Chris Christie is being unfair (Newark: how much, price, military)

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by shorebaby

Great an even bigger subsidy for mass transit....

What do you mean , obivlously the videos Show that the system is being used alot. And the New Fleet was order & arrived way before the recession in 05,06,07. Again do you understand how Mass Transit works? The New Fleet was need to meet demands of overcrowding on several lines and replace an aging almost 20-40 yr fleet.

[Mightyqueen801]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

No Transit Agency in North American pays the Fuel or Gas Tax. And NJT is upgrading its entire Fleet slowly so they get a better MPG or in the Electric Train case accelerate faster and last longer.

Heres some samples of our new Equipment

ALP-46 Pulling 12 Bi-level cars into Busy Penn Station.


YouTube - New Jersey Transit Trains at Newark Penn Station Platform One Part Three

EB ALP-46 with Bi-levels blast by Monmouth Park (110mph)


YouTube - EB ALP-46 with Bi-levels blast by Monmouth Park

Our New Diesels , that are energy effincent.


YouTube - New Jersey Transit - Raritan Valley Line Action

I think this fare increase will hurt all the Ridership gain NJT has gotten over the past 10 years and cost the state billions in lost Smart Growth Projects.

I love the new cars. Much more comfortable with one exception: When the trains are not as full as usual and you are sitting on the upper level, they sway. Got used to that, though.

Overall, the service is pretty good. I'm not happy about having a 25% increase all at once--that's $60 a month more tacked on to my commuting cost.

[shorebaby]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

What do you mean , obivlously the videos Show that the system is being used alot. And the New Fleet was order & arrived way before the recession in 05,06,07. Again do you understand how Mass Transit works? The New Fleet was need to meet demands of overcrowding on several lines and replace an aging almost 20-40 yr fleet.

I mean if they are tax exempt they are getting a bigger subsidy because others have to make up their share.

I don't doubt many people use mass transit but more do not use it than do use it. How about everybody pay their own way. I won't ask you to make my car payments don't ask me to pay your commute to work.

[billb7581]

Originally Posted by shorebaby

I don't doubt many people use mass transit but more do not use it than do use it. How about everybody pay their own way. I won't ask you to make my car payments don't ask me to pay your commute to work.

[billb7581]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

Thats not there fault , its called Freight companies who bully. They hog most of the Passenger Railway network here in the NE, causing delays. We need reform in the Transportation Industry so stuff like this doesn't happen.
.

Um, those tracks haven't seen a passenger car in 50 years, prior to the River Line.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by shorebaby

I mean if they are tax exempt they are getting a bigger subsidy because others have to make up their share.

I don't doubt many people use mass transit but more do not use it than do use it. How about everybody pay their own way. I won't ask you to make my car payments don't ask me to pay your commute to work.

Thats unfair to the 1.5 million who do , they could cut service on many lines. But Raising fares is unjust. How would you like it if they raising Parking fees and permits in Hoboken by 25%? Just becuz you don't use it doesn't mean you should pay for it. Should I pay for Road up keep in Hoboken?

Originally Posted by billb7581

Um, those tracks haven't seen a passenger car in 50 years, prior to the River Line.

It does in some parts , and thats a reason why its not two way its full length.

[elflord1973]

Originally Posted by shorebaby

I mean if they are tax exempt they are getting a bigger subsidy because others have to make up their share.

I don't doubt many people use mass transit but more do not use it than do use it. How about everybody pay their own way. I won't ask you to make my car payments don't ask me to pay your commute to work.

Your car payments don't come close to covering the cost of your commute. "Everybody pay their own way" is a catchy slogan, but it's not a very practical way to pay for the roads.

Again, the idea that road users don't get any subsidy has been debunked pretty well in this thread (see gradstudent77's posts). I don't see how it makes sense to put mass transit at a disadvantage to using the road (by subsidizing one and not the other), especially when you don't even begin to account for the externalities involved (e.g. by not making road users pay for their emissions)

Regarding power generation -- if gas used for that were subject to higher taxes, they would have the option to move to other sources of energy.

[shorebaby]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

Thats unfair to the 1.5 million who do , they could cut service on many lines. But Raising fares is unjust. How would you like it if they raising Parking fees and permits in Hoboken by 25%? Just becuz you don't use it doesn't mean you should pay for it. Should I pay for Road up keep in Hoboken?



It does in some parts , and thats a reason why its not two way its full length.

How is unfair? You are paying for what you consume, why should I pay for your transportation?

I park in a garage and rates have gone up, would you like to kick in?

You don't pay for road upkeep in Hoboken, you pay for road upkeep in your neighborhood.

By the way they did raise property taxes in Hoboken by 48% and I think your town should subsidize my city's profligate spending.

[shorebaby]

Originally Posted by elflord1973

Your car payments don't come close to covering the cost of your commute. "Everybody pay their own way" is a catchy slogan, but it's not a very practical way to pay for the roads.

Again, the idea that road users don't get any subsidy has been debunked pretty well in this thread (see gradstudent77's posts). I don't see how it makes sense to put mass transit at a disadvantage to using the road (by subsidizing one and not the other), especially when you don't even begin to account for the externalities involved (e.g. by not making road users pay for their emissions)

Regarding power generation -- if gas used for that were subject to higher taxes, they would have the option to move to other sources of energy.

There is no subsidy for road use, that is like saying some people benefit more from roads than others. That is simply untrue, Even if you do not drive you are conveyed over roads by some means, bus, someone elses car etc. Oh and how do you think the food gets to the stores you buy food from?

Of course my car payments don't cover the cost of my commute you forgot to include the taxes I pay, the various fees I pay for the privilege to use a car and tolls. Yeah I would say i pay for my commute and with my mass transit subsidy your commute too.

How is it possible for everybody to subsidize everyone else? Some people by definition would have to pay more than others for a subsidy to exist.

Please outline the alternate fuel sources you have in mind and their impact on the economy and consumer goods. See when you raise fuel taxes you also raise the prices of any good or service that is transported, that would be everything.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by shorebaby

How is unfair? You are paying for what you consume, why should I pay for your transportation?

I park in a garage and rates have gone up, would you like to kick in?

You don't pay for road upkeep in Hoboken, you pay for road upkeep in your neighborhood.

By the way they did raise property taxes in Hoboken by 48% and I think your town should subsidize my city's profligate spending.

I do pay for it , Roads & Highways are subsidized. But they don't return a profit like Mass Transit did , and probably will in the future. This will be hopefully just intill the economy picks up later this year , but thats enough to damage NJT 10 year ridership growth. We were one of the best transit networks in North America , and now Septa looks better then us.