U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New York > New York City
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 05-12-2012, 11:41 PM
 
4,911 posts, read 6,847,509 times
Reputation: 4279

Advertisements

Video sums everything up perfectly. Fox news douche is pretty transparent in his views, but nevertheless:



Bono Sawdust - June 13, 2010 - YouTube
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-13-2012, 12:16 AM
 
1,567 posts, read 2,699,768 times
Reputation: 1262
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatman View Post
FYI, I do own property! It is residential. Oh, yeah, the property does NOT negatively affect the environment!

My point has not been addressed one bit, either! My understanding is that these businesses WILL be compensated! The businesses don't want compensation! They want to stay where they are, and keep things the way they are! Staying and keeping things the way they are is bad for the public!

Somebody said it, before: Willets Point is an industrial dump. Add to that declining auto usage! 20-30 years from now, with less and less people using automobiles, how many of those multi-generation businesses are gonna be left?
Compensated with an amount of money they don't want and arent asking for big ****ing deal
If they were being offered what their businesses are worth we wouldnt be having this discussion because they would have sold already
And stop with the environmental nonsense already-these people have had auto shops for years theyre just going to open them somewhere else and the environmental effect with be the same unless the city actually does its jobs

if in 20-30 years a lot less people are driving (not sure where exactly youre getting that from but you might be right) then maybe theyll want to sell their businesses/property

you act like these places are mindlessly causing destruction and waste which they arent-they are providing a valuable service

oh yea and it's THEIR ****ING PROPERTY which you refuse to adress
sorry letting the government steal peoples property and businesses is NOT good for the public at all
It's better than what they did to Japanese people's businesses during WW2 but not by much
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 01:12 AM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
3,076 posts, read 6,160,047 times
Reputation: 1234
Assessing the value of the land is easy.....get an independent appraiser, who will determine the value! When that's done, the land is at a price, the merchants have a choice to take it or leave it! If they take it, it's a done deal, sold! If they don't take it, then there's the next step! If there's a request, the city will determine, with extensive hearings where EVERYBODY is heard, what's best to be done with the land! Fair enough?

Oh, yeah, y'all comparing this to the treatment of the Japanese in WWI. I will respond to that by quoting the eloquent words of Mr. Ed Lover.......COME ON, SON!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 01:23 AM
 
4,911 posts, read 6,847,509 times
Reputation: 4279
I'm not even gonna bother with that *facepalm* of a post.


Did you watch the video up there?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 02:18 AM
 
1,567 posts, read 2,699,768 times
Reputation: 1262
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatman View Post
Assessing the value of the land is easy.....get an independent appraiser, who will determine the value! When that's done, the land is at a price, the merchants have a choice to take it or leave it! If they take it, it's a done deal, sold! If they don't take it, then there's the next step! If there's a request, the city will determine, with extensive hearings where EVERYBODY is heard, what's best to be done with the land! Fair enough?

Oh, yeah, y'all comparing this to the treatment of the Japanese in WWI. I will respond to that by quoting the eloquent words of Mr. Ed Lover.......COME ON, SON!

except appraisals are worthless
land/property is worth what someone is willing to pay if the seller agrees to that price
if it was worthless whatever bull**** price the appraiser is going to come up with already it would have been sold
any appraisal is just someone pulling numbers out of their ass

If they really want these peoples businesses so bad make them a real offer
Oh thats right they cant because if they did they wouldnt be able to make a profit on the new businesses theyre going to open
So basically you want people to be forced to give up their businesses to subsidize the profits of someone else
so no-NOT FAIR ENOUGH
It's sickening you're actually able to justify this
Fair enough is having 2 parties agreeing on a sale price- and if the owner is unwilling to sell too ****ing bad for whoever wants it

I didnt say this was comparable to EVERYTHING the US did to the Japanese in this country during ww2- i said its not quite as bad as what they did to Japanese peoples businesses but its close (again just talking about confiscating their businesses and not anything else done to them)

I agree stealing someones business/property and giving them nothing is worse than stealing it and giving them something but that's not saying much.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
3,076 posts, read 6,160,047 times
Reputation: 1234
Eminent domain has been ruled legal. Y'all know that! Eminent domain happens! The businesses will be compensated, and relocated somewhere else! (can I repeat that again?) Having said what I said, If a road was being built, the property owners would have a better argument against eminent domain, by arguing that roads have negative enviromental impact (gas and fumes emissions). But the property owners have no argument against a development that has many uses and multiple public benefits!

As far an appraiser "pulling numbers out of their ***", if you own property, like I do, you will know that a seller can set whatever price he/she wants! But when that appraiser comes and sets that number, based on his/her appraisal expertise, that's what the price is gonna be! It's not going higher; no bank is going to give out a loan higher than the appraisal price, and a buyer is going to back out of the deal, especially if the seller's price is too much higher than the appraisal! Overpricing the land to stay where you are is NOT gonna work!

So, one would take chop shops that give auto repair discounts over a development of retail, office space and residential housing! OK, y'all!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 11:27 AM
 
1,567 posts, read 2,699,768 times
Reputation: 1262
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatman View Post
Eminent domain has been ruled legal. Y'all know that! Eminent domain happens! The businesses will be compensated, and relocated somewhere else! (can I repeat that again?) Having said what I said, If a road was being built, the property owners would have a better argument against eminent domain, by arguing that roads have negative enviromental impact (gas and fumes emissions). But the property owners have no argument against a development that has many uses and multiple public benefits!

As far an appraiser "pulling numbers out of their ***", if you own property, like I do, you will know that a seller can set whatever price he/she wants! But when that appraiser comes and sets that number, based on his/her appraisal expertise, that's what the price is gonna be! It's not going higher; no bank is going to give out a loan higher than the appraisal price, and a buyer is going to back out of the deal, especially if the seller's price is too much higher than the appraisal! Overpricing the land to stay where you are is NOT gonna work!

So, one would take chop shops that give auto repair discounts over a development of retail, office space and residential housing! OK, y'all!
1)nobody hear said eminent domain is illegal
you would actually have a better argument if it was being taken to build highways not the other way around
Public is for things like roads and highways- not private developers being able to turn a profit by buying land and property at discounted rates because the govt sees fit to steal from people
And even though eminent domain would be legal in a case like this it is still despicably immoral.
I haven't once mentioned anything about whether or not it was legal before this-everything I said was from a moral standpoint.
2)if you really think that's how the price of land is valued the rest of your posts are starting to make more sense because you have zero clue what you are talking about
Properties and businesses are constantly bought and sold at prices that come in at no where near their appraisals
Some sell for way more, some sell for way less
You can "appraise" things at any value you want- but unless someone is willing to sell it at that price AND someone is willing to buy it at that price then it means nothing

The developers are trying to lowball by offering amounts of money that the owners don't want to sell for




So, one would take chop shops that give auto repair discounts over a development of retail, office space and residential housing! OK, y'all!

Yes- its not even close
I will take the current business owners in whatever business they own keeping their property against having someone else take it profiting at their expense

And as a complete aside you trashing these auto businesses is pathetic
They fill a huge need
The fact that so many of them are in such a small area and are able to succeed shows that
You keep mentioning all of this environmental nonsense- but most if not all of these people would just relocate anything so the environmental effect is the same
If you could use logic above the ability of a 5 year old you would see that

I genuinely hope that your property gets taken from you one day when you dont want to leave
You couldnt deserve it more

By the way there have also been cases where property has been seized so your precious developers can steal peoples lands to build whatever they want and then for whatever reason nothing ever gets build at all.

Look up Kelo vs The City of New London
Great Job Supreme court
Steal from people based on promises developers made and never kept
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 01:57 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
3,076 posts, read 6,160,047 times
Reputation: 1234
Quote:
Originally Posted by availableusername View Post
Many many people will tell you how unique and important the area is in terms of getting affordable mechanical and body work done for your vehicle.
This is the only public benefit the Willets Point people can argue! For people who don't own cars, this is irrelevant. For people who need housing, this is irrelevant. For people who need more retail shopping choices, this is irrelevant. For people who need more and/or better office space, this is irrelevant. And for people who have to deal with crowded school systems, this is irrelevant.

On the surface, it looks like a greedy developer destroying longtime businesses. But I ask the question: is eminent domain for private development necessarily a bad thing, if the development benefits a cross-section of the public?

If the developer took the land and made it an upper-class golf course with luxury income condos, then one can understand the point of the Willets Point merchants. It would be a clear case of taking the land from the working class merchants and developing something that only benefits the rich. But it is hard to argue against a development that would feature shopping, mixed-income housing, a school and office space; one that would serve multiple sections of the public and multiple public needs!

Last edited by scatman; 05-13-2012 at 02:11 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 06:22 PM
 
1,567 posts, read 2,699,768 times
Reputation: 1262
If the developer took the land and made it an upper-class golf course with luxury income condos, then one can understand the point of the Willets Point merchants. It would be a clear case of taking the land from the working class merchants and developing something that only benefits the rich. But it is hard to argue against a development that would feature shopping, mixed-income housing, a school and office space; one that would serve multiple sections of the public and multiple public needs!

No its really not- its about people being able to keep what's rightfully theres and not being forced out.You deem office buildings to be better for the public than auto repair shops which somehow in your twisted mind gives people the right to steal from other people.

If Im not in the market for a rental office and Im not working in one of those offices then those offices do me as much good as an auto shop does someone who doesnt need one.

Eminent domain is a terrible thing- for any reason- but specifically in a case where other people are stealing land and property to turn a profit.

Last edited by bxlefty23; 05-13-2012 at 06:49 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 05-13-2012, 09:18 PM
 
Location: Bronx
14,982 posts, read 17,534,449 times
Reputation: 7573
The eminent domain battle for willets point queens reminds me of the eminent domain of the Atlantic Rail yards area between residents vs Bruce Ratner.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:



Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > New York > New York City
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top