Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin Bent
Seriously, EP -- look at the map at YOUR link -- the enlarged view -- isn't that Santa Fe sitting right on the boundary or 6a and 6b? Maybe there is something wrong with their ZIP code finder?.
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Maybe so.
Devin, again my friend, look at my previous posts. I at one time compared Santa Fe's winters (temps-wise) to St. Louis' - St. Louis being a 6a zone.
I have also described how I have seen Santa Fe listed by many experts, gardening "pushers" (not drugs, people that like to push plants in zones a hare out of their conventional range), in that 6a range.
Maybe you could squarely throw Santa Fe in a 6a type of zone. I think on the general maps that you are describing, it is really hard to tell, especially in a very mountainous state like New Mexico where their boundaries are aligned.
All my point really was was that Denver and Santa Fe are similar. That's it! I am not trying to win any "zone" award for Denver at all. In fact, I will again readily admit that SF would probably edge out Denver slightly in a "zone-off".
My point being, there isn't an astronomical difference. Again, check out Santa Fe's average winter temps v. Denver's. While I know you aren't a huge fan of average temps, actually, that is precisely how the whole gardening zones are created and formulated! By those averages.
If you look at the average temps, there just isn't a whole lot of difference between the Mile High City and the City Different.
Whether *technically* Santa Fe is a 5 or a 6 or Denver is a 5a or a 5b, I will not sit and debate because it is pointless. As you indicate, different sites will give different variations. The one I site to me has always been the most trustworthy (outside of the peculiar listing of Alamogordo at a 6a which is way the heck off), lists SF at a 5, but if one can find documentation for a 6a or so, I surely cannot disagree (as again, this is based upon average temps). However, again, based on those average temps, I see very little if any difference between SF and Denver, whereas I see a tremendous difference between them both and Albuquerque.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin Bent
Again, on the map -- is that Denver in 5b but close to 5a?
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Yep, could be. My same "close is close is close" statement holds true here I think too. One could argue for one zone or the other, but at the end of the day, we aren't talking tulips for the purpose of this post. We are talking "comfort" or "temperature preference", and I think a 5a or a 5b is virtually the "same" for those purposes.
Heck, I am in 5b Milwaukee right now, and I will tell you what, in January, it feels a whole lot more a 3a than a 5b!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin Bent
My experience in general is that the Zip Code finders are hit or miss.
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Agreed. But so are all of these sites / maps in general. I stand by my original stance on the issue: Denver is in a 5a-5b type range, and Santa Fe is in a 5-6a type range. Santa Fe would get an ever-so-slight edge, but it would be darn close.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin Bent
For instance -- you have got to believe the Arbor Day Folks, but their Zip code finder will tell you that Santa Fe is 6-7.  |
Actually, I just checked that out at your prodding, and you are right at what they list.
However, the one conclusive statement I will make to these zones / sites is that that is way off (to even come close to listing a 7 for SF). That is gardening absurdety. But don't take my word for it. Contact any horticulturalist / gardener in the SF - ABQ area and ask if anywhere in SF comes close to a 7; they confirm my stark rebuking of that site's claim.
That site also lists Albuquerque as a "6 to 8" which is also off, although not quite so much. They have the "6" right for Albuquerque (1. the foothills of ABQ - east of Tramway, and 2. the very close-to-Rio Grande lowest levels of the Valley) and certainly the "7" of the range right (most of Albuquerque), but sadly to me, there is no where in the city that hits an "8". 8 is Las Cruces, El Paso. 7b? Sometimes, on the good years, in the thermal zones of ABQ. But never really an 8.
Again, we are just kind of pulling hairs here (which I guess is kind of fun for an internet message board!
), but one way that I have been told by gardening experts to "test" a zone on is by judging plants growing in that zone. A "7" could support a Trachy Fortunei (Windmill Palm) palm tree, which you find semi-commonly growing throughout Albuquerque. In Santa Fe, give that sucker one winter and you'll find yourself one dead palm tree. The difference in gardening terms between an average low of 24 and an average low of 15 is astronomical.
ABQ is overall a 7 (even though its bizarrely landscaped range really pits it from a 6 to a 7b); Santa Fe falls in that 5 to 6a range, and Denver that 5a to 5b range. I have seen some very hardy prickly pear being grown in yards in Denver, so 5b does exist there (as 5a generally would not support these varieties if at all).
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05-07-2008, 05:07 PM
EP -- look at the map
I have a stack of books to get rid of and need to find out. After this winter and the cold here, I think I need to check Las Cruces out again for when I retire. Either that or find a place that has a better heating system in the house. I was with friends and their parents and stayed only a few days. I think I prefer the mountain towns--have you been to Silver City? I've never been there but am tempted except I might have to sell pottery to supplement my income when I retire and am concerned about the size. I never made it to White Sands or Carlsbad either. I have friends from WA that want to visit, think I'll corral one of them to do it with me. 
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