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Old 06-16-2017, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Northern NJ
6,262 posts, read 6,281,488 times
Reputation: 8996

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD View Post
Their children would no longer be in our schools at a yearly charge of $20k-$30k a pop.

But I also disagree with the poster who said this. This is NJ. Property taxes dont go down here. The best you can hope for is that they go up more slowly.

There is no way in hell the child of an illegal alien should be admitted to any public schools. There is no way an illegal alien should be able to get a driver's license. It's an outrage. Getting rid of those two things alone would send so many of them back home that we wouldn't need ICE raids at all. Stop the free stuff. Stop giving citizenship privileges to non-citizens. Stop those 2 things and the problem literally takes care of itself.
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Old 06-16-2017, 05:32 PM
 
294 posts, read 380,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
There is no way in hell the child of an illegal alien should be admitted to any public schools. There is no way an illegal alien should be able to get a driver's license. It's an outrage. Getting rid of those two things alone would send so many of them back home that we wouldn't need ICE raids at all. Stop the free stuff. Stop giving citizenship privileges to non-citizens. Stop those 2 things and the problem literally takes care of itself.
I agree 100%
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Old 06-16-2017, 08:31 PM
 
Location: NJ/NY
7,701 posts, read 8,152,813 times
Reputation: 5324
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
There is no way in hell the child of an illegal alien should be admitted to any public schools. There is no way an illegal alien should be able to get a driver's license. It's an outrage. Getting rid of those two things alone would send so many of them back home that we wouldn't need ICE raids at all. Stop the free stuff. Stop giving citizenship privileges to non-citizens. Stop those 2 things and the problem literally takes care of itself.
I agree. The whole thing is insane when you think about it. People are here illegally. They Are breaking our laws by being here, and we treat them like they belong here. How do you give a legal form of ID, like a driver's license to someone is here illegally? Even worse, how do you give in-state tuition to someone who is here illegally? It is completely illogical. How can you be the legal resident of a state, but an illegal resident of the country in which that state is a part?
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Old 06-16-2017, 08:50 PM
 
Location: near a beach
14,916 posts, read 13,972,771 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DefiantNJ View Post
An occasional raid is not a problem.


But would you support regular, routine ICE raids in the restaurant you frequent perhaps while you are there? Your landscaper being taken away, you contractor missing worker and delaying projects? Would you like your children see people being led away in handcuffs, perhaps violently?


We need a comprehensive immigration reform that will remove incentives for illegal immigration and encourage legal immigration. I guess similar effects might be reached by regular raids that happen multiple time every day. But for that you would need ICE to become ten time bigger. And you would not want to live in a place like that...
Do your own landscaping or hire an American or a LEGAL immigrant. Same with any contractor. Why would you be hiring illegals in the first place? They have broken the law and you are aiding them.

I agree that we need immigration reform to encourage LEGAL immigration and make it possible for people to come here LEGALLY, something that is extremely difficult now. But neither party seems to address immigration reform.
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Old 06-17-2017, 12:58 PM
 
242 posts, read 423,617 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
There is no way in hell the child of an illegal alien should be admitted to any public schools.
Why not in NJ? Isn't school paid by property taxes which all residents of a given town pay (irrespective of whether citizen or legally or illegally staying in the country).
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Old 06-17-2017, 01:06 PM
 
242 posts, read 423,617 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaymoney View Post
If you're born in the US there is a birth certificate. You might not have your copy, but it's filed at both the hospital and the civic levels, so there are existing copies that you can get a hold of.

Additionally, as soon as you're born a SSN is issued which is what is used on your tax forms. So being able to check the SSN against the name assigned to it is another option for proof of identity.
So what does ICE do if the person being stopped had not so good parents and whatever birth date was told to him wasn't really the right one? Probably even the name he grew up with is not the one given to hospital during birth. And he does not have the birth certificate or was born at home maybe. And let's say he is not a European white or African. What happens next?

Forget SSN and tax forms because not everybody earns enough to file taxes.
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Old 06-17-2017, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Northern NJ
6,262 posts, read 6,281,488 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shet View Post
Why not in NJ? Isn't school paid by property taxes which all residents of a given town pay (irrespective of whether citizen or legally or illegally staying in the country).
It's not a matter of money or who is paying. I didn't say illegal aliens should pay or not pay for public schools. I said illegal aliens should not be allowed to attend public schools. Only legal United States citizens should receive the benefit of civil privileges such as public schools, drivers licenses, business licenses, etc. Illegal aliens should face the prospect of being unable to work or raise families or drive or move about. If that were the case, which would be just and correct and moral, you would see NOBODY coming here without proper application and acceptance.

So we don't need walls, and we don't need ICE raids. We need common effing sense and simple application of even simpler principles. If you are here illegally, you get nothing, you can do nothing, you cannot move about, you cannot work, your kids can not attend school, you cannot receive entitlements, you cannot drive a car.

A policy like this is not only sensible and correct, it is CHEAP! It doesn't cost much to implement and it disincentivizes civil invasion of our country.
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Old 06-17-2017, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Northern NJ
6,262 posts, read 6,281,488 times
Reputation: 8996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shet View Post
So what does ICE do if the person being stopped had not so good parents and whatever birth date was told to him wasn't really the right one? Probably even the name he grew up with is not the one given to hospital during birth. And he does not have the birth certificate or was born at home maybe. And let's say he is not a European white or African. What happens next?

Forget SSN and tax forms because not everybody earns enough to file taxes.

Constructing "what-ifs" is silly and avoids the central issue. The bottom line is we must stop the civil invasion of our country by taking away citizenship benefits from non-citizens. If you walk over our border, itself a criminal act, you should, of course, be liable for arrest and deportation. But it needs to go much further: Invaders must not be able to function. If they knew in advance that there would be no work, no school, no driving, no entitlements, no health care, etc., then they wouldn't come without applying properly.


This is only a problem and the invasion only continues when we LITERALLY INVITE IT AND PAY FOR IT.


Chickens only come home to roost when there is a home in which to roost.


Let's demolish the chicken coop. Then the civil invasion of our country becomes an exercise in futility and failure. That's what we want. And we can have it on the cheap with some common sense and a few good policies.


If you walk into my country, here is what you cannot do:


1) You cannot work
2) You cannot drive a car
3) You cannot interface with the banking system
4) Your kids cannot attend public school
5) You cannot receive health care benefits
6) You cannot receive any public entitlements such as housing or educational assistance or anything else
7) You cannot vote


And all of this is simple cheap policies. We don't have to build anything, we don't have to pay for much of anything. Laws are passed and you institute some simple paperwork so that kids cannot be registered for school and employers cannot sign you up to work and DMV can't give you a drivers license and banks cannot give you a checking account. In fact most of the verification infrastructure already exists and just needs some adaptations.


This could be done and finished in about 3 months at little cost.
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Old 06-18-2017, 08:48 AM
 
1,511 posts, read 1,704,373 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
There is no way in hell the child of an illegal alien should be admitted to any public schools. There is no way an illegal alien should be able to get a driver's license. It's an outrage. Getting rid of those two things alone would send so many of them back home that we wouldn't need ICE raids at all. Stop the free stuff. Stop giving citizenship privileges to non-citizens. Stop those 2 things and the problem literally takes care of itself.
You've made some good points, the most crazy thing is for any illegals to stop by emergency room and get treatment, if serious treatment needed, getting admitted to hospital stay and thousands of dollars per night.

When I had urgent care needs, I have to really think twice about going to emergency rooms because worrying about the outrage medical costs.
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Old 06-18-2017, 02:16 PM
 
242 posts, read 423,617 times
Reputation: 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Paolella View Post
Constructing "what-ifs" is silly and avoids the central issue.

This could be done and finished in about 3 months at little cost.
It's not silly for someone who does not look American.

We don't need new laws really. Implement the ones we have for e.g. E-Verify. No jobs no illegal immigration. Simple. Though it's difficult when people give somebody else's SSN. That defeats E-Verify.

But once they have been offered jobs and working, not fair in cutting off things like public schools which are paid either by property taxes or state aid i.e income tax. This will make US worse than even middle East countries. In fact downright hypocrisy i.e getting work done by them but not giving benefits. Either don't offer jobs or allow to avail of all benefits like schools and emergency care
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