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Old 04-09-2012, 11:54 AM
 
8,750 posts, read 15,550,014 times
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From my observations, I can tell you that PRs from all classes have been leaving, from the lower class going to areas like Reading, PA to working/middle class going to Florida and Texas. NYC is no longer the prime destination for Islanders, it is in fact Florida, Central Florida specifically, and the numbers prove this. Central Florida has almost as many PRs as NYC, which was triple from a decade ago and that number continues at a steady clip.

Sure there are lots of PRs who are staying in NYC and expanding to middle class (formerly "white") suburban neighborhoods in the 5 boroughs, and this has been happening for decades and accelerating now that the old guard Italians/Irish are dying/retiring and selling their homes. The PR middle class are one of the few populations willing to stay in the 5 boroughs and buy (or rather "trade-up") to middle class districts like Morris Park, Throgs Neck, Pelham Bay, etc...essentially solidfying these communities as new PR enclaves of middle class professionals. And the more Italians/Irish leave/die, the more PR professionals are moving in.

However, the reality is the population is losing political clout here, and the true moneyed crowd is moving enmasse to Central Florida. This is the new epicenter for the PR population, and by 2020 will be the largest population, surpassing the NY Metro area. At this point, the NYC PR population is "matured", they are not having lots of kids, and they are a shadow of themselves..and have been for quite some time.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:01 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Pelham Parkway,The Bronx
8,389 posts, read 19,619,570 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SobroGuy View Post
From my observations, I can tell you that PRs from all classes have been leaving, from the lower class going to areas like Reading, PA to working/middle class going to Florida and Texas. NYC is no longer the prime destination for Islanders, it is in fact Florida, Central Florida specifically, and the numbers prove this. Central Florida has almost as many PRs as NYC, which was triple from a decade ago and that number continues at a steady clip.

Sure there are lots of PRs who are staying in NYC and expanding to middle class (formerly "white") suburban neighborhoods in the 5 boroughs, and this has been happening for decades and accelerating now that the old guard Italians/Irish are dying/retiring and selling their homes. The PR middle class are one of the few populations willing to stay in the 5 boroughs and buy (or rather "trade-up") to middle class districts like Morris Park, Throgs Neck, Pelham Bay, etc...essentially solidfying these communities as new PR enclaves of middle class professionals. And the more Italians/Irish leave/die, the more PR professionals are moving in.

However, the reality is the population is losing political clout here, and the true moneyed crowd is moving enmasse to Central Florida. This is the new epicenter for the PR population, and by 2020 will be the largest population, surpassing the NY Metro area. At this point, the NYC PR population is "matured", they are not having lots of kids, and they are a shadow of themselves..and have been for quite some time.

I hope this means there is a chance of soon dislodging the Puerto Rican mafia that controls Bronx politics and has a stranglehold on the borough.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:10 PM
 
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Well yes and no...unfortunately I suspect even if the PR mafia which controlls the Bronx politics is dislodged, it will likely be replaced with a new mafia, likely Dominicans. Remember, PRs simply replaced the prior corrupt Italian politicians...who replaced the prior corrupt Irish, and so on. So corrupt Dominicans will likely replace the current crop of PR mafiasos....and so the game goes on.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:14 PM
 
Location: NYC
2,296 posts, read 4,511,458 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SobroGuy View Post
Sure there are lots of PRs who are staying in NYC and expanding to middle class (formerly "white") suburban neighborhoods in the 5 boroughs, and this has been happening for decades and accelerating now that the old guard Italians/Irish are dying/retiring and selling their homes. The PR middle class are one of the few populations willing to stay in the 5 boroughs and buy (or rather "trade-up") to middle class districts like Morris Park, Throgs Neck, Pelham Bay, etc...essentially solidfying these communities as new PR enclaves of middle class professionals. And the more Italians/Irish leave/die, the more PR professionals are moving in.
In your opinion, why are Puerto Ricans staying in the 5 boroughs?

Here are some things that may explain why African Americans are NOT staying, despite available housing in middle class neighborhoods throughout the city:

1) Many of these areas have unfavorable "neighborhood memory" for African Americans. For example, ask an African American person, "Tell me what your first thought is when I say, Bensonhurst."

2) Housing laws aside, I believe there is still steering of African Americans to and away from certain neighborhoods. From personal experience, I felt overly scrutinized by realtors when inquiring about certain neighborhoods.

3) Sellers may be reluctant to sell to African Americans but feel differently about Puerto Ricans.

That being the case, the middle class areas of the Bronx might be a good choice for African Americans wishing to stay. I'm considering it myself :-)
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:18 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Pelham Parkway,The Bronx
8,389 posts, read 19,619,570 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SobroGuy View Post
Well yes and no...unfortunately I suspect even if the PR mafia which controlls the Bronx politics is dislodged, it will likely be replaced with a new mafia, likely Dominicans. Remember, PRs simply replaced the prior corrupt Italian politicians...who replaced the prior corrupt Irish, and so on. So corrupt Dominicans will likely replace the current crop of PR mafiasos....and so the game goes on.
Probably right but maybe there aren't enough Dominicans who are actually registered voters.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:29 PM
 
Location: Ridgewood, NY
3,039 posts, read 5,731,308 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SobroGuy View Post
From my observations, I can tell you that PRs from all classes have been leaving, from the lower class going to areas like Reading, PA to working/middle class going to Florida and Texas. NYC is no longer the prime destination for Islanders, it is in fact Florida, Central Florida specifically, and the numbers prove this. Central Florida has almost as many PRs as NYC, which was triple from a decade ago and that number continues at a steady clip.

Sure there are lots of PRs who are staying in NYC and expanding to middle class (formerly "white") suburban neighborhoods in the 5 boroughs, and this has been happening for decades and accelerating now that the old guard Italians/Irish are dying/retiring and selling their homes. The PR middle class are one of the few populations willing to stay in the 5 boroughs and buy (or rather "trade-up") to middle class districts like Morris Park, Throgs Neck, Pelham Bay, etc...essentially solidfying these communities as new PR enclaves of middle class professionals. And the more Italians/Irish leave/die, the more PR professionals are moving in.

However, the reality is the population is losing political clout here, and the true moneyed crowd is moving enmasse to Central Florida. This is the new epicenter for the PR population, and by 2020 will be the largest population, surpassing the NY Metro area. At this point, the NYC PR population is "matured", they are not having lots of kids, and they are a shadow of themselves..and have been for quite some time.
I think you are convinced this is happening and for some odd reason seem to want it to happen rather than really truly being convinced it is happening... Florida is still a ways to go from being equal to NYC in population and now that Puerto Rican folks are no longer moving down to Florida or other areas like they were in previous years, the losses are no longer as dramatic as they were late 90s... More and more you are seeing working class and working middle class folk not move out of the city but rather stay here and move into other working middle class areas...

Is Florida still growing in terms of Puerto Rican population? Absolutely. Is NYC still losing some Puerto Rican folks to other cities down south? I don't doubt it... My only problem with that statement is that it is nowhere near the numbers before... In addition to that, what bluedog says is true... There is something about NYC that so many just can't let go...

@ Queensgrl, same thing goes for Black folk... Many moved down south late 90s to mid 2000s for greener pastures but then realized that the grass isn't always greener on the other side and have decided to move back... Some move and like it over there but for many, down south just isn't for them... And now that they are moving back, they're realizing that racism and prejudice isn't as strong as it was even in the late 90s and they are now able to move into areas that were previously a no go just a few years ago...

The real story about the Puerto Rican population and the Black population specifically the AA population is not about decline but rather about remaining as is... Some will move out, others will move back in while other hispanic and black groups such as West Indian, Haitian, and other African countries as well as Mexican, Ecuadorian, and Dominican will continue to increase the diversity of this city which for as long as we can remember has been a transient city...
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:38 PM
 
Location: NYC
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Originally Posted by anon1 View Post
@ Queensgrl, same thing goes for Black folk... Many moved down south late 90s to mid 2000s for greener pastures but then realized that the grass isn't always greener on the other side and have decided to move back... Some move and like it over there but for many, down south just isn't for them... And now that they are moving back, they're realizing that racism and prejudice isn't as strong as it was even in the late 90s and they are now able to move into areas that were previously a no go just a few years ago...
Yes, that's true. I live in a neighborhood that I would not have considered moving to when I first got my own place in 1991. I only wish I could afford to buy a house somewhere. It's tough on one salary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by anon1 View Post
The real story about the Puerto Rican population and the Black population specifically the AA population is not about decline but rather about remaining as is... Some will move out, others will move back in while other hispanic and black groups such as West Indian, Haitian, and other African countries as well as Mexican, Ecuadorian, and Dominican will continue to increase the diversity of this city which for as long as we can remember has been a transient city...
Yes, very true.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:59 PM
 
8,750 posts, read 15,550,014 times
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Anon we already know from the stats that it is happening, no need to convince anyone. I knew anecdotally about the migration to Pennsylvania and moreso to Florida since the 90s, and the increase since 2000, but the stats only proved what I observed. I personally don't care whether NYC has a high PR population or not...and if they were in fact not moving I would state that. But it is clear that is what is happening.

And again, according to the stats, there are approximately 750K Puerto Ricans in NYC, while there are 700K in Central Florida/Orlando area. So we already know that the populations are already virtually identical. And the population continues to move from NYC to Central Florida, as well as from the Island to Central Florida...so I am not sure why you are choosing not to believe. Sure there will always be the destitute who cannot leave NYC, or the middle class who will stay (like myself) but the TREND is overwhelmingly out of NY and to Central Florida.

The idea that "there is something about NYC that many can't let go" is true for many, but not PRs as a substantial portion of the population was/is living in intergenerational extreme poverty. So that "something about NYC that many can't let go" of is a host of government and city rent, health, and financial programs which allow them to live comfortably. So yeah..many aren't going anywhere b/c they can't, not cuz they don't want to. Those of means (middle class) have been leaving just like every other group of means...nothing new.

Sure some are moving back..but the NET is out of NYC. Again, the trends are clear..I think it is you that just wants to believe whatever it is you want to believe.
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Old 04-09-2012, 01:05 PM
 
Location: NYC
2,296 posts, read 4,511,458 times
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The economy in Florida is fairly stagnant and jobs are not easy to come by. It will be interesting to watch trends into Florida if that continues to be the case.
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Old 04-09-2012, 01:09 PM
 
8,750 posts, read 15,550,014 times
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True, but we should remember that many that are leaving NYC to florida are also retirees who are not going to work, but for leisure. They are picking up homes for dirt cheap, paying them in cash, and living quite comfortably.
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