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Old 10-17-2007, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
2,806 posts, read 14,969,456 times
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There's definitely tons of potential here. But the crime problems and the Bronx's bad reputation will probably ensure that nothing happens about that well into the future.

 
Old 10-17-2007, 07:18 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
1,526 posts, read 5,058,885 times
Reputation: 299
I think you all know my views--already stated them here and myriad other threads. Suarez was also part of the NYC movie I mentioned. Great analyses.
 
Old 10-18-2007, 07:41 AM
 
11,287 posts, read 16,808,067 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apvbguy View Post
500k people???

where did you get that number from???
in the 60s when that road was built the population of the entire borough was less than 800k.
the actual number of displaced was between 20 to 40k people depending on which activist you believe. most of those buildings taken down were pre war walk ups and tenements, they were not really worth getting upset about. the big problem was relocation and disruption of people's lives. most of the people affected were on the poor side and couldn't afford to move away. the money they were offered was a pittance, nonetheless the benefits of the road far outweighs the costs borne almost 50 years ago
Sorry, meant 50K. Stealth surfing at work has its hazards....

Anyway, the Cross Bronx is deep trench through the heart of the Bronx. You cannot tell me it was not detrimental. As for the buildings, I have ridden the CBE thousands of times and I have noticed a few Art Deco buildings there. Whatever the style, those were stable communities there. It would have been less damaging if they had built it through Westchester, but we know that would not have passed muster with the powers that be (were).

If they ever want to make another Mad Max movie, I cannot think of a better setting then the Cross Bronx.
 
Old 10-18-2007, 08:22 AM
 
Location: Atlantic Highlands NJ/Ponte Vedra FL/NYC
2,689 posts, read 2,847,394 times
Reputation: 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
Sorry, meant 50K. Stealth surfing at work has its hazards....

Anyway, the Cross Bronx is deep trench through the heart of the Bronx. You cannot tell me it was not detrimental. As for the buildings, I have ridden the CBE thousands of times and I have noticed a few Art Deco buildings there. Whatever the style, those were stable communities there. It would have been less damaging if they had built it through Westchester, but we know that would not have passed muster with the powers that be (were).

If they ever want to make another Mad Max movie, I cannot think of a better setting then the Cross Bronx.
you're talking emotion rather than reality. you might have driven by thousands of times but I lived in those buildings, my relatives lived in those buildings, my friends lived in those buildings, I walked and played on those streets. I even remember the blasting of the bedrock to create the CBE, now who do you think knows about the area? a person who drives by or someone who actually lived there? All this talk about neighborhoods being ripped apart and beautiful buildings being destoryed and other romantic nostalgia is just a bunch of hooey

please tell us how you would have routed traffic off the GWB to accommodate traffic going east?
Those buildings you think are so nice were dilapidated 5 story walk ups, and people were already in flight from the bronx. The new at the time housing projects were draining these old buildings of seniors and young people with families were on their way to the 'burbs.
the only people hanging on were the poor and immigrants from PR and DR.

I know it is hard for those looking back in time to understand the dynamics of what happened to the bronx, but blaming moses and the building of the CBE for the fall of the bronx is just a simplistic excuse, there are many more important parts of the equation being ignored by the so called historians.
 
Old 10-18-2007, 09:02 AM
 
11,287 posts, read 16,808,067 times
Reputation: 5517
Quote:
you're talking emotion rather than reality. you might have driven by thousands of times but I lived in those buildings, my relatives lived in those buildings, my friends lived in those buildings, I walked and played on those streets. I even remember the blasting of the bedrock to create the CBE, now who do you think knows about the area? a person who drives by or someone who actually lived there? All this talk about neighborhoods being ripped apart and beautiful buildings being destoryed and other romantic nostalgia is just a bunch of hooey
I reckon not living there, although I used to live north of there, does not preclude one from forming an opinion. In any case, I doubt you speak for all those people. As delapitated as it may have been, and that's just your opinion, digging a trench through those areas effectively prevented it from evolving to something nicer.



Quote:
please tell us how you would have routed traffic off the GWB to accommodate traffic going east?
Those buildings you think are so nice were dilapidated 5 story walk ups, and people were already in flight from the bronx. The new at the time housing projects were draining these old buildings of seniors and young people with families were on their way to the 'burbs.
the only people hanging on were the poor and immigrants from PR and DR.
Tappan Zee maybe. There are always alternatives. Blasting through the core of densely populated areas is madness. One reason my section of DC survived was that this was prevented.

Quote:
I know it is hard for those looking back in time to understand the dynamics of what happened to the bronx, but blaming moses and the building of the CBE for the fall of the bronx is just a simplistic excuse, there are many more important parts of the equation being ignored by the so called historians.
I never soley blamed Moses. I said it was a mixture of several things, some of which you yourself have named.

What were you doing back then? Cheering on the dynamite crews as the blew your neighborhood to bits?
 
Old 10-18-2007, 09:16 AM
 
Location: Atlantic Highlands NJ/Ponte Vedra FL/NYC
2,689 posts, read 2,847,394 times
Reputation: 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
I reckon not living there, although I used to live north of there, does not preclude one from forming an opinion. In any case, I doubt you speak for all those people. As delapitated as it may have been, and that's just your opinion, digging a trench through those areas effectively prevented it from evolving to something nicer.
evolving? the area was devolving, it was in decline, this was the great white flight from the inner cities to the suburbs, there was no upside potential. and the building of the cbe was facilitating this flight from the inner city.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
Tappan Zee maybe. There are always alternatives. Blasting through the core of densely populated areas is madness. One reason my section of DC survived was that this was prevented.
now you're in the realm of kookdom trying to justify your opinion. what you are talking about amounts to a 50 mile detour and you're ignoring the tie ins to the whitestone and throgs neck bridges. If you think about it the economy of the entire region benefited from the building of this road.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
What were you doing back then? Cheering on the dynamite crews as the blew your neighborhood to bits?

and I was singing burn baby burn as what was left was burned to the ground
 
Old 10-18-2007, 09:31 AM
 
11,287 posts, read 16,808,067 times
Reputation: 5517
Quote:
now you're in the realm of kookdom trying to justify your opinion.
And now you are in the realm of obnoxiousness. Your opinions have been duly noted, but have failed to sway me.
 
Old 10-18-2007, 09:59 AM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
3,057 posts, read 6,135,657 times
Reputation: 1229
Quote:
Originally Posted by mead View Post
What? As a white guy I can't walk freely probably in 2/3rds of the Bronx. Nothings changed in that regards, there's just less white people around these days.
And back then, I couldn't freely buy a used car in Bensonhurst, Brooklyn.
 
Old 10-18-2007, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
3,057 posts, read 6,135,657 times
Reputation: 1229
no messages
 
Old 10-18-2007, 10:07 AM
 
230 posts, read 622,627 times
Reputation: 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAS View Post
There is book "The Beautiful Bronx 1920 - 1950" by Lloyd Ultan its mostly photos of everyday life in the Bronx during that period. The entire Bronx was really beautiful during that period no which neighborhood you were in, according to the photos.
One of my most prized books.
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