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Old 04-18-2012, 07:44 AM
 
Location: The Ranch in Olam Haba
23,715 posts, read 28,834,782 times
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That's true to but kids are a reflection of their parents. Poor parenting = ghetto/unruly kids.
Nope. Can't blame all the wrongs on the parents (some but not all). There are unruly kids even in the best of neighborhoods.
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:48 AM
 
2,503 posts, read 4,070,037 times
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Originally Posted by NeilVA View Post
Nope. Can't blame all the wrongs on the parents (some but not all). There are unruly kids even in the best of neighborhoods.
Yes there are but just because you live in a good neighborhood doesn't mean the parents are good parents. You can have a wealthy dis-functional family as well. Who knows what goes on behind closed doors?

It all starts at the home. The home is where the foundation is built. If outside people have more influence on your child, then the parents failed building a solid foundation for their child. The child is considered "weak" and very easily influenced by outsiders.
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Old 04-18-2012, 07:56 AM
 
Location: USA
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ghetto "trash" as well as the snobs who spend
all their time labeling them irk me. I wish they
would all just go do something together.
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Old 04-18-2012, 08:45 AM
 
Location: NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hilltopjay View Post
To tell you the truth, I know nothing about those complexes you mentioned above so I can't comment on them. All I know is that any new "affordable housing" construction being built in the Bronx caters to ghetto low income people. The term "affordable housing" is a buzz word and really code word for subsidized housing. None of these new complexes cater to MIDDLE CLASS folks. Middle class people don't qualify for Section 8 or Welfare. Middle class individuals earn minimum $60K+ a year. Middle class households earn minimum $100K a year. None of these so-called "affordable housing" caters to their needs. And the income criteria they ask for proves that.

The Bronx for instance, needs more middle class households to plant their roots in the neighborhood in order to diversify the income demographic living in the area. These new buildings do nothing to attract that type of clientele. They simply look to rent to the same ghetto low income clientele that's plagued the Bronx for 60 years. If you read other threads on this board about those "affordable housing" complexes, the tenants are already throwing garbage out the window, blasting music, defacing and vandalizing this new building, empty liquor bottles in the hallways, etc. Those issues wouldn't happen if those complexes rented to solid middle income families. But since they prefer to rent to ghetto trash, watch those new buildings turn into the same conditions and issues as the Projects.
Suggestion: Become familiar with them (and others like them) so that you can speak more fluently about the different kinds of housing in NYC. From a conversation I had with someone in the mayor's office, developers aren't interested in middle class housing because there's no profit, and the State can't afford to support their development either, as had been done in the past (60s - 70s - before the crack era - when middle class people had extensive housing choices).

Place the blame where it needs to go. Look at the developers. It's all about greed.
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Old 04-18-2012, 08:56 AM
 
1,566 posts, read 3,036,500 times
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Originally Posted by queensgrl View Post
Suggestion: Become familiar with them (and others like them) so that you can speak more fluently about the different kinds of housing in NYC. From a conversation I had with someone in the mayor's office, developers aren't interested in middle class housing because there's no profit, and the State can't afford to support their development either, as had been done in the past (60s - 70s - before the crack era - when middle class people had extensive housing choices).

Place the blame where it needs to go. Look at the developers. It's all about greed.



I love when people spout nonsense like "its all about greed" as though if they owned buildings where rents were through the roof they would rent them out dirt cheap to random strangers.If it was so easy to make money in real estate everyone would be doing it.
Making money at real estate takes a lot of skill and involves a lot of risk.

In the 70s-80 landlords had to beg people in NYC to rent from them at dirt cheap prices.Tons of them were losing money hand over fist.

If there is "no profit" in middle class developments (not sure if thats true or not) then it is YOU being extremely greedy for expecting people to make and operate these developments at a loss.

Why would anybody in any type of business ever set out to make something that they know they can't make any money on? Oh that's right because self entitled strangers want handouts.

By the way I own zero real estate.
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:03 AM
 
Location: NYC
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Originally Posted by bxlefty23 View Post
I love when people spout nonsense like "its all about greed" as though if they owned buildings where rents were through the roof they would rent them out dirt cheap to random strangers.If it was so easy to make money in real estate everyone would be doing it.
Making money at real estate takes a lot of skill and involves a lot of risk.

In the 70s-80 landlords had to beg people in NYC to rent from them at dirt cheap prices.Tons of them were losing money hand over fist.

If there is "no profit" in middle class developments (not sure if thats true or not) then it is YOU being extremely greedy for expecting people to make and operate these developments at a loss.

Why would anybody in any type of business ever set out to make something that they know they can't make any money on? Oh that's right because self entitled strangers want handouts.

By the way I own zero real estate.
There are no state monies to subsidize middle income housing, which is how it was done in the 60s & 70s. Private investors do not want to get into the business because it isn't as profitable for them as luxury housing.

I'm not going to come on here and toss around theory or my opinion. This was told to me by someone from the mayor's office when I asked why there was so little middle class housing being developed, and the conversation was more specifically about OWNER OCCUPIED housing (co-ops) not rental property.
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:08 AM
 
Location: Ridgewood, NY
3,027 posts, read 6,529,489 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hilltopjay View Post
Yes there are but just because you live in a good neighborhood doesn't mean the parents are good parents. You can have a wealthy dis-functional family as well. Who knows what goes on behind closed doors?

It all starts at the home. The home is where the foundation is built. If outside people have more influence on your child, then the parents failed building a solid foundation for their child. The child is considered "weak" and very easily influenced by outsiders.
This I agree with... And I definitely agree that it is part of the culture of today and the lack of influence parents have on their kids... Unfortunately, we grow up in a society that ridicules parents who discipline their children and so in return you have a growing population of people that are disrespectful to adults, don't care about anyone or anything but themselves and are incapable of working for anything because their parents are too afraid of there kids actually failing at something and learning from it...

Now that being said, this isn't everyone because thankfully this city isn't being completely overrun by hipsters and yuppies like people make it seem and there are many working to working middle class immigrant families moving in that do discipline their children and the reflection of the parents definitely shows in the schools... Many parents from Guyana, Ecuador, Bangladesh, Pakistan, Poland, China, and other African and Caribbean countries I've noticed as well do not hesitate to discipline their child if he/she deserves or let them fail or succeed on their own because the culture in thier countries is far different... In today's society we coddle children to death and then expect them to do well...

It is impossible and that is why these children from other countries outperform the other students who have been here for generations. And unfortunately these children of immigrant families are the ones that are moving out of these neighborhoods and being priced out for hipsters and yuppies who come from the generation of instant gratification and no work ethic... Neighborhoods like Bushwick where many Ecuadorian and Dominican families were priced out and moved to Ridgewood... In Greenpoint, many Polish families were priced out and moved to Maspeth, Glendale or Ridgewood... In Crown Heights a number of Caribbean families were priced out and had to move to areas in Southeast Queens and the list goes on and on... These are the people that are moving out not the ones who depend on government assistance...

Btw, apologies for dragging another conversation into this thread but the response was intended to further suppoer a comment on here I did agree with...
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Old 04-18-2012, 09:19 AM
 
Location: NYC
2,223 posts, read 5,125,540 times
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I agree, anon1
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Old 04-18-2012, 10:37 AM
 
1,566 posts, read 3,036,500 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by queensgrl View Post
There are no state monies to subsidize middle income housing, which is how it was done in the 60s & 70s. Private investors do not want to get into the business because it isn't as profitable for them as luxury housing.

I'm not going to come on here and toss around theory or my opinion. This was told to me by someone from the mayor's office when I asked why there was so little middle class housing being developed, and the conversation was more specifically about OWNER OCCUPIED housing (co-ops) not rental property.

what you say here is true
but you also called developers greedy for not building something they know they can't make a profit on
expecting someone to build something for you when they can't make a profit is being greedy
building/operating something you can't make a profit on is stupid
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Old 04-18-2012, 10:58 AM
 
2,503 posts, read 4,070,037 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by queensgrl View Post
There are no state monies to subsidize middle income housing, which is how it was done in the 60s & 70s. Private investors do not want to get into the business because it isn't as profitable for them as luxury housing.

I'm not going to come on here and toss around theory or my opinion. This was told to me by someone from the mayor's office when I asked why there was so little middle class housing being developed, and the conversation was more specifically about OWNER OCCUPIED housing (co-ops) not rental property.
The sad reality is that what you stated above is TRUE. The politicians who run the city (democrats) make it very difficult and nearly impossible to build MIDDLE CLASS housing.

Reason being.....PROPERTY TAXES and COST OF CONSTRUCTION.

In order for a developer to make a profit in new construction, the developer must either build luxury housing or low income housing. Nothing in between for regular MIDDLE CLASS folks.

Luxury housing generates enough money to pay the super high property taxes as well as the cost of construction.

Middle class housing DOESN'T generate enough income to sustain the cost of construction and high property taxes. So none get built.

Low income housing would normally not generate enough income HOWEVER, the city gives incentives to developers to build low income housing by giving them a tax abatement (significantly discounted property taxes) as well as tax payer money for the construction. So at the end of the day, there is a huge profit to be made in low income housing because the city cuts a deal with the developer, making it a profitable investment.

The downside of building low income housing is an obvious one. More ghetto people moving in, creating a more densely populated area full of low income/ghetto people. Having low income housing being built in your area is NEVER a good thing. I guarantee you there will be an influx of crime and a decrease of quality of life as a result.
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