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Old 11-05-2015, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Upstate NY/NJ
3,058 posts, read 3,824,550 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badfish740 View Post
Here's the Pattenburg Tunnel:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHaKMmhEcmQ

I'm pretty sure getting to either (at either end) would require trespassing at some point.
I looked for the entrance on Tunnel road near West Portal but never saw it. I never even knew about the Oxford Tunnel until recently. There are interesting places still left in western NJ.
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Old 11-05-2015, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
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Back in the early 1900s, railroads had pockets deep enough to undertake construction projects on their own dime. Nowadays, the Bergen Arches or the Lackawanna Cutoff couldn't be built without taxpayer support. They may not even be possible to build at all, with today's environmental issues.
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Old 11-06-2015, 11:01 AM
 
2,669 posts, read 2,092,040 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouldy Old Schmo View Post
Back in the early 1900s, railroads had pockets deep enough to undertake construction projects on their own dime. Nowadays, the Bergen Arches or the Lackawanna Cutoff couldn't be built without taxpayer support. They may not even be possible to build at all, with today's environmental issues.
I don't know if that is entirely true. I think the land railroads built on was usually either given to them by the government or they had to pay heavily discounted prices. Not sure about the tax policies, they could probably get a huge write off for capital construction.

And the reason they could do capital construction is due to the profits from the freight service. The passenger operations never makes any money.
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Old 11-06-2015, 11:55 AM
 
Location: High Bridge, NJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DefiantNJ View Post
I don't know if that is entirely true. I think the land railroads built on was usually either given to them by the government or they had to pay heavily discounted prices. Not sure about the tax policies, they could probably get a huge write off for capital construction.
The land is one thing but the construction itself is another. Sure, railroads were given land out west where it was the federal government's to give, but as railroads expanded in the Northeast they had to buy it as people were settled here long before the advent of railroads. The Lackwanna Cutoff cost $11,000,000 in 1911, which would be $275,000,000 today. Railroads typically issued corporate bonds in order to finance capital projects.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DefiantNJ View Post
And the reason they could do capital construction is due to the profits from the freight service. The passenger operations never makes any money.
But also remember that freight service was booming with no competition from trucks-the only way to move goods to market long distances was via rail. The initial purpose of all of these projects were freight rail. Passenger service was offered merely as a public benefit (since it was a revenue loser) to generate goodwill among the public, which, by the late 1800s was often extremely skeptical of, and hostile to (often with good reason) "Big Railroad."
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Old 11-06-2015, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badfish740 View Post
But also remember that freight service was booming with no competition from trucks-the only way to move goods to market long distances was via rail. The initial purpose of all of these projects were freight rail. Passenger service was offered merely as a public benefit (since it was a revenue loser) to generate goodwill among the public, which, by the late 1800s was often extremely skeptical of, and hostile to (often with good reason) "Big Railroad."
The "Lackawanna Cutoff" was built by the Delaware, Lackawanna, and Western Railroad, which made boocoodles of money hauling anthracite coal in the late 19th-early 20th centuries. By the mid-1950s, DL&W and the Erie were having financial problems due to the loss of freight and passenger traffic to the highways, rising labor costs, and the high property taxes they were paying New Jersey. In 1957-8, Erie closed its Jersey City passenger/freight ferry terminal and moved into the Lackawanna's newer facility (still in use). The two railroads merged in 1960 as the Erie-Lackawanna. After that, some trackage in north Jersey was abandoned (such as the DL&W's main line through Patterson and Totowa that became the I-80 r-o-w).

There's a corridor running through Elizabeth that was once the main line of the Jersey Central. It is overgrown with trees.
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Old 11-06-2015, 01:01 PM
 
Location: Somewhere flat in Mississippi
10,060 posts, read 12,810,783 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DefiantNJ View Post
And the reason they could do capital construction is due to the profits from the freight service. The passenger operations never makes any money.
And still doesn't. That's why it is tax-subsidized.
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