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We found a co-op at 116 in Harlem, the seller offered concession, which makes the price 450K for 3 bedrooms. A good deal: the only thing I do not like is the not-so-high ceiling and the high maintenance fee at 2000. With a 2-year- and 2-month-old, schools are of utmost importance. If we pay up the mortgage sooner, we may be able to send them to private schools. But if we decide to move out of NYC in a few years, we may not be able to re-sell it with desirable price increase due to the high maint. And the apartment needs a lot of work: replacing old carpets with wood floors, renovating bath and kitchen. I want to hear other people's views what the best option is: if we keep on renting in Manhattan and purchase real estate outside of boroughs outright in a few years, or go with this co-op in the hope of squeezing out money for private schools or go with a 750K or so condo with no need of renovation that could be easier to re-sell? Both of us work in midtown. Brooklyn Heights would be nice but the property price is already high there.
I know several people with children who are leaving the area ASAP. Quality-of-life issues aside, they did not feel safe walking on the street given the frequent shootings. As one person pointed out to me, when you have a child, it changes everything, I am also responsible for HER safety ! And it is a good point.
There were at least two shootings near a park playground recently.
I would NOT pay 2000/month maintenance. That seems extremely high.
A close friend of mine lives on 116th and Lenox with his wife and two year old daughter. They are happy with the area, and actually own two apartments that they combined into one quite nicely. Even then, their maintenance is 1/5th of that in a nice building. To be honest, when we visit them, I really dislike the area, and don't feel very safe when leaving their apartment at night. Especially in the summer when there are a lot more people on the streets wondering around.
The QOL in that stretch of Harlem -- 116th between 5th and 8th -- isn't all that bad, though it certainly isn't Brooklyn Heights by a long shot. It is not crime free and things will happen, but the chances that they will happen to YOU will be less becuse you're living in a "good" building there with middle class neighbors and probably good security. The nieighborhood definitely has its rough spots, but it is improving with better stores and more middle-class residents than back in the day when we lived nearby. My feeling is that an investment here will probably appreciate over the long term because you won't be the only families priced out of more expensive neighborhoods.
But you are correct in that schooling will be a major issue. My maxim for elementarty schools in NYC: demographics are destiny. Most kids attend their local schools and if the local neighborhood is still mainly poor you'll have a much greater chance of your kid landing in a poorly performing dysfunctional elementary school. It was years ago when we moved, and we did so because we wouldn't send our kids to the local schools and couldn't afford private school tuition.
So I'd say don't go there for that reason. You might luck out and get your kids into a G &T program, a good charter, or a strong out-of-zone school, in which case problem solved. But what if you don't? Getting into a strong private is almost as hard as getting into a good public, and IIRC there aren't even any Catholic elementary schools nearby--if that could be a choice.
Unfortunately its a a real bind. Harlem won't attract more middle calss families until the schools are better, but the schools won't get better unless more middle-classs familes attend. I don't know the answer to that one.
It is one thing to be single, or couple with no children and live in Harlem.
It is another to be a couple, or even single parent that can easily afford private school for their children to live in Harlem.
If you do not fall into one of those catagories why not move into a better area in another boro where there are good schools and other activities for children? Even if the commute is a little longer, it will be better for the children.
For many years these choices have been the real choices for people in Harlem.
I live on the upper east side of manhattan. To be exact on (Park Avenue)
I pay 6,500 USD per month. It's very expensive.
Do you find it's worth it? Is that rent or mortgage + maintenance?
I find for that you can even have a house in Forest Hills with a 25 minute commute and have more space.
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