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Old 03-15-2009, 09:21 AM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
26,527 posts, read 51,587,820 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highdesertmutz View Post
My aplogies for not replying earlier, I just noticed your reply.

That is what I read in the ABQJournal a week or two ago regarding that no one in the US has been wrongly executed. There are some people who believe execution is wrong to begin with.

Yes, I have do some homework on the subject in the past, in fact I will be on a conference call with a parole board on the east coast at the end of this month regarding a "murder" which occurred about 12 years ago. That's all I'm going to say about that situation.

Wikipedia is pretty good, but the worms are creeping in and adding their slant. Anyone can add to Wikipedia, it is written by voluteers and anyone can edit it. I have contributed to wikipedia in the past and I am almost ashamed to say I surrendered. There are people who have much more time on their hands than I do who can slant and destroy a good thing.

The Wikipedia article does not really show of a situation where a person was wrongfully executed in the US. "It has been presumed that", "might have exonerated" or "doubt has been cast on the forensic"on three different cases does not prove much to me.

The other article? "Wrongly Convicted, Almost Executed" well, I am not saying wrongs have not been committed, but almost being executed is not the same as having been executed.

The ACLU page? Interesting reading, but it does not answer my original question.

I have mixed feeling on the death penalty. I think we should keep the option available.

If you do not remember Terry Clark, the last person executed in New Mexico, you might read the following article.
State executes Terry Clark - News
Daily Lobo Issue date: 11/7/01:

Quote:
SANTA FE - Donita Welch said that Terry Clark got what he deserved Tuesday night after he was executed by lethal injection for abducting, raping and murdering 9-year-old Dena Lynn Gore in 1986.

Welch, a surviving victim of Clark's and a witness to his execution, said she still lives with the horror from the day he abducted her.

"Terry Clark left me for dead when I was 6 years old," she said during a post-execution press conference.

The Office of the Medical Examiner pronounced Terry Clark dead at 7:10 p.m. He was the first person to be executed in New Mexico in 41 years.
In September 1999, a month after the state Supreme Court upheld his second death sentence, Terry Clark dropped his appeals and asked to be executed. A few months later, he changed his mind and resumed his appeals. In March this year, he again dropped his appeals and asked for an execution date.



Rich
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Old 03-15-2009, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,772 posts, read 104,325,455 times
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Rich, I too want to keep the option open. I do believe it should only be used in extreme cases as I have started before, but I do not want to see it revoked altogether..

Tim, interesting thoughts, I don't know if I agree but something to think about..
Nita
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Old 03-15-2009, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,772 posts, read 104,325,455 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy4017 View Post
I don't want to see it repealed, either, but as you pointed out, it's not done right.

It drags on forever. Why does NM take so long, and why do they rarely ever execute?

Texas has gotten better about limiting endless appeals,and shortening the time from sentencing to execution, but even there, it's still far too long.
Cathy,

I have to told but don't know if there is any truth to this, NM is not totally pro execution because of the strong Catholic leanings of so many. This does make sense and even I do not agree I can see the thinking..

Nita
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Old 03-15-2009, 12:56 PM
 
1,763 posts, read 5,985,121 times
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Nita, I'm not sure if I agree either. I just threw them out there to demonstrate that there are alternatives to either "hanging them high" or letting them live a life of modern-day, prison luxury. Too often we think in terms of black/white, vs. the often acceptable grey areas in between.

As far as the Catholic influence in NM, there is no question that it plays a role. The Catechism of the Catholic Church is against abortion, against euthanasia, and against capital punishment. The modern-day church is consistently against the taking of human life. Not all Catholics follow the church's teachings to the letter, but most are influenced by it.
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Old 03-15-2009, 01:54 PM
 
Location: T or C New Mexico
2,600 posts, read 2,316,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Rankin View Post
Nita, I'm not sure if I agree either. I just threw them out there to demonstrate that there are alternatives to either "hanging them high" or letting them live a life of modern-day, prison luxury. Too often we think in terms of black/white, vs. the often acceptable grey areas in between.

As far as the Catholic influence in NM, there is no question that it plays a role. The Catechism of the Catholic Church is against abortion, against euthanasia, and against capital punishment. The modern-day church is consistently against the taking of human life. Not all Catholics follow the church's teachings to the letter, but most are influenced by it.
Tim, I left the catholic church many years ago, when it was evident of their hipocracy. you're correct, not all catholics follow the curriculum or teachings.
I still believe, if our courts and juries pass sentence upon a person to be put to death, they'd better be sure they're executing the right person. if there's even a doubt, that prisoner should be held, at least long enough until any doubt has been removed.
think of it, if Americans still hung cattle thieves, maybe there wouldn't be as much crime as there is today. people who murder other people shouldn't be parolled after 7 years of good behavior behind bars.
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Old 03-15-2009, 01:59 PM
 
Location: Where I live.
9,191 posts, read 21,815,108 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
Cathy,

I have to told but don't know if there is any truth to this, NM is not totally pro execution because of the strong Catholic leanings of so many. This does make sense and even I do not agree I can see the thinking..

Nita
Well, that could definitely play a role, but then you have Texas, which has more Catholics overall (which is logical, since it is vastly larger in population than NM)....yet NM has a greater percentage relative to total population.

Adherents.com: Catholics

But I also think that things are ever so gradually changing nationwide. Texas has the highest number of executions overall, yet a law was recently passed to allow life in prison without parole. Formerly, "life in prison" in Texas meant 40 years. So you could theoretically have an 18-year-old killer eventually getting out to commit more crimes/murders.

Given that few would survive that long in prison, it's unlikely. But my point is......juries now have a choice between the two. Life without parole means exactly that now....no chance of getting back out on the street--hopefully.

I look for CA to also repeal its DP at some point.

But if truth be known, I'd like to see the DP in all 50 states.....with appeals limited to 2, or 5 years, whichever comes first.
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Old 03-15-2009, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,772 posts, read 104,325,455 times
Reputation: 49248
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Rankin View Post
Nita, I'm not sure if I agree either. I just threw them out there to demonstrate that there are alternatives to either "hanging them high" or letting them live a life of modern-day, prison luxury. Too often we think in terms of black/white, vs. the often acceptable grey areas in between.

As far as the Catholic influence in NM, there is no question that it plays a role. The Catechism of the Catholic Church is against abortion, against euthanasia, and against capital punishment. The modern-day church is consistently against the taking of human life. Not all Catholics follow the church's teachings to the letter, but most are influenced by it.
Tim, I would agree with you 100%. I have many Catholic friends that question some of the teachings. Of course I question some of what our church stands for right now as well..

As for putting the murderers on an island and let them suffer the rest of their lives, great idea, use the organs, but the problem: the human rights people would be all over anyone for doing such a thing.

Nita
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Old 03-15-2009, 03:03 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,772 posts, read 104,325,455 times
Reputation: 49248
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy4017 View Post
Well, that could definitely play a role, but then you have Texas, which has more Catholics overall (which is logical, since it is vastly larger in population than NM)....yet NM has a greater percentage relative to total population.

Adherents.com: Catholics

But I also think that things are ever so gradually changing nationwide. Texas has the highest number of executions overall, yet a law was recently passed to allow life in prison without parole. Formerly, "life in prison" in Texas meant 40 years. So you could theoretically have an 18-year-old killer eventually getting out to commit more crimes/murders.

Given that few would survive that long in prison, it's unlikely. But my point is......juries now have a choice between the two. Life without parole means exactly that now....no chance of getting back out on the street--hopefully.

I look for CA to also repeal its DP at some point.

But if truth be known, I'd like to see the DP in all 50 states.....with appeals limited to 2, or 5 years, whichever comes first.
Kathy, I think the difference in TX versus NM is the ratio, more catholics per sq mile in NM. As for Ca appealing it, well what can we expect from Ca?Why is Manson still alive? My view of Ca is less than wonderful, I was born there, rasied there and as you can see do not live there. I will let it go.

Nita
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Old 03-15-2009, 03:16 PM
 
Location: Where I live.
9,191 posts, read 21,815,108 times
Reputation: 4933
Quote:
Originally Posted by nmnita View Post
Kathy, I think the difference in TX versus NM is the ratio, more catholics per sq mile in NM. As for Ca appealing it, well what can we expect from Ca?Why is Manson still alive? My view of Ca is less than wonderful, I was born there, rasied there and as you can see do not live there. I will let it go.

Nita
Well, you're right there. CA is not what it once was. I loved CA for vacationing back in the 1960s as a child, but....not now.
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Old 03-15-2009, 05:21 PM
 
Location: Bella Vista, Ark
77,772 posts, read 104,325,455 times
Reputation: 49248
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy4017 View Post
Well, you're right there. CA is not what it once was. I loved CA for vacationing back in the 1960s as a child, but....not now.
we are going to CA for a week in APril. Actually we will be in Tahoe most of the time. We don't like to visit there anymore, much less want to live there.

Nita
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