."wow..that sucks"

But if you don't like hearing people complain and so on...I wouldn't keep visiting the NJ board - lots of people are going to - and honestly they have a right to.

There is an old adage that goes something like "You will attract more flies to your home with honey than with vinegar," and that most certainly applies here. I don't know if everyone is like me, but when I was considering leaving Scranton and researching other areas, I immediately ruled out areas with a lot of pessimism on their boards. Why? People who look at the glass half-empty at all times are more likely to become depressed and are statistically more likely to die younger. What does that mean for the good folks of those areas who WERE trying to make a difference? They lost the potential to have at least one energetic very young person who likes to tackle challenges (and God knows how many more besides myself). On the flip side, I was lured to areas where people were overwhelmingly praising their city---Pittsburgh, Minneapolis/St. Paul, and Seattle immediately came to mind. Optimists beget optimists; pessimists beget pessimists. Optimists beget success; pessimists beget failure.

If NJ wants to improve itself, it needs to lure in more folks who are upbeat and care to make a difference. Having a forum that is overwhelmingly saying "woe is us" repels this demographic. Having a forum that says "we're knocked down but not at all out for the count" DOES attract such folks. When someone inquires about Scranton I give them the HONEST truth---great architecture, affordable housing, proximity to two major cities, beautiful scenery, etc. AS WELL AS a high wage tax, rising property taxes, scarce white-collar opportunity, and too much racism/homophobia/prejudice for my tastes. I'm a realist. I know that even my own area faces its challenges, but I prefer to see the silver lining wherever possible. Where are these "silver lining" folks on the NJ forum? They're few and far between. Why?

[nic529]

Originally Posted by SWB

There is an old adage that goes something like "You will attract more flies to your home with honey than with vinegar," and that most certainly applies here. I don't know if everyone is like me, but when I was considering leaving Scranton and researching other areas, I immediately ruled out areas with a lot of pessimism on their boards. Why? People who look at the glass half-empty at all times are more likely to become depressed and are statistically more likely to die younger. What does that mean for the good folks of those areas who WERE trying to make a difference? They lost the potential to have at least one energetic very young person who likes to tackle challenges (and God knows how many more besides myself). On the flip side, I was lured to areas where people were overwhelmingly praising their city---Pittsburgh, Minneapolis/St. Paul, and Seattle immediately came to mind. Optimists beget optimists; pessimists beget pessimists. Optimists beget success; pessimists beget failure.

If NJ wants to improve itself, it needs to lure in more folks who are upbeat and care to make a difference. Having a forum that is overwhelmingly saying "woe is us" repels this demographic. Having a forum that says "we're knocked down but not at all out for the count" DOES attract such folks. When someone inquires about Scranton I give them the HONEST truth---great architecture, affordable housing, proximity to two major cities, beautiful scenery, etc. AS WELL AS a high wage tax, rising property taxes, scarce white-collar opportunity, and too much racism/homophobia/prejudice for my tastes. I'm a realist. I know that even my own area faces its challenges, but I prefer to see the silver lining wherever possible. Where are these "silver lining" folks on the NJ forum? They're few and far between. Why?

Do you think all the flies will stay if they are mislead to what is happening here? I don't - I think they'd end up being the worst bashers of all.

[imperieux]

Originally Posted by njkate

Because in reality they really really miss the place..some are MISERABLE in their new state, especially the ones foolish enough not to have researched and researched again before they made the move. They just won't admit it.

Moving to the south especially for someone from the northeast can be a huge culture shock to the old system..

You can almost pick out the ones that left and are miserable and the ones that left and are happy just want to keep a connection

I've never come here just to bash on NJ and I've been lurking on this board for a long time now, but haven't spoken up until recently. I still have a real interest here because my entire family still live in places like Cherry Hill, Voorhees, Blackwood and Medford. My husband's family still live in Bayonne and Keyport. They are all looking for answers just like everyone else.

Most of my family live in Camden County and have you seen some of the property taxes in that county? All to support that hell hole called Camden. And I have no idea how my husband's family do it up north. My mother is worried now because money is getting tighter and tighter every year and she no longer has my father to lean on. She is a retired widow and can't "downsize" because she already has! I'm asking her to join us here in SC so that we can take care of her from here on in. What else do I do? Put her in a nursing home?

Some of my family ARE looking at other states now, my sister in law has left for West Palm Beach and some have decided to stay no matter what. They will decide what's best for their own families.

And the truth is, my immediate family and I would probably still be in NJ, complaining along with the rest of my family, if I hadn't gotten sick so young and had no choice but to make an extreme change in priorities.

Now my family and I are happy here, but I agree that there are some who have fled without doing enough research or who have never looked at any other issues other than financial ones and they are surprised that SC isn't like NJ. One poster actually said "I didn't realize along with the lower cost of living comes A LOWER PAYCHECK!".

Um, duh.

[tahiti]

Originally Posted by SWB

It's because I like NJ, even if it doesn't like me back.

you like it even though you listed it as one of your least favorite states?