North Jersey - Ringwood - Jackson Whites (Orange, Washington: landscaping, to live)

[Mightyqueen801]

Originally Posted by BergenCountyJohnny

I'm always considering the same kind of move. They have wrecked a lot of what made Bergen County unique and interesting. To me, the last straw was when Van Riper's was replaced by A&P on Chestnut Ridge Rd.

Monmouth is nice, the area is convenient, it's near the shore but also near enough to NYC and EWR. A little less expensive and a little more elbow room. Good luck with your move!

Thank you! I have a picture of my daughter when she was little sitting on a big pumpkin at Van Riper's the last year they were there. And then Tice's went...and now it's so different up there.

[ramapoughnative]

Wow! you people are really misguided! You really need to read YOUR history books! Did you know that in 1710, there is a map of our village where the Ford plant used to be? Did you also know we were written about 1850, called the Ramapough Indians and located in the same place we are now? And to set your facts straight, we don't now or have ever wanted a casino. We will take land though, the land that was stolen from us 250 years ago. Wanna learn something? All that ranting and raving by Ramapoughnative on wikipedia is true, that's why it's still posted. Anyone want to try and disprove it? Find a valid fact in a verifiable resource (historical document, published work (( except Cohen, he has been disproved )) and post it.. easy enough right?, good luck! Just so you know, i have over 40+ plus books from the 1600's to the 1900's that state otherwise. The bull**** you think you know is because of Trump. He started all the crap because he was afraid of us opening a casino. the state has to approve any compact, fed rec or not. And another thing, what does opening a casino have to do with heritage? A casino doesn't define you as Native American or not.

[ramapoughnative]

on the flip side.. I didn't know Tices and Van Ripers is gone. Too sad really.. I used to work in the IBM in Franklin Lakes for a time and the one in Woodcliff Lakes also. (I.B.M. = I've Been Moved) The whole area started going downhill in the '80 when they started building office spaces everywhere for no reason.

[keen cat]

Originally Posted by WhiteCloudRising

Dear EEPNJ,

We have never defined ourselves as black, because we are not black, never have been nor will we ever be "black".

hmm...are youse ashamed to be black? you people sure look mulatto

[keen cat]

Originally Posted by BergenCountyJohnny

No, I don't believe they have, nor should they. The Indian thing came about in the late 90's and 2000's when they realized some of them MIGHT have some native american ancestry, and they sought land as reservation land for their "trible" (translation - they wanted the government to give them part or all of the park lands so they can ride their quads and not be given tickets or arrested by the park police for it). The next step is that they really, REALLY want to build a casino. I don't think they will ever get any land OR a casino - defiinitely not the casino. They are mostly of Dutch, HESSIAN (german) and African-American (freed/runaway slaves) descent, and not of Italian heritage at all. They were in NJ long before the influx of Italians to the state.

I hope it never happens because we all know they are black or mulatto obviously. All these blacks on the east coast want to be ndn so bad. Like so many of their kind, they are very ashamed of being of african american descent. You can obviously tell when someone is mulatto, the jackson whites definately have the tyra banks look.

[SheilaShigley]

We don't need to 'want' to be Native, as we actually ARE Native. There are genetic streams from multiple Native sources in the Ramapough people:

1) The original hill tribes (Lenape, Munsee, and more)
2) The tribes who recently migrated to the hills (Tuscarora from NC, etc.)
3) The NY Native Americans who were taken as Dutch slaves, married West Indian slaves, and found their way to the NJ hills
4) Other individual Native Americans from the region who came to hide out in the hills

You have to remember that America was in a huge state of turmoil during much of this time; many Native Americans (and plenty of whites) had to hide to stay alive. The hills were a natural choice.

If you have any doubt as to the validity of the Native American status, look only as far as your census: the requirements for being listed as Indian were--and continue to be--rigorous. My ancestor Charles de Groat, for example was listed as "Indian" in the 1875 NY census.

NY and NJ have both officially recognized the Ramapough Lenape Indian Nation; they have absolutely no financial incentive to do so. The recognition became law because the evidence supported that recognition.

All Americans are part-Native and part-African, unless BOTH sets of grandparents got off a boat from Europe, or they were raised in a very isolated, intermarrying community such as the Amish. Otherwise, nearly every single "white" American is actually mixed, even if the Native and African genes are relatively small in proportion to the "lighter" ones.

[ramapoughnative]

Originally Posted by keen cat

hmm...are youse ashamed to be black? you people sure look mulatto

I'm not ashamed to be anything! Looks has nothing to do with who you are. This isn't 'Hollywood'. I was born and raised to be me and I will be identified as such. I fit neither your white nor black category and was never raised as such so why would I be considered either? If I tried to act 'Black' or 'White', it would be a lie. By the way, I find your comment offensive. 'you people' is the typical racist way people use to describe someone as less than themselves. We are all human and should be identified as such.

[ramapoughnative]

Originally Posted by keen cat

I hope it never happens because we all know they are black or mulatto obviously. All these blacks on the east coast want to be ndn so bad. Like so many of their kind, they are very ashamed of being of african american descent. You can obviously tell when someone is mulatto, the jackson whites definately have the tyra banks look.

So you think you know more about us than 2 Certified Genealogists? And one is one of the top 3 in the world! Please explain what would be the advantages of claiming N.A. vs being African American? Personally, I think African Americans have more benefits and freedoms than we do. Were they ever not allowed religious freedom? We didn't until the Native American Religious Freedom Act of 1978. The Ramapough applied for Federal Recognition this same year, 6 years before Congress passed the bill for Indian Gaming! We do not want Gaming. Never did. We tried to remove it from our Federal Recognition bid but the U.S. Government wouldn't allow it. To the ignorant and uneducated like yourselves, greed is your only motivation. For us Fed Rec. means education, health care, and job training. By the way, if we wanted gaming, we could have it now. They allow the Catholic Church to have Bingo, and if we paid for the license, we could too. Maybe if you read a book or did a little research before you opened your mouth, you wouldn't look so stupid now.

[rscalzo]

I didn't know Tices and Van Ripers is gone

They have been gone for many years.

[keen cat]

Originally Posted by ramapoughnative

I'm not ashamed to be anything! Looks has nothing to do with who you are. This isn't 'Hollywood'. I was born and raised to be me and I will be identified as such. I fit neither your white nor black category and was never raised as such so why would I be considered either? If I tried to act 'Black' or 'White', it would be a lie. By the way, I find your comment offensive. 'you people' is the typical racist way people use to describe someone as less than themselves. We are all human and should be identified as such.

Its mainly twinkies such as yourself that talk the way you do. The states and federal govt don't recognize you and neither do I. My tribes already recognized. We never had to prove our ndness unlike you pretendians. WE have are culture, we don't have to read about it. Thats why you get all your info from a book. By the way my geneologist was my grandparents and theirs was there grandparents. So wheres your language, songs and dances, tribal customs? oh wait you don't have any. Your applying to get yours. Why don't you hire a university professor to tell you how to be ndn. My four your old has more knowledge bein ndn than all your people combined.