UK or USA/London or New York? (Madrid: crime, house prices)

[hutch5]

I wonder if anybody could help us with this dilemma. We are a family with 3 children (ages between 1 and 12). My husband has the possibility to choose between a job in London (35.000 British £) or one in Manhattan (95K). In both case we would live in a town outside the big city and the children will be going to State schools.
We have been living for 10 years in England but we have never lived in the States.
I wonder if anybody has had experience of living in both Countries and can offer his/her opinion.
Which of the two places is best to raise the children? Which nation is still holding on a few values? Which one of the two is the most secular? Which school system is best? Which country offer a better quality of family life? Which one can offer better opportunities to the children?

Thank you very much in advance for your help.

[apvbguy]

Originally Posted by hutch5

I wonder if anybody could help us with this dilemma. We are a family with 3 children (ages between 1 and 12). My husband has the possibility to choose between a job in London (35.000 British £) or one in Manhattan (95K). In both case we would live in a town outside the big city and the children will be going to State schools.
We have been living for 10 years in England but we have never lived in the States.
I wonder if anybody has had experience of living in both Countries and can offer his/her opinion.
Which of the two places is best to raise the children? Which nation is still holding on a few values? Which one of the two is the most secular? Which school system is best? Which country offer a better quality of family life? Which one can offer better opportunities to the children?

Thank you very much in advance for your help.

if you do the math 35k bps is about $69k USD, so I would think that be able to make $95k is better than $69k.

Expenses would be similar in both places, lifestyles are quite similar also. I'm from the US so I am biased towards being here but I do know that there are many good things about living in the UK.

it all depends on if you want to uproot yourselves for the opportunity to work in the US or take the lessor money and remain in the UK

[hutch5]

Yes I did notice that the pay is better in NY and I think the weather can only be better. But somehow I am thinking about the big picture. I would like to be able to offer the children more than just a better salary and a better weather although they can help tremendously.

[mead]

I don't know if I would necessarily call the weather better. In London the weather is drab, but somewhat stable (never too hot & never too cold). In NYC it gets quite cold and snowy in the winter and very hot during the summer. Temperature-wise this is a city of extremes.

Originally Posted by hutch5

Yes I did notice that the pay is better in NY and I think the weather can only be better. But somehow I am thinking about the big picture. I would like to be able to offer the children more than just a better salary and a better weather although they can help tremendously.

[PetuniaP]

I lived in London for a short while and I can say that I loved it. But it is a VERY expensive city to live in. I was being subsidized by my company but still....$$$$. Not that NYC is cheap but I gained some appreciation for what things cost here after living in London.

It's hard to for me to choose between the cities because New York is my home and I love it. But if you can afford London, I say go for it. I'd rather raise kids in Europe than in the US. I think the education here isn't as good and kids are spoiled. London in many ways is more cosmopolitan than NYC, and your children will be exposed to more of the world. The US is very self-focused and xenophobic. Plus, Europeans work to live while Americans live to work. I think you will find more time to spend with your kids in London than you will here between the late hours and the commuting.

Besides, I would never recommend NYC weather to anyone.

[straight outta camden]

I'm from London, lived in New York for many years but have since moved on. Those who say New York's weather is worse are right. It is much hotter and more humid than London in the summer, much colder and windier in winter.

I don't know what you mean by "values". Since you go on to ask about secularism, perhaps you want to know which city is more Christian. If so, that's simple: New York. The city is perhaps less Christian than the rest of America (in particular it is less Protestant) but America as a whole is so much more religious than Britain that this difference is outweighed.

State schools, i.e. public schools in New York are even worse than public schools in London, which is saying something. But you are really asking for comparisons between suburbs. That is much more difficult to answer. It depends on the suburb.

I would take $95K in New York over 35 grand in London. But then, I like America. Not everyone does.

[hutch5]

We are currently living in Chelmsford and if we move to NY we would probably live in one of the commuting town in Westchester depending on schools and house prices, so yes, it is and it would be life on the outskirts rather than in the big city as such. Would you say that the State schools are aslo bad outside NYC?
The weather does not worry us that much. We have lived in tropical countries with very hot and humid weather and we have also live in Madrid with cold winters and VERY hot summers. I, by far, prefer that than the week after week of grey and humid weather we get here.
When it comes to values, I, in part meant religion, but also generally how people make their choices, what is transmitted to the younger generations, how important is the family for example? Do you get the drinking problems amongst young people England is experiencing? And the repressed violence that occasionelly explode in to road rage episodes or hooliganism?

[Raffaella]

We are having to take a similar decision. Although we would be coming from Spain and not London, we are asking ourselves similar questions. I wonder if there are any more opinions out there.

[straight outta camden]

Originally Posted by hutch5

When it comes to values, I, in part meant religion, but also generally how people make their choices, what is transmitted to the younger generations, how important is the family for example? Do you get the drinking problems amongst young people England is experiencing? And the repressed violence that occasionelly explode in to road rage episodes or hooliganism?

I would say family is more important to Americans than to Brits. Americans are particularly attached to their grandparents and, in many cases, their great-aunts / uncles. I'm British, and I couldn't tell you the names of my grandparents' siblings, or even how many there are.

As for the drink and drunken violence problem, that is far worse in Britain. Britain is the second-most violent rich country in the world, after Australia. By some measures it is the most violent (see the International Crime Victimisation Survey, now a few years out of date). You are much less likely to be killed in Britain than in America, but you are much, much more likely to be assaulted. America does have a drink problem, of course, but it takes a different form. The main thing to worry about is drunk driving.

Needless to say, though, whether your kids will be safe, family-loving folk has about 5% to do with where they live and 95% to do with how you raise them.

[mead]

Yeah I think drinking in America is very different from what happens in the British Isles. Over there young people and teenagers will get drunk, hang out in the middle of town and cause problems in public.

Here in the USA young people will still get drunk, even though it is illegal unless you are 21 years old, but this will usually occur at home or a friend's home. So generally the kids over here will pass out at some house party or just drive home while drunk (leading to the problem of drunk driving). It is quite unusual to see a group of young drunken people in public in the USA as occurs in Europe. If a group of teenagers of college kids tried doing this in the USA they would probably be arrested by the police.

So I don't necessarily think that the drinking style is that different for young people in the USA compared to Britain, but there are much less social problems associated with this drinking over here, except for the problem of drunk driving.

Originally Posted by straight outta camden

I would say family is more important to Americans than to Brits. Americans are particularly attached to their grandparents and, in many cases, their great-aunts / uncles. I'm British, and I couldn't tell you the names of my grandparents' siblings, or even how many there are.

As for the drink and drunken violence problem, that is far worse in Britain. Britain is the second-most violent rich country in the world, after Australia. By some measures it is the most violent (see the International Crime Victimisation Survey, now a few years out of date). You are much less likely to be killed in Britain than in America, but you are much, much more likely to be assaulted. America does have a drink problem, of course, but it takes a different form. The main thing to worry about is drunk driving.

Needless to say, though, whether your kids will be safe, family-loving folk has about 5% to do with where they live and 95% to do with how you raise them.