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Old 02-10-2012, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Beautiful Pelham Parkway,The Bronx
8,404 posts, read 19,750,039 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBoros View Post
Partially true. The other is that all the subway transportation infrastructure was already built before Co-Op City was. The city wasn't taking on new projects during the fiscal crisis years of the 70s, especialyextending the system in the other boros, and I-95 would have made that close to impossible, so it wasn't a priority.

In fact, they were actually doing the opposite, they tore down the 3rd avenue EL in the 70's, which contributed to the blight of the South Bronx as it ran right up 3rd Avenue all the way to Gun Hill Road/White Plains Road. Imagine if it was still there. The Bronx would be a whole different boro.
There was a plan proposed ,when Co Op city was being planned and sold in the 1960's,to extend the 6 train from it's terminus at Pelham Bay Park to Co Op City.The distance is only about 1.5 miles and the extension was to be elevated and along 95.There was talk of building the new train yards on the Co Op City property. At the time,the land was virtually wide open,construction would have been quite fast and easy.In fact,it would still be quite an easy,short and comparatively inexpensive subway extension.

The plan was immediately derided by the developers and buyers for the reason I mentioned.

Around the same time there was even a proposal to possibly create a spur of the 5 line from Baychester Ave and have it terminate at Co Op City as well, with both lines serving the development.

Unfortunately,the "dream" of Co op City was more suburban and car oriented(as everything was then) and they were marketing to people who were trying to escape their urban environment.

Last edited by bluedog2; 02-10-2012 at 04:16 PM..
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Old 02-11-2012, 06:38 AM
 
Location: Manhattan
20,315 posts, read 26,699,902 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironkid1 View Post
50% black 25% Hispanic is the reason co op has no subway is probably the dumbest thing I have ever heard! Jeez you make racism the reason for all your problems huh?

No, just for the lack of subway service to areas with 60,000 people who are primarily black and Hispanic.
I rarely mention racism unless it seems blatantly obvious.
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Old 02-11-2012, 07:40 AM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
5,473 posts, read 9,248,961 times
Reputation: 2411
The Third Ave. el should be the top priority right now.
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Old 02-11-2012, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Planet Earth
3,849 posts, read 7,348,406 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kefir King View Post
1) I doubt that an additional stop anywhere in the BRONX would benefit so many people. There are 60,000 people living in the complex, larger than many cities. That it's NOT served by a subway is bizarre indeed.

2) But I guess a neighborhood that's 50% black and 25% Hispanic slides under the MTA radar.

3) I think more Metro North stops in the City defeat the purpose of quick travel in and out of Manhattan.
1) The Third Avenue corridor, as well as the High Bridge/Morris Heights/University Heights area would benefit more, as those areas are denser. Co-Op City has a population density of roughly 35,000 people per square mile, whereas the two areas in the West Bronx I mentioned have population densities over 60,000 people per square mile.

And the population of Co-Op City is roughly 34,000, not 60,000.

So just going by numbers alone placing a subway station in Morrisania or Morris Heights (both areas have Metro-North service, but that doesn't really help anybody) would help more people than a Co-Op City station would.

2) Actually, it's more like 60% Black and 30% Hispanic nowadays.

3) To be fair, it's useful if you live in The Bronx and commute to Westchester or Connecticut.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedog2 View Post
It is no coincidence that the surviving white ethnic enclaves in NYC share the same transit isolation as Co Op City.It is because the people who inhabit them share the same anti other,anti subway mindset.Many plans to extend subways into various transit poor neighborhoods have been rejected by the residents for this reason.
There are plenty of White neighborhoods along subway lines. Most of the areas along the Brighton Line are predominantly White, and you have areas like Borough Park in Brooklyn and Morris Park in The Bronx. Plus, you have areas that aren't really "ethnic" enclaves like Rego Park and Forest Hills in Queens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBoros View Post
1) Who would want to take the subway or the Metro North, and have to stand all the way into Manhattan, then possibly have to back track to the east side?

2) I can also bet the fare won't be less than $5.50, The Queens stations on the LIRR are already up to $6.25. If the same pricing structure is in effect, it would make metro north, LESS efficient, as people continue to opt for the one seat, cheaper express bus ride, with the ability to free-transfer to subway and bus without paying on top of a monthly commuter pass.
1) The (6) and (5) both serve the East Side.

2) I think the MTA should do what NJ Transit does, and have the commuter rail passes be valid on the local transit systems. So LIRR/MNRR passes should be valid for use on the subway/local bus.
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Old 02-11-2012, 04:14 PM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
19,618 posts, read 33,048,007 times
Reputation: 7764
To settle arguments and provide facts:

Co-op City
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Old 02-11-2012, 04:30 PM
 
12,120 posts, read 27,693,964 times
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what about an MTA shuttle bus that ran on the 24/7

northern part of Co-op City shuttle would go back and forth from the Dyre Avenue station on the #5(would use the Conner Street/Peartree access route in and out)

southern part of Co-op City shuttle would go to the Baychester Avenue or GunHill Rd station on the #5(would use the Bartow/Gun Hill access route in and out)

the point of having 2 shuttles would be because Co-op City is a big place

have maybe 2 pickup points along each route in Co-op City, then just make them so that once they leave Co-op City they go straight to the trains and don't stop anywhere on the streets

I know what you're all gonna say, probably that not that many people in Co-op City would need a 24/7 shuttle to get them to the trains
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Old 02-11-2012, 10:30 PM
 
Location: Planet Earth
3,849 posts, read 7,348,406 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeventhFloor View Post
To settle arguments and provide facts:

Co-op City
They have their facts wrong.

According to the 2010 census, Co-Op City consists of 16,909 housing units which is only slightly off from their number of 15,372. Maybe the page needs to be updated, but that's not the error I'm pointing out. I assume the Census Bureau made it so that Co-Op City filled the entirety of the two census tracts (302 and 462.01)

The population of those two tracts adds up to 35,475. So the number of housing units is correct, but the population is off by almost 15,000, which makes a big difference.

My source is the 2010 census: Mapping the 2010 U.S. Census - NYTimes.com

Zoom into Co-Op City and add up the population of Tracts 302 and 462.01. Then go to "View More Maps", click "Vacant Housing Units in 2010", and then add up the total number of housing units.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlrl View Post
what about an MTA shuttle bus that ran on the 24/7

northern part of Co-op City shuttle would go back and forth from the Dyre Avenue station on the #5(would use the Conner Street/Peartree access route in and out)

southern part of Co-op City shuttle would go to the Baychester Avenue or GunHill Rd station on the #5(would use the Bartow/Gun Hill access route in and out)

the point of having 2 shuttles would be because Co-op City is a big place

have maybe 2 pickup points along each route in Co-op City, then just make them so that once they leave Co-op City they go straight to the trains and don't stop anywhere on the streets

I know what you're all gonna say, probably that not that many people in Co-op City would need a 24/7 shuttle to get them to the trains
Right now, they do have buses that bring them to the subway, though not exactly in the situation you described.

The Bx30 serves the northern part of Co-Op City and goes out through Conner Street (but doesn't run 24/7). The Bx38 goes from Section 5 right out to Gun Hill Road. The Bx28 serves the northern part of Co-Op City and goes out through Gun Hill Road.

At night, the Bx28 serves both halves of Co-Op City and goes out through Gun Hill Road. I think it's the only overnight route in Co-Op City (I don't think the Bx23 runs overnight, which connects to the (6) at Pelham Bay Park)
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Old 02-11-2012, 11:03 PM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
19,618 posts, read 33,048,007 times
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The only sure way to find out the exact number is to go on the Buildings Dept website and find every C of O for each building in Co-Op City, then add up all the units. I trust that over the census.
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Planet Earth
3,849 posts, read 7,348,406 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeventhFloor View Post
The only sure way to find out the exact number is to go on the Buildings Dept website and find every C of O for each building in Co-Op City, then add up all the units. I trust that over the census.
But the thing is that it's not the number of units that we're debating: Both sources say that there are around 16,000 units. It's the population of Co-Op City that is in question, and the Buildings Department wouldn't have that information: Only the Census would.
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:24 AM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
19,618 posts, read 33,048,007 times
Reputation: 7764
Quote:
Originally Posted by checkmatechamp13 View Post
But the thing is that it's not the number of units that we're debating: Both sources say that there are around 16,000 units. It's the population of Co-Op City that is in question, and the Buildings Department wouldn't have that information: Only the Census would.
No prob. we're talking about 2 different things. I realize the actual population is the discrepancy.
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