Who moves to Harlem? (New York, Hudson: middle-class, rent, high crime)

[scatman]

Originally Posted by Hustla718

Oh God spare us the bull****.

Harlem is a dump. You can live in the nicest new construction, pay $$$ for an apartment, belive in "DIVERSITY!". When you walk out your building and enter the hood, that stick up kid don't give a damn who you are.

If Harlem is such a dump, then why are all the businesses, developers, real estate folk running up there? And why is property skyrocketing?

[BXGEAR]

Originally Posted by scatman

If Harlem is such a dump, then why are all the businesses, developers, real estate folk running up there? And why is property skyrocketing?

Well, the businesses, developers, and real estate folk are forcing change upon helpless residents who do not have political voice. Nor do they own the properties. Poor people generally dont care about "gentrification". They are busy in their own world. Look at Chinatown. It's smack in the middle of downtown and yet the area is a slum.

Bottomline: Don't expect full gentrification of certain neighborhoods. It's unrealistic

[straightshooter]

let's sit on this and evaluate the situation 5 years after all the occupants of the luxury condos in the ghetto have moved in. i bet we'll see a different landscape. first, no one knows who bought those condos. it could be people who intend to move in and live there. it could also be agent/brokers, looking to rent out. i don't have anything to prove it, but i suspect that many real estate transactions in nyc are purely speculative, done without any actual buyer who intends to reside there in mind. second, if we do have 50 mr/mrs whitey's movin on up, we gotta give them 5 years to figure it out before declaring the area...*GENTRIFIED*! let mrs. smith have the passed out drunk she steps over everyday on the way to the 4 train grab her ankle a couple of times. let mr. jones get harassed and cursed at by some teenagers hanging out outside the bodega after coming home late from work a couple nights. let mr. thompson see a body, a drug deal, a stick up, etc. go down a couple times on the street next to his condo a few times. watch how quickly the novelty of "doing the nyc thing", living in an up-n'-comer, and being a frontiersman who represents all the snuggly, we-love-you all, diversity-rocks nonsense goes right out the window.

after the landlord torches the building for the insurance money, at least the city will have an existing structure to buy on the cheap for more section 8 in the area. i hear they need it.

[ParisFR1]

Originally Posted by straightshooter

let's sit on this and evaluate the situation 5 years after all the occupants of the luxury condos in the ghetto have moved in. i bet we'll see a different landscape. first, no one knows who bought those condos. it could be people who intend to move in and live there. it could also be agent/brokers, looking to rent out. i don't have anything to prove it, but i suspect that many real estate transactions in nyc are purely speculative, done without any actual buyer who intends to reside there in mind. second, if we do have 50 mr/mrs whitey's movin on up, we gotta give them 5 years to figure it out before declaring the area...*GENTRIFIED*! let mrs. smith have the passed out drunk she steps over everyday on the way to the 4 train grab her ankle a couple of times. let mr. jones get harassed and cursed at by some teenagers hanging out outside the bodega after coming home late from work a couple nights. let mr. thompson see a body, a drug deal, a stick up, etc. go down a couple times on the street next to his condo a few times. watch how quickly the novelty of "doing the nyc thing", living in an up-n'-comer, and being a frontiersman who represents all the snuggly, we-love-you all, diversity-rocks nonsense goes right out the window.

after the landlord torches the building for the insurance money, at least the city will have an existing structure to buy on the cheap for more section 8 in the area. i hear they need it.

That was funny, but seems so true.

The luxury buildings in Harlem I went to were indeed occupied, 95% of the people I saw in these buildings were white yuppies..walking around with Starbucks and [insert high-end European car] keys in one hand, designer bag/briefcase dangling off the other.

It was so funny to think of the people they had to deal with leaving their building. Rough necks playing dice on the sidewalk, cars blaring music obnoxiously loud, the mean stares. In my opinion, the area was just straight up the hood.

But hey, I guess people do it as you said for the sake of the trendiness of living in an "up-and-coming" diverse neighborhood!

But I agree with some of you guys, complete rip off.

[NooYowkur81]

Originally Posted by ParisFR1

The thread about groups not afraid of the "ghetto" made me think...

I was in New York a few months ago and went to check out this new construction luxury buiding in Harlem.

First of all, the cheapest unit in the building starts at $1.5 million dollars for a one bedroom. The cheapest two bedroom was 2 million. There was a waiting list and the building was almost completely sold out.

When I walked out of the building it seemed to be abundant with drug dealers and crack heads running rampant. Didn't feel safe and friendly at all.

Why are these so popular? Who buys in these numerous minimum $1,000,000 new Harlem apartment buildings? Will Harlem be gentrified in a few years or will it always be this rediculously polarizing? Are the wealthy not afraid of the "ghetto" anymore?

Real Estate in NYC is wacky!

The thing is the same kind of building with the same amenities, etc would be probably twice the price in downtown areas.

On a side note, one thing people are forgetting to mention, is that when gentrification happens and higher income people move in, the level of police service improves in those particular areas. The few blocks that have luxury buildings will more than likely be the safest areas in the neighborhood. The people that live in these buildings live in a bubble. They are rich. They would be idiots to stray too far from where they know its safe.

Because of the "bubble," people can live in a hood and not be fazed by it. The sad truth is that a regular poor person who happens to live in Harlem faces more danger than the type of person I'm describing, yet people could give a rat's ass about the poor guy.

By the way, where was this building? I'm guessing it was probably on the east side, where they have built a few of these luxury condo setups. On the west, most of the gentrification is happening in regular buildings or brownstones.

[Hustla718]

It is not true Harlem and other areas undergoing gentrification get more police coverage then the norm.

What are we gonna do, sit on the building? Those people are on their own. There are only so many cars available, so many officers on footpost. Emergencies get priority above all and there are so many jobs your usually always running around.

Also, cops hate yuppies. They complain too much.

luxury condo in Harlem = gated community. Good luck.

[NooYowkur81]

Originally Posted by Hustla718

It is not true Harlem and other areas undergoing gentrification get more police coverage then the norm.

What are we gonna do, sit on the building? Those people are on their own. There are only so many cars available, so many officers on footpost. Emergencies get priority above all and there are so many jobs your usually always running around.

Also, cops hate yuppies. They complain too much.

luxury condo in Harlem = gated community. Good luck.

No of course your not going to sit right outside the building, but these lux buildings have security and are practically fortresses. Chances are that if a person lives in a lux building they probably don't need to shop or entertain themselves in Harlem too much.

The type of person that lives in one of these Harlem lux places was looking to save a few million but they are still richer than most of us. They live in a bubble, they don't really live in Harlem. When and where are they going to face all this danger people are so worried about? I wouldn't really worry about them too much.

And Hustla you grew up in the hood are you really gonna say on this forum that lower income people get the same level of treatment from the police as higher income people. Come on dude!

Here's an example of one of these places, there are a few more, pretty much all on the east side...

Kalahari Harlem

[Hustla718]

Originally Posted by NooYowkur81

No of course your not going to sit right outside the building, but these lux buildings have security and are practically fortresses. Chances are that if a person lives in a lux building they probably don't need to shop or entertain themselves in Harlem too much.

The type of person that lives in one of these Harlem lux places was looking to save a few million but they are still richer than most of us. They live in a bubble, they don't really live in Harlem. When and where are they going to face all this danger people are so worried about? I wouldn't really worry about them too much.

And Hustla you grew up in the hood are you really gonna say on this forum that lower income people get the same level of treatment from the police as higher income people. Come on dude!

Here's an example of one of these places, there are a few more, pretty much all on the east side...

Kalahari Harlem

That is what I ment by gated community. High strength "tested in the South Bronx" doors. Bars on windows. Alarms. Security. High tech video survaillance. Most buildings have these security features in Harlem, but they don't work. Cameras broken/ripped out. Doors broken. Rooftop Alarms destroyed. Some large complexes have private security. NYCHA buildings have housing cops. In these lux places though, things are extra tight with doormen security. Maintance is most likely priority if these people are paying the rents they are, they better be. If a camera is destroyed, i'm sure these lux buildings repair them quickly. Same goes for doors and alarms.

As for police coverage, the lux buildings get the same coverage as the rest of Harlem. To clear up what I said. No special treatment. Harlem ain't the Upper East Side that's for sure.

[hew2a]

Apologies for somewhat straying from the subject. But I've been wanting to move to NYC for a while now. My dad lived there for 15 years and I visit friends and fam on a regular. It seems to me that this "yuppie" invasion is changing the landscape of the city. I mean, not just with the new buildings, etc. but just the basic "flavor" (if that describes it) of the city. It seems many move from the mid-west or wherever and come with an "idea of New York" that they wish to experience and try to force upon the city or where they live.

I say this because a previous remark about people living in a bubble is something I've been explaining to people and they don't seem to understand.

What are your general feelings towards this influx of "young professionals/students/whtever" who are coming to NYC and populating areas that they wouldn't step foot in if they "really knew" what was up. Or has this always been the case since NYC is such an international magnet? It just seems that in the past 10 years or so, it's gone to a whole other level. Do you feel the "real New York" is getting lost? Or does it even matter?

[NooYowkur81]

A lot of these young people know what's up. It's just that when your young you are much more willing to take risks. Plus there are always those who think its cool to find the next "up and coming neighborhood."

Once the first wave of people do it, it becomes much easier for those that come after.

I have mixed feelings on it. On one hand they improve the safety of areas and bring businesses to areas that would not be serviced otherwise. On the other hand they make life harder for people and local businesses that have been there for years because they drive up the prices. They also are temporary residents and that damages the character of a neighborhood. They stay 3 or 4 years tops until they have a better financial situation and then move out.