U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Louisiana > New Orleans
 [Register]
New Orleans New Orleans - Metairie - Kenner metro area
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Thread summary:

New Orleans: hurricane Katrina, water damage, disaster services , safe area, homes for sale.

Reply Start New Thread
 
Unread 04-29-2007, 10:03 AM
 
1 posts, read 2,793 times
Reputation: 12
Default Can anyone explain???

10 years ago, Grand Forks North Dakota was devastated by storms and floods. I remember the scenes: most of the downtown area on fire and burning down, residential streets and homes badly flooded, etc. Bad stuff. I also remember the people pretty much didn't complain, rolled up their sleeves, and got to work rebuilding their city. There were no murders, almost no looting, no whining for government help, no marches or protests, no Jesse Jackson or anyone talking about conspiracies against the white folks there, etc.
Now, compare this to the behavior of the the local people and politicians in New Orleans after Katrina, which really per capita and per square mile was no worse than the Grand Forks disaster. The people in N.O. are still whining, protesting, and relying on outsiders and the government to come in and get them squared away. Crime is off the charts.
There is alot to think about here. Draw your own conclusions.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Unread 04-29-2007, 11:23 AM
 
155 posts, read 520,693 times
Reputation: 47
While both were disasters, Katrina was a much more catastrophic event.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2007704180428 (broken link)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 04-29-2007, 04:21 PM
 
10 posts, read 258,953 times
Reputation: 57
Do you honestly think a town in North Dakota was as populated as New Orleans?

You don't seem like you have thoroughly thought about this before making your post.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 04-30-2007, 12:57 AM
 
Location: Thibodaux, Louisiana
1 posts, read 2,205 times
Reputation: 20
Hi Tyrone. I am a petroleum engineer and have lived for the past 53 years in a small town very near New Orleans. I love the city and spend much of my free time there. Your perception of the behavior in New Orleans is mostly correct. What you are witnessing is the result of many years of local politicians abusing racial issues in order to develop their political voting base. It all began during the Civil Rights movement in the 60s. Local politicians began targeting the large poverty-stricken black community in New Orleans. Over many years they were given free public housing, food stamps, medical care, and any other services they needed...all in return for getting themselves re-elected to public office. This went on and on for decades. Finally, several generations of government-supported children were raised who were totally dependent on government hand-outs. This was not their fault, that's the only life they knew. Now, as helpless adults, Hurricane Katrina happens. Before the storm, they naturally looked to the government for help...but there was none. After living seven days of horrific post-storm conditions, the government sent busses to transport the storm victims to other cities all over the US. Most were sent to Houston and Atlanta.

The local politicians were in panic mode, not because of the terrible devastation to the city, but because their voting base has been scattered throughout the US. You began hearing the call immediately from them that "we've got to get our people back". Mayor Ray Nagin went to Houston and made his "Chocolate City" speech and then managed to have satellite voting placed in other cities so the displaced "refugees" could vote. That's how he was re-elected. Now, you are still hearing the whining and protesting from politicians, and Jesse Jackson that not enough is being done to rebuild housing and move people back in. That's what this is all about...rebuilding their voting base of dependent people who block-vote for politicians in order to get their government hand-outs.

Unfortunately, you are NOT hearing all of the good things that are happening. There is a tremendous amount of work being done here by hearty people such as you mentioned in North Dakota. You don't hear from those people. They don't whine, protest, or make noise that you would hear in North Dakota. You can't see the vibrant community that is developing in New Orleans from up there. The people that live in New Orleans now are mostly working people who contribute to the community rather than live off of it. But the old politicians are trying to hang on and "get their people back".

You are also correct about the crime. It's bad, really bad! Its worse than I've ever seen it before. However, it is almost entirely drug-related. A dealer begins making a lot of money selling drugs on a particular street corner, another dealer sees this and wants his spot so he kills the first one. Drug deals gone bad, revenge murders, almost all drug-related. Innocent people living out their daily lives are almost never effected by this. but still the murders go on, more than ever before.

You mentioned that looting didn't occur in North Dakota as it did in New Orleans. I think you are probably correct there too. I can't explain why so many of the "refugees" took advantage of the hurricane. I CAN attest to the fact that there was a general disrespect of other people and their property among those left behind.

I hope this answered your questions and gave you a better understanding of the political/racial dynamics happening here.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 04-30-2007, 01:23 AM
 
Location: FL
1,318 posts, read 3,805,363 times
Reputation: 776
Moxy - Wow what an awesome post! Thank you for sharing that info - which I tend to take at face value since you're THERE! Pos rep for you my friend! Welcome to the boards (careful - VERY addicting! ) - hope to hear more from you!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 04-30-2007, 04:40 AM
 
Location: Red River valley ND/MN
3,350 posts, read 4,530,416 times
Reputation: 2018
Moxy --

I live in East Grand Forks, MN and work in Grand Forks for the National Weather Service. I came here in 1998, just after the flood, but because of my job I became quickly aware of the flood. We just have our 10th anniversary and our fair town had a "Thank You America" celebration. Both cities are back to above pre-flood population.

I have a friend at work and he and his wife were both raised in the New Orleans area....she in the city and he just west of the city in I think Jefferson Parish. They have many family relatives still in the area. They have been up here for nearly 20 years. But he describes the situation down there as exactly as you described in terms of local politicians and the history of corruption in the Louisiana government as a whole. A segment of the population was brought up always depending on the government to help them and therefore had lost any of the their normal "pull yourself up from the boot straps" mentality.

Up here in our area, people tend to avoid government involvement in their lives if at all possible and prefer to rely on friends and family to help them out. Early pioneers had a hard life here in the Plains with cold winters and sometimes drought in the summers. Plus immigrants to here were mostly Norwegians and Germans and both are very proud stock who will not admit to asking for help (just like my in-laws). So you got two areas with different backgrounds in terms of the past. It also helped that in 1997, there was no big national story to take away the limelight...there was a different FEMA director, and we had two strong Mayors who worked together instead of oppoisite each other. They had to make tough choices, as many homes were torn down to make way for the levee system now in place.

One correction...there was no looting period. I would never think of doing such a thing to another person....we are here to help others not to take from them.

Of course Grand Forks pop is not New Orleans...so you can only compare so much.

Dan
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 04-30-2007, 08:00 AM
 
Location: Louisiana
45 posts, read 158,675 times
Reputation: 26
New Orleans has over a milion people in a titsy bitsy area. Not to metion they are below sea level!!!! In years to come it probably won't even be there due to that, it will be under the sea! Have you even beeen to NO? It doesn't sound like it?...They say this is the owrst disater so far in history beacuse it is the record storm for damage! Billions and billions of dollars of lost everything. You should watch more tv and see the city before you say something that dumb. No I have not seen SD, but they are going by history and Katrina is the most horrible so far. All these things are, but this one is just huge!!!






Quote:
Originally Posted by tyronejones View Post
10 years ago, Grand Forks North Dakota was devastated by storms and floods. I remember the scenes: most of the downtown area on fire and burning down, residential streets and homes badly flooded, etc. Bad stuff. I also remember the people pretty much didn't complain, rolled up their sleeves, and got to work rebuilding their city. There were no murders, almost no looting, no whining for government help, no marches or protests, no Jesse Jackson or anyone talking about conspiracies against the white folks there, etc.
Now, compare this to the behavior of the the local people and politicians in New Orleans after Katrina, which really per capita and per square mile was no worse than the Grand Forks disaster. The people in N.O. are still whining, protesting, and relying on outsiders and the government to come in and get them squared away. Crime is off the charts.
There is alot to think about here. Draw your own conclusions.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 05-02-2007, 04:07 PM
 
450 posts, read 1,291,268 times
Reputation: 264
Default New Orleans and Grand Forks? Sort of apples and oranges.

There is no excuse for looting and the crime in New Orleans and corruption is long-documented. Having said that, I lived in Grand Forks for 3 years in the 1970s and it is definitely not New Orleans!

The per capita income in Grand Forks is much higher than in the Big Easy. People have cars and other places to go--family--to get away from the flood waters. It is a much smaller town and the magnitude of the disaster is drastically greater in New Orleans. A big part of the downtown area of Grand Forks actually burned down after being flooded--but hardly anyone actually lived in the downtown.

Much of actual downtown New Orleans did not flood and there were no big fires--but large residential districts did go underwater--places where tens of thousands actually lived. Many had no cars or means of transportation to escape. Many were too poor to go anywhere.

Let me tell you a story of someone I know from the Biloxi, Mississippi, area. He told me that some of his employees came to him before Katrina hit and asked for an advance on their pay so they could buy gas to leave town. You see, Katrina arrived before pay day at the end of the week. Here were people living hand-to-mouth.

You don't have folks like that in Grand Forks, North Dakota. And in New Orleans many had no cars and, yes, many were on welfare and had no job or no place to go whatsoever! Now, that still does not defend the crime and sense of dependency on Big Brother government that generational welfare recipients have--but it does put a few things in perspective.

Sooo--the lesson to be learned is one of poverty and welfare dependency that put thousands of people in the position that they could do very little for themselves. Most of us have no idea what it is like to be poor and powerless. North Dakotans are self-reliant cause they are neither poor nor powerless. That said, New Orleans needs to be cleaned up--physically and spiritually--economically and morally--fun and games must co-exist with social responsibility. Let the good times roll and people work as hard as they party!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 05-02-2007, 06:56 PM
 
Location: Not tied down... maybe later! *rawr*
2,689 posts, read 4,102,766 times
Reputation: 4243
Quote:
Originally Posted by CiCi23 View Post
New Orleans has over a milion people in a titsy bitsy area. Not to metion they are below sea level!!!! In years to come it probably won't even be there due to that, it will be under the sea! Have you even beeen to NO? It doesn't sound like it?...They say this is the owrst disater so far in history beacuse it is the record storm for damage! Billions and billions of dollars of lost everything. You should watch more tv and see the city before you say something that dumb. No I have not seen SD, but they are going by history and Katrina is the most horrible so far. All these things are, but this one is just huge!!!

Having a bad day???

Been to NO many times. The behaviour of it's residents was what was being questioned. Not how many people live there or if the original poster has ever been there. One doesn't have to live there or visit (apparently, seeing as how you've just told someone to watch TV to see the "real" thing) there to understand the problems that city is having. Again, it was the behaviour of the humans that was being compared.


And, good luck with the rebuilding of that town. Been there a month ago. Lots or tearing down; not much building back up. Homes destroyed by Katrina; gutted and have a "For Sale" sign on them and they're asking $72,000. Interestting how that same house, prior to Katrina, was appraised at $33,000. Not too many people will be clamouring to get a gutted $70,000 home and put $100 grand into it making it liveable and the remaining neigborhood still looks like crap and homes will still be appraised at well under what it cost to buy them and rebuild/ remodel them. *just shaking my head*

But I do wish NO the best. I hope it gets it's act together. Fun town to visit and it's surrounding areas are on our list of possible places to move.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Unread 05-02-2007, 07:01 PM
 
Location: Not tied down... maybe later! *rawr*
2,689 posts, read 4,102,766 times
Reputation: 4243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurt View Post
Most of us have no idea what it is like to be poor and powerless.
And even more of us have our priorities in better shape than to think that armloads of Nike's are an important item to loot when you've just lost everthing you once owned.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Options
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2011 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram

Over $74,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Louisiana > New Orleans

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top