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Old 06-21-2007, 04:57 PM
 
119 posts, read 617,974 times
Reputation: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by briarwood View Post
People who hate yuppies are jealous of them. Many NYers don't remember the 1970s and therefore think crime/decline either doesn't exist or is a joke. People forget there's a lot worse than "Yuppies" that could be invading the "hood".


Some think they're all white (PS: Not true), so there's the race set. Some hate the fact they're wealthy. And others just have truly miserable lives so they ***** about it.
Oh, come on.

Just because a neighborhood isn't hip or gentrified or upper-class, doesn't make it ghetto!!!!!!! There are gray areas. Excuse me if I'm wrong--really--but that's the conclusion you seem to be drawing.

And the kind of yuppies *I* hate DO NOT work for ANY of the "finer things" they enjoy.

And I'd like to have this opinion without being labeled a commie, thanks.
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Old 06-21-2007, 05:55 PM
 
434 posts, read 1,067,326 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woofenstein View Post
Oh, come on.

Just because a neighborhood isn't hip or gentrified or upper-class, doesn't make it ghetto!!!!!!! There are gray areas. Excuse me if I'm wrong--really--but that's the conclusion you seem to be drawing.

And the kind of yuppies *I* hate DO NOT work for ANY of the "finer things" they enjoy.

And I'd like to have this opinion without being labeled a commie, thanks.
Don't get it twisted. I love Black/Hispanic hoods. I also love Middle class/Working class hoods. One of my favorite areas is St Albans. A georgeous Black area. I want to buy in there someday.


However, let's talk some truth here, the middle class in this country is disappearing. So let's stop blaming the "yuppies". Also, people forget that all of Queens is Middle-class and nice. Same with southern Brooklyn. That's also not where the gentrification comes from. Most gentrification is happening in pretty bad areas. As a result, I see it as a good thing. All of you wax poetic about graffiti on the trains, "grittiness" and "flavor" not realizing poverty and crime cause this. Nobody here says "oh, let's talk saving Bensonhurst". No, it's more like "Keep the ghetto ghetto".

Change happens. Nobody gave a damn when the entire Bronx got burnt down in the 1960s and early 70s. But noooo...."yuppies" are bad.
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Old 06-21-2007, 06:18 PM
 
2 posts, read 10,053 times
Reputation: 13
yuppies are only "hateable" when they are not humble and see differnces before similarities between them and other people. Others may find them annoying because their concerns (ie inheritance taxes) aren't the same as less fortunate (financial aide for school, paying back student loans.)
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Old 06-21-2007, 06:28 PM
 
Location: ♥State of the heart♥
1,117 posts, read 3,158,209 times
Reputation: 780
Quote:
Originally Posted by BovinaCowHateWindTurbines View Post
I think people have this image of yuppies.


YouTube - NightFlight yuppie rap

When I saw this post I guess sheep came to mind first.
Lord how I miss the '80's....
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Old 06-22-2007, 09:03 PM
 
119 posts, read 617,974 times
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Oh, and another reason people hate yuppies...

There are ramifications of gentrification other than what we see here in the city.

Some may say that gentrification creates better, safer neighborhoods. But when people decide to move to working-class neighborhoods for whatever frivolous reason, they raise property taxes. One result is that people find themselves moving upstate to places like Buffalo, Rochester, and Syracuse. There, they place even more stress on the already suffering job market, which increases unemployment.

It's a fact that middle-class New Yorkers are moving upstate because the rent and housing prices are much cheaper there, but they very often end up struggling to find work. One might even argue that gentrification creates ghettos instead of "fixing" them, like with what's going on in Bushwick and what's already happened in Park Slope, etc. So, you see, the effects aren't just in NYC. To boot, working- and middle-class jobs like construction are now often taken by twentysomethings who don't have a family to feed but need to pay rent on that awesome Bushwick loft. This city was built on the backs of blue-collar people who have little place here anymore. So some people, like me, dislike yuppies because they're very often piggybacking on the work of others.
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Old 06-22-2007, 09:06 PM
 
31 posts, read 183,392 times
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Maybe because the yuppie culture is centered around narcissistic greed.
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Old 06-24-2007, 09:20 AM
 
52 posts, read 151,345 times
Reputation: 32
Default Middle Class is the Backbone...

Traditional New York neighborhoods, like the neighborhoods in nearby New Jersey, are not only physical places, but are locuses of interaction, commitment and tradition. Most essentially, they are shared. The local bakery sells cookies and bread because the owner's parents did that- not becuse they went to cullinary school. The reason some people say "dawg" and "cawfee" is because their parents did, their friends do, and everyone else you know does, not because they see it on TV. You learn to either fistfight or explain to your Dad later why you don't have your bike. If you can't identify with any of these things, or if you have a very rational explanation for these behaviors, "values" or cultural phenonema, then most likely, you are probably very much part of the reason the middle class in NYC is shrinking.

People with a sense of entitlement, combined with money and ambition, seek out others like themselves. These couples originate, usually but not exclusively, from outer-boroughs and the midwest, then buy real estate here with an eye to investment. They have one child and send her to local private school. They interact with neighbors on thier own terms, they negotiate the City on their own terms, they tailor their lives on their own terms- they speak with flat accents and correct attitudes. They have opinions on the world but have no ties or encumberances that shape them. Deathly afraid of boredom, they move to the city and reinvent themselves, and then glow with self-indulgent pride.

Yuppies are not merely benevolent modern sucessful people. They are like 19th century carpetbaggers; they are here to make money and then move on; they have scolded your politicians into raising your taxes, increased social programs so they don't feel guilty, encouraged undocumented workers into coming to serve them in their favorite restaraunts.

I have to disagree with the notion that Brooklyn South is still middle class. Hasn't been in 20 years. Read "Canarsie" for what happened to the last working class neighborhood.
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Old 06-24-2007, 09:44 AM
 
Location: 32082/07716/10028
1,346 posts, read 157,497 times
Reputation: 167
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackson99 View Post
Traditional New York neighborhoods, like the neighborhoods in nearby New Jersey, are not only physical places, but are locuses of interaction, commitment and tradition. Most essentially, they are shared. The local bakery sells cookies and bread because the owner's parents did that- not becuse they went to cullinary school. The reason some people say "dawg" and "cawfee" is because their parents did, their friends do, and everyone else you know does, not because they see it on TV. You learn to either fistfight or explain to your Dad later why you don't have your bike. If you can't identify with any of these things, or if you have a very rational explanation for these behaviors, "values" or cultural phenonema, then most likely, you are probably very much part of the reason the middle class in NYC is shrinking.

the middle class in NYC is shrinking for many reasons, none include your conclusion.
Some of the reasons the middle class is shrinking is because it is difficult to live a comfortable life on a middle class salary in NYC, everything is expensive and the middle class is competing with the upper class that can afford to pay more for things.

The middle class is leaving because they can buy a better lifestyle outside of NYC and can afford to have some of the things that costs would prohibit them from having in NYC.

The middle class is leaving because it seems that they are the forgotten class in NYC, so much of the efforts of the government is focused on the lower classes that the middle gets little in "free" services.

The middle class is leaving because the schools for their children are not doing the job of educating, see above re: government focus, too many resources are poured into the bottom end of the pool, and the upper end can buy out of the public schools and the middle gets shafted.

The middle is leaving because they are tired of dealing with the problems associated with high density urban living, while not being able to afford the benefits of that lifestyle, in the suburbs, they can find activities that are not over subscribed and are not outrageously priced.

The middle class is leaving because of high taxes imposed on them and the businesses they work for,which forces outward migration.

The middle class is leaving NYC because their jobs have left NYC and they are following their paycheck.

I am sure that I've omitted many more reasons the middle class is abondoning NYC, but these are a few of the leading reasons.
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Old 06-24-2007, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Blankity-blank!
11,441 posts, read 8,908,137 times
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I've grown up in Chicago and seen the influence of yuppies in various neighborhoods.
Like Briarwood says, I think that much what is understood as hate is more jealousy and envy. How many of those who hate yuppies wouldn't love to buy a Mercedes SUV? Or to own prime urban real estate?
It may be very possible that many yuppies have come from blue collar families.
I am not a yuppie, my income is well below that of a yuppie. I am barely above the official poverty level. But I have an intense interest for art, music, literature, world travel.
One positive about yuppies, at least in Chicago, is that they keep the city core from rotting away. Yes, the neighborhoods become more bland and sterile, but it's better than decay.
Yuppies support the artsy-fartsy side of a city's culture, which isn't all bad. Blue collars have little interest in culture, so you can't expect them to be supportive of an artsy-fartsy events. That would make a city more boring.
I prefer to live in "normal" neighborhoods, instead of yuppie areas.
I have nothing against yuppies as long as they don't try to identify with the working class. If you have a wad of money, drive a BMW, go to Vail in winter, or whatever, that's fine with me. I don't envy any of it. I also don't have a grudge against those who do these things.
I have no problems having a beer with a yuppie and conversing about mutual interests, maybe such as art, travel, etc. As long as the interests are genuine. And as long as the yuppie doesn't want to limit the conversation to investing, buying expensive homes/condos, or boasting about other topics which are exclusive to yuppies.
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Old 06-25-2007, 05:15 AM
 
52 posts, read 151,345 times
Reputation: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by kort677 View Post
the middle class in NYC is shrinking for many reasons, none include your conclusion.
Some of the reasons the middle class is shrinking is because it is difficult to live a comfortable life on a middle class salary in NYC, everything is expensive and the middle class is competing with the upper class that can afford to pay more for things.

The middle class is leaving because they can buy a better lifestyle outside of NYC and can afford to have some of the things that costs would prohibit them from having in NYC.

The middle class is leaving because it seems that they are the forgotten class in NYC, so much of the efforts of the government is focused on the lower classes that the middle gets little in "free" services.

The middle class is leaving because the schools for their children are not doing the job of educating, see above re: government focus, too many resources are poured into the bottom end of the pool, and the upper end can buy out of the public schools and the middle gets shafted.

The middle is leaving because they are tired of dealing with the problems associated with high density urban living, while not being able to afford the benefits of that lifestyle, in the suburbs, they can find activities that are not over subscribed and are not outrageously priced.

The middle class is leaving because of high taxes imposed on them and the businesses they work for,which forces outward migration.

The middle class is leaving NYC because their jobs have left NYC and they are following their paycheck.

I am sure that I've omitted many more reasons the middle class is abondoning NYC, but these are a few of the leading reasons.

This is a long list of reasons individuals give for moving in general, but the underlying causes of the middle class leaving NYC are still open. So yes, the middle class has left NYC because of high taxes, higher paying jobs, affordable housing, better schools, and quality of life.

The question is WHY NYC is like that. The city used to sustain a vibrant and thriving working class in five boroughs. This is what makes it different from anywhere else in the US. Now it sustains yuppies and a lower class that thinks it can afford a middle class lifestyle off the government's dime. The rich have always been around, as the poor. The new breed of Neveau riche- the Mcyuppie-hipster found flocking to Brooklyn Heights and the LES, that's new. They're MCYup because, like McDonalds, they are the same everywhere, Ann Arbor to Austin to Astoria- just generic, Democratic, overeducated, individualistic, materialistic SUV lovin' rootless folks who turn their new neighborhood into a grownup version of Disney's Small World. Sure, they're nice. Even some of my friends are yuppies. But how deep can roots go in a new neighborhood with one child and no extended family? And that person wants to be on the school board, the community board and the borough steering committee?
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