Why I won't ever move to NYC (New York, Yonkers: 2015, apartments)

[brooklynborndad]

"I'm not defensive about my choice, I know I did the right thing for me. I just get frustrated with the tone on this board when anyone points out the drawbacks of NYC. I spend a lot of time on the Mass. and Boston boards. "

really, the boston board posters must be politer than I recall most people from Boston being. Frankly there are folks all over this site who come into a board to trash the place, for all kinds of reasons. I find that behavior aggravating in all cases, and I think they all deserve a good verbal walloping, whether they are trashing Boston, NY, SF, etc for prices, or the south for being "backward" or the midwest for "killing jobs with socialism" or whatever the hell else they are going on about. NYers may be a bit less shy about putting trolls in their place, and I say more power to em.

The tone of the OP was uncalled for, and with a few exceptions, the responses were appropriate.

And its very hard to convert a thread that starts with an OP like that into a reasoned discussion of related issues - I think thats true across the internets. The OP and the direct responses necessary to it tend to poison everything else.

[bluedog2]

Originally Posted by starfox68

Here let's assume some things and maybe you can give me some places:

-Assume commute to NJ, around Morris Park maybe.
-Looking for a neighborhood that a good amount of Professionals in 20s 30s 40s with local bars a step up from the having budlite on tap but atleast two steps down being a martini bar place to be seen in NYC, local music, nice grocery store, like that.
-Assume we'd probably want to be in BK, I'm guessing that NYC doesn't have any neighborhood below 96th st that aren't snobby, although I feel like Morningside Heights could what we kind of want especially with the influence on the University, much like where we live now
- Assumed we'd want to buy a condo for at most 500k, and would hope that price would get us a 2BR with around 1000sf.

Does this place exist? I know I'm pretty picky but I had some pretty crappy experiences living in various neighborhoods in Boston where we just didn't feel at home, so if I were to go to NYC I'd want to nail down the perfect spot.

Well,forget Brooklyn and Queens because nobody with their head screwed on would commute from either place to New Jersey.
Bronx might be better because of access to GW Bridge.Riverdale?Woodlawn ?Morningside Heights?Parts of Harlem ?

Again though,why are you not considering NJ itself ? Hoboken,Jersey City.Both are closer to midtown than any of the other places and the commute would be a snap since you are already on that side of the river.

[holden125]

Originally Posted by brooklynborndad

Whats somerville like these days? My views on it are somewhat dated. I assume somewhat gentrified but not too snobbish?

There aren't any triple decker areas in NYC I know of. It does sound like maybe Windsor Terrace might be up your alley, though not an ideal commute to NJ.

I wonder if there arent some other towns in NJ that might fill the bill, that are older and more funky but not so yuppified or expensive as Hoboken. Theres been some expansion of transit in NJ lately, so maybe more towns that I am not aware of.

It would really depend on the jobs location.

You're right about the western side of Somerville. Still a little gritty on the east side but they're planning a subway expansion that may change things.

Just to jump back to the income comparison question. For what it's worth, one of those cost-of-living sites indicates that Boston pre-tax salaries tend to be 5.8 percent lower than NY and COL is 18.2 percent lower.

To starfox68: Brooklynborndad is 100% right. You really need to know where the job is before you figure out where you want to live. A neighborhood can be a great commute to one workplace and hellish to another. That's true in Boston, but much more so in NYC, because it's so big and dense. I would be very reluctant to commute from Kew Gardens or Bay Ridge to Bergen County or Westchester, for example.

That said, Windsor Terrace sounds like a neighborhood you might like. Maybe what they call the "South Slope" near Greenwood Cemetery. Maybe Clinton Hill, Kensington. Bay Ridge. Parts of Astoria, the Jackson Heights historic district, near Fort Washington Park, parts of JC. But most of these places are still more expensive to buy RE in than Somerville or North Cambridge.

If you go out farther into NJ, Rutherford's kind of nice. Montclair and Maplewood a little more cosmpolitan, but they're farther from the city by train. In Westchester I like Hastings and Mamaroneck.

[brooklynborndad]

MH is walking distance to Columbia. Unless you are walking distance to harvard or MIT, you arent really in something comparable. And if you are in walking distance to MIT, you arent in something comparable, unless east cambridge has gotten a LOT more intellectually intense as an area (beyond MIT itself) than it used to be.

I think your best best may be something NJ. I am betting there is some town thats your speed somewhere in Bergen or points just West, but I really, really dont know that area. You should ask on the NJ board, or at least a more NJ focused thread on this one.

In Brooklyn, I think there are parts of Windsor Terrace and Sunset Park that might fit. I dont know prices though, so either ask about them specifically, or check out Brownstoner.

That said, if the salary is identical to what you can get in Boston, youre probably still going to be better off in Boston, assuming you like Boston in general close to as much as you like NYC.

[holden125]

Originally Posted by brooklynborndad

really, the boston board posters must be politer than I recall most people from Boston being. Frankly there are folks all over this site who come into a board to trash the place, for all kinds of reasons. I find that behavior aggravating in all cases, and I think they all deserve a good verbal walloping, whether they are trashing Boston, NY, SF, etc for prices, or the south for being "backward" or the midwest for "killing jobs with socialism" or whatever the hell else they are going on about. NYers may be a bit less shy about putting trolls in their place, and I say more power to em.

People on the Boston forum generally are pretty polite. I think people in Boston are polite too as a rule. By polite I don't mean "friendly" in a back-slapping way. There's a cool reserve that has to be overcome.

I don't think people saying NYC or Boston is expensive is the same as the "backward" or "socialist" stuff. A lot of people have lived their lives in ultra-cheap places by comparison. Something about east coast urban life appeals, or they have a job possibility, but then they have sticker shock. If they go beyond unrealistic expectations to "Massachusetts is a dump and nobody should pay this much to live in such a hovel" then the Boston posters push back pretty hard.

But just to point out that NYC is crazy expensive is not necessarily being a "troll." Some people reading the thread might think I'm a troll, but I've got more roots in NYC than many of the people living there now, and I've tried to help many a person find a suitable NYC neighborhood on this very forum. I think some of the responses on this thread weren't appropriate, but that's a personal judgment.

As for our friend starfox, we've gone from "I'll never live in NYC because there's nothing left for normal people like me" to "I don't know much of anything about NYC and it seems super expensive and I don't like snobby neighborhoods, but I really want to live there so please help me." C'mon, man, why didn't you just say that in the first place and save everyone all the trouble?

[holden125]

Originally Posted by SobroGuy

If you want a more AVG middle class/middle America existance of 3,000 sf homes for $250,000, where everyone is just like you, with decent schools, malls galore, and driving miles for a quart of milk, you won't get that in NYC. And that's ok...no need to fault NYC for that. Go be happy in Boston without making false/sarcastic statements about NYC.

This is hardly an accurate description of Boston.

[starfox68]

Sure I guess I don't really know as much about nyc as I thought, but it still seem like I'm about right in saying quality of life would be better elsewhere. That being said I do want to move to NYC but unfortunately it seems like the jobs I would take are too far away to living in the city viable combined with there being only a handful or areas that meet my ideal criteria for a place to live.

Like I said just disappointed.

[crescent22]

I lived in Boston for 10 years; plenty of times visiting New York 3-4 times a year for business I would say, "New York, great to visit, wouldn't want to live here." Then I moved to New York, took 1-2 years to get used to. In those 1-2 years, I told people I like New York fine, but I will never say I miss Boston; Boston is great. Entering my 5th year in New York now, the answer is, "New York is great, Boston is so yesterday for me."

OP thinks Back Bay/Beacon Hill are too pretentious. How could he survive in New York's go-to neighborhoods?

If you don't want to enjoy the greater diversity of restaurants, arts, museums, people interaction that totally natural to New York, then New York isn't for you. There's nothing wrong with that, but if you don't, the city tax and long commutes are certainly not worth it.

OP said in a previous post he just wants a quiet neighborhood with some bars where there's stuff on tap and live music. That he can get in virtually any city in America with population above 200,000. He views finance and media/advertising with disdain. Middle class New Yorkers not in these industries may think that deep down at times when there is something to be outraged about but they innately accept everyone else in New York in this "we're all in it together" mentality, not to mention because high-paying industries support city services so much.

So I'd say stick around in Boston. I would raise my horizons beyond Cambridge and Somerville, but Boston is great for people with a little but not a lot of energy.

[crescent22]

Hey, OP, what's wrong with Park Slope? I was looking at apt prices there- 1100 sq. ft. for $450,000 and only a few hundred maintenance a month- sounds like a dream to me.

[gnboston]

Originally Posted by brooklynborndad

notice how on the Boston side of the ledger EVERY job in the metro area is counted, but on the NYC side only jobs in the city limits. How many high tech jobs are there REALLY in BOSTON. Not that many actually, they are mostly in the suburbs or in Cambridge, right? Boston itself is pretty dominated by the financial sector, IIRC.

But if you include SUBURBS, NYC is much more diverse. Pharma, chemicals, biotech, just to start off.

This is exactly the reason I am looking to leave Boston and move to NYC. I am in high tech and I am having a hell of a time finding a job downtown. It appears that NYC has more high tech jobs in the city limits. Correct me if I am wrong.