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You guys are rediculess! They are moving US Special Operations Command there??!! What does that have to do with range flying? The fact is New Mexico has the open space for the operations without the electronic and air traffic interferences. It is centrally located and has access to several national level assets in the region to include a state populous that has the highest concentration of Top Secret SCI/SBI clearances in the entire nation. SOC has been operating out of Ft Bragg NC, Miami Mil Community FL, Hunter AAF and McDill AFB FL for years, all of them very high cost area's comparativly speaking. New Mexico has historically regulated its housing cost's in base regions and been OUTSTANDING sponsors of military installations, treating the personell assigned second to no other in the nation, hence our impending retirement to NM. As for range usage, the guy quoting distance to time on target is way off base. look at Barry Goldwater Range in AZ, hundreds of miles away from the bases and wings it supports yet an effective gunnery none the less and never even been looked at for chopping. BRAC is about political clout, military officails are given a percentage to cut and forced to choose what is most and least neaded stat by state and then the recomendations are then tor up by the politicians and he/she with the most clout or best trading stock wins, period. This expresses New Mexico's need to pool together non partisan like and pull for a strong canidate that will have pull in office for the state.
DM is having encroachment problems as it is, how can they expand the mission there without increasing the existing problem? If it wasnt for McCain, DM would be a gonner A10 mission is dying anyhow all that is left is the boneyard.
CannonAdvon, density problem!!! You are far fetched, explain Oh DM at 4000 MSL, Huachuca at 5320 MSL, White Sands at 5000 MSL, All of CO at above 4500, most of Nevada and Utah at over 4000, you are getting worse by the post! The fact remains White Sands mission would be impaired by increased air traffic, that IS a national security problem due to the nature of work conducted on WSMR, Holloman and Site Trinity UAS center, I must laugh, c-130's having problems at 4000, where did you come up with that argument? laughing hard belly laughs! Besides what does SOC need all these aircraft for? SOC aircraft are startegically located with SOC units nationwide Like Pope AFB and McCord AFB
I love it they whine if we make a little noise and whine even louder when we are pulled out because we cannot conduct our training as needed and in todays world you think people would be begging to have it in their back yard! If they are going to be conducting AF SOC training at Cannon then I would find the highest point in the area just so I can sit and watch PUFF in action! I would never get sick of seeing that! CelticLady, We have a full combat attack aviation brigade, Night Stalker Special Ops Aviation, Military Intelligence aviation, Unmanned aviation and the largest deployment center on the east coast here at Hunter, it is very busy here with airplanes as small as a Shadow UAV all the way up to C-5's and 747's, helicopters all day and all night and you do get used to it. My quarters are not far from the runway and near the business end (unpopulated, prevailing take off direction) and I love the air show we get, my guests love the show and most of the city loves hosting this base with only 1 or 2 civil complaints a year. This city treats us well and we love being here and show our appreciation in return by participating in every possible event the city has, sports programs, concerts, shows you name it there are uniforms there and usually a static display if not a fly by. Our personell are intentionally well informed about what Savannah has to offer and encouraged to participate. A primary request in contract extensions and reenlistments is retention at this base despite its high deployment rate, our city loves us and we love being here! I hope to see that more in NM when I get there as it has been my experience at WSMR in the past.
I spoke with former CC's from C-130's that now do C-5 mission and they feel that 4K feet is not a big deal. DH does fighters/heavy acft, not prop jobs, so he did not feel qualified to answer to that issue before.
I take it unpilot is happy with the BRAC decision? Or unhappy with the mission assigned there? I am not following you sorry, been a long day..
winnie, I am very happy with the BRAC as far as NM goes so far and let me be the first Recip in line to tell you 4000 is absolutely no problem for a Spooky SOC AC-130. It's not like a Spooky/Specter is loaded to the hilt with vehicles or anything, they are by design light and manuverable to increase loiter time and fuel burn time. If you live near the base and havnt seen Spooky in action, you are in for a treat, these beasts can put a round in every square inch of a football field in one pass and it is an awsome sight! They are now also arming these birds with accuostic BAT munitions and some have Hellfire rockets mounted also. There are aspects of BRAC that I am against also, heck I am very against the civilianization of military services, it leads to super contractors like HAlliburton/KBR that are nearly untouchable and are champions of fraud waste and abuse. We need to go back to the military supporting all aspects of its own operations, keep all the small facuilities under threat of it will close if things are not changed in "X" amount of time. There are many communities nationwide that have excelent working relationships with bases and keep cost's under control.
winnie, I am very happy with the BRAC as far as NM goes so far and let me be the first Recip in line to tell you 4000 is absolutely no problem for a Spooky SOC AC-130. It's not like a Spooky/Specter is loaded to the hilt with vehicles or anything, they are by design light and manuverable to increase loiter time and fuel burn time.
Moderator cut: rude In fact, the move of the AC-130U to Cannon has been, wait for it, cancelled. The AC-130 is not loaded to the hilt with vehicles. It is loaded with weapons and ammunition.
I don't want to encroach on any kind of OPSEC violation, so I'll just give you a quick google search:
AC-130 performance is marginal at altitudes above 15,000 feet MSL due to high gross weights and aircraft performance limitations. AC-130 operations from Forward Operating Bases with high field elevations and/or high density altitudes require analysis by gunship planners for mission limitations.
Without redicule?..whatever that is. Or did you perhaps mean ridiculous?
You could at least pretend to be literate before you come after me. I also find your McChord and Pope references laughable. You obviously have no clue about that, which you speak.
DM is having encroachment problems as it is, how can they expand the mission there without increasing the existing problem? If it wasnt for McCain, DM would be a gonner A10 mission is dying anyhow all that is left is the boneyard.
Talk about someone that gets better with every post!
A-10 to get new wings in 20-year extended life upgrade
The US Air Force plans to replace the wings on its oldest Fairchild A-10s, in a move to keep its fleet of 356 of the ground-attack aircraft operational until 2028.
Another gem of yours:
As for range usage, the guy quoting distance to time on target is way off base.
Why don't you correct me then. I mean, I've only been doing this for 8+ years, so why don't you school me on my aircraft.
Last edited by CannonAdvon; 09-28-2006 at 01:03 AM..
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