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Old 04-24-2012, 06:27 AM
 
1,119 posts, read 2,171,377 times
Reputation: 873

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeventhFloor View Post
Now the challenge - if you accept it - is to find a neighborhood like this in the outer boroughs. Manhattan really isn't a great example because it is so condensed, situations like the one you present have a much greater chance of occurring.
There is no other ghetto in NYC has better education opportunity than this. They have some best public schools that rival those in the affluent UES and UWS. As for the top ranking PS 184, year after year, the population of the school failed to reflect the racial make-up of the district. People must put a higher value on education. Change and improvement start within the community, more importantly, within the family. Take the advise from Bill Cosby, Start Parenting.

http://www.cbn.com/media/player/inde...od/EGR136v1_WS
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Old 04-24-2012, 12:25 PM
 
Location: NYC
2,296 posts, read 4,511,458 times
Reputation: 1082
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill83 View Post
There is no other ghetto in NYC has better education opportunity than this. They have some best public schools that rival those in the affluent UES and UWS. As for the top ranking PS 184, year after year, the population of the school failed to reflect the racial make-up of the district. People must put a higher value on education. Change and improvement start within the community, more importantly, within the family. Take the advise from Bill Cosby, Start Parenting.

http://www.cbn.com/media/player/inde...od/EGR136v1_WS
The solution requires that a variety of factors be addressed. Please take a look at the video I posted of Dr. Pedro Noguera.

Also, consider the age of the parents of today's youngest children. Many came through foster care as a result of losing their parents during the crack epidemic and HIV/AIDS. Many never learned to parent themselves. Not making excuses for them ... someone should be helping them understand the realities of parenting and perhaps suggesting that they postpone having kids until they're in a position to be effective.
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Old 04-24-2012, 03:55 PM
 
Location: West Harlem
6,886 posts, read 7,822,965 times
Reputation: 3000
Quote:
Originally Posted by queensgrl View Post
The solution requires that a variety of factors be addressed. Please take a look at the video I posted of Dr. Pedro Noguera.

Also, consider the age of the parents of today's youngest children. Many came through foster care as a result of losing their parents during the crack epidemic and HIV/AIDS. Many never learned to parent themselves. Not making excuses for them ... someone should be helping them understand the realities of parenting and perhaps suggesting that they postpone having kids until they're in a position to be effective.
The vast majority have personality disorders and it is not possible to teach them anything. It was very difficult for me to truly accept this fact, learned from long experience and many failed efforts - mine and those I observed.

First, the general public needs to be protected from many of these people and their unfortunate offspring.

Second, this population should be discouraged from bearing children. Outright prevention would be best, but also impossible from an ethical point of view for many reasons.

The second is the kindest step, the prevention of suffering of more generations of children. There is little to do about too many of those who are already here.

Yes, I understand how unpopular these views will be here. On the other hand, few people have actual experience, instead nursing these romantic notions with little relationship to things as they are in the real world.

Interestingly, these are popular views among the working class people in my neighborhood. They saw the whole crack thing, they observe the results, and they think that there need to be more measures to control the anti-socials - because redemption will be impossible.
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Old 04-24-2012, 03:57 PM
 
Location: West Harlem
6,886 posts, read 7,822,965 times
Reputation: 3000
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill83 View Post
There is no other ghetto in NYC has better education opportunity than this. They have some best public schools that rival those in the affluent UES and UWS. As for the top ranking PS 184, year after year, the population of the school failed to reflect the racial make-up of the district. People must put a higher value on education. Change and improvement start within the community, more importantly, within the family. Take the advise from Bill Cosby, Start Parenting.

http://www.cbn.com/media/player/inde...od/EGR136v1_WS
Completely agree.
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Old 04-24-2012, 05:14 PM
 
Location: Bronx
14,778 posts, read 17,397,072 times
Reputation: 7506
Quote:
Originally Posted by queensgrl View Post
The solution requires that a variety of factors be addressed. Please take a look at the video I posted of Dr. Pedro Noguera.

Also, consider the age of the parents of today's youngest children. Many came through foster care as a result of losing their parents during the crack epidemic and HIV/AIDS. Many never learned to parent themselves. Not making excuses for them ... someone should be helping them understand the realities of parenting and perhaps suggesting that they postpone having kids until they're in a position to be effective.
People in the ghetto need to change their mindset and values, if not they will be stuck in that mindset until they are six feet under. Sadly the government does not want to help poor ghetto because the govt make a profit off of ghetto people from failing schools all the way into jail and welfare offices. Even in the hood people have told me that this area needs more people like me but the truth is I'm trying very hard not to associate with ghetto people from dating to going to the posh parties in the city. So far I'm not a father and have not yet to be locked up and I still live in the hood. It takes strength to avoid ghetto mindset and to reject it. Keep acting ghetto it allows more cops to frisk you, keep having out of wedlock children in the ghetto, father ends up paying child support and the mother has to go to the welfare office for help. Its a sad cycle.
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Old 04-24-2012, 05:26 PM
 
6,963 posts, read 5,436,260 times
Reputation: 3448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlem resident View Post
Completely wrong. The city has taken one similar and nearby building back and they will take this one as well. The process is started.

They did their fellow tenants, many working-class people, in. They are all losing because of the ghetto few.

And, much as I like some of them, the HARDWORKING people you mention allowed this to happen. Why ? "No snitchin'."
In no way were they victimized by the city.
How do you know that they didnt snitch?
Are you so sure that they didnt call 311 to discover that their complaint was filed some where and no one cared to fix the problem of destructive fellow tenants?

I am sure you will admit that way more assistance is provided by the city for the NONWORKING poor than for those who do work, or at least try to. The lower middle clas being completely abandoned.

Why do you think this unproductive poor developed in the first place. It did when it became easier to live off govt rather than supporting one's self through work. Few of these programs are aimed to be a "hanmd up"....most aimed at being a "hand out" and you know this full well.


You will have a tough time convincing me that a MIDDLED AGED WORKING woman isnt more interested in her safety than in any "political" agenda. Or wanting to shield her kids against bad ones from dysfunctional families.

You will also ahve a tough time telling me that these same types who worked with Bill Bratton under Giuliani, helping him drastically reduce open drug dealing, have suddenly become uncooperative under Bloomberg who is way less polarizing and in an environment where there is much less inter ethnic tension. Bill Bratton expressed gratitude many times for the help that he recieved fromk community groups who he creited as playing avital role inj curbing crime in the 90s.



AT THE END OF THE DAY THE CITY NEEDS THOSE LOWER PAID WORKERS. If they become in scarce supply because they were forced to flee down South then it will be more difficult to find people to serve thes efunctions and more expensive on top of that. Tell those working mothers that they will not have any childcare assistance because all the WORKING poor have been forced out. And I can itemize loads of others low paid occupations whicdh are vital to the functioning of this city.

If you think NYC can function with only lawyers and no admin assistance to help them you dream. Just remember that we have reached the point where even policemen and teachers increassingly find NYC unaffordable.

Can you imagine NYC with no cops. The ones who live in teh suburbs increasingly wonder why they should work in the NYC when they can easily find better paying jobs in the suburbs.
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Old 04-24-2012, 05:32 PM
 
6,963 posts, read 5,436,260 times
Reputation: 3448
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
It is so much easier to blame the poor with these things than it is to do actual work to correct the problems that are at hand. If the people that live in these neighborhoods aren't "snitchin" then there is a reason for that. My guess is that they feel like the city won't do anything and then that will make them a target in their own neighborhood....not sure I know anyone who would want to be put in that situation. r.

I agree. Its easy to throw darts at an LPN who is tired of complaining to 311 about disorderly neighbors, and to the cops about illegal activity to see nothing done. Who then cpmes to the realization that "snitching" doesnt seem to achieve anythinhg other than making her a potential target.
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Old 04-24-2012, 05:35 PM
 
6,963 posts, read 5,436,260 times
Reputation: 3448
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlem resident View Post
The vast majority have personality disorders and it is not possible to teach them anything. It was very difficult for me to truly accept this fact, learned from long experience and many failed efforts - mine and those I observed.

First, the general public needs to be protected from many of these people and their unfortunate offspring.

Second, this population should be discouraged from bearing children. Outright prevention would be best, but also impossible from an ethical point of view for many reasons.

The second is the kindest step, the prevention of suffering of more generations of children. There is little to do about too many of those who are already here.

Yes, I understand how unpopular these views will be here. On the other hand, few people have actual experience, instead nursing these romantic notions with little relationship to things as they are in the real world.

Interestingly, these are popular views among the working class people in my neighborhood. They saw the whole crack thing, they observe the results, and they think that there need to be more measures to control the anti-socials - because redemption will be impossible.

AMy question to you. When tenants are seleted for NYCHA or for Section 8 does any one screan eople to keep out the ones with personality issues.

No, its PRECISELY those who get the most help. If one is a drug addict there are a raft of programs to help. If one prefers to live an orderly life and attempt to be as self supportive as possible there are few.

So why be surprised when so many who can behave properly decide to join the dysfunctional?
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Old 04-24-2012, 05:39 PM
 
6,963 posts, read 5,436,260 times
Reputation: 3448
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill83 View Post
There is no other ghetto in NYC has better education opportunity than this. They have some best public schools that rival those in the affluent UES and UWS. As for the top ranking PS 184, year after year, the population of the school failed to reflect the racial make-up of the district. People must put a higher value on education. Change and improvement start within the community, more importantly, within the family. Take the advise from Bill Cosby, Start Parenting.

http://www.cbn.com/media/player/inde...od/EGR136v1_WS

Oh well teh more ambitious working poor/lower middle class are forced out as they cant afford the rent and dont get govt $$$ to pay. Those who know that the more dysfunctional they are the more help they get, and who make it their business to get as much a spossible, supplementing this with illicit earnings...why be shocked? School is of no interest to these people, either for themselves or for their kids.
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Old 05-02-2012, 11:33 AM
 
770 posts, read 890,612 times
Reputation: 529
Default Oh my poor children

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedog2 View Post
And the rosy cheeked children dancing in the streets ?

His memories of the North Bronx back in the good old days don't coincide with my memories of when I used to visit my aunt in Norwood when I was a kid.I remember it as being a lot scarier than it is today.
*************************************************

Please my sons, see the light of reasoned and seasoned memory. Thy lack of wit and spleen does dishonor this forum. Away with thee, thou art banished from all Bronx forums for thy lack of charity and clarity.

Go and sin no more.

Brother Webster Ave
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