Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
NYC will never become a Detroit. It's not Detroit's fault; it's just that it's economy was so dependent on the auto / manufacture sector that when it left Detroit fell too hard too fast.
NYC does have gigantic infrastructure and beauracratic costs but, we have a diverse economy with service, goods and NJ for the dirty industrial stuff. NYC wil never experience the crash that Detroit did because our economy is not that dependant on only one sector.
Dude nearly 40 years ago NYC almost went bankrupt, NYC bond rating was at an all time low and Uncle Sam told NYC to drop dead, this was the beginning of the death of cities in America. Thankfully the Feds allowed NYC to go back in the Bond business and with low interest rates loan so the city can borrow money again. NYC looks like glitter and glimmer to the eyes of immigrants, 20 something Midwestern Transplants who are fleeing rustbelt, and Tourist, but for most New Yorkers living here is a struggle. Also NYC has 120 billion dollars in debt and is still growing and is not sustainable in the long run unless the feds make a new currency. NYC has a diverse industries and business however must salaries pay low with limited to no benefits forcing workers to apply for food stamp, NYCHA housing and Medicaid for health insurance, not good in the longrun. Also the city has to pay workers pensions and healthcare which is billions and billions of dollars and also city workers are working with out a contract from what I hear. NYC has a list of problems with its debt that makes me want to throw up. Its nice having bike lanes but a few feet away roads are full of pot holes that can cause injury, huge waste of money for the city. But overall I do agree with you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude
I mostly agree with you, but never say never. One reason why NYC's economy hasn't had that kind of crash is because planners were AWARE of the DANGERS overreliance on any one sector. Bloomberg thought it dangerous for the city to rely so much on finance, so he heavily pushed development of other sectors. Meaning he saw the possibility of utter disaster, and acted to prevent it.
I agree.
Detroit debt crisis is nothing new and it took years to allow a city like Detroit to go into debt. For those that want to see whats going on in the Midwest I advice you to watch PBS, Also cities need a middle class, this is what you guys on here forget. NYC has a declining middle class which is not healthy for the cities future. Middle class is needed to form a solid tax base. What happened to Detroit is a lesson for all of us and a wakeup call for America to rebuild back its middle class.
Dude nearly 40 years ago NYC almost went bankrupt, NYC bond rating was at an all time low and Uncle Sam told NYC to drop dead, this was the beginning of the death of cities in America. Thankfully the Feds allowed NYC to go back in the Bond business and with low interest rates loan so the city can borrow money again. NYC looks like glitter and glimmer to the eyes of immigrants, 20 something Midwestern Transplants who are fleeing rustbelt, and Tourist, but for most New Yorkers living here is a struggle. Also NYC has 120 billion dollars in debt and is still growing and is not sustainable in the long run unless the feds make a new currency. NYC has a diverse industries and business however must salaries pay low with limited to no benefits forcing workers to apply for food stamp, NYCHA housing and Medicaid for health insurance, not good in the longrun. Also the city has to pay workers pensions and healthcare which is billions and billions of dollars and also city workers are working with out a contract from what I hear. NYC has a list of problems with its debt that makes me want to throw up. Its nice having bike lanes but a few feet away roads are full of pot holes that can cause injury, huge waste of money for the city. But overall I do agree with you.
I agree.
Detroit debt crisis is nothing new and it took years to allow a city like Detroit to go into debt. For those that want to see whats going on in the Midwest I advice you to watch PBS, Also cities need a middle class, this is what you guys on here forget. NYC has a declining middle class which is not healthy for the cities future. Middle class is needed to form a solid tax base. What happened to Detroit is a lesson for all of us and a wakeup call for America to rebuild back its middle class.
NYC is not going the way of Detroit anytime soon, your claims are ridiculous. Yes, the city's debt totals 110 billion, but that's less than 10 percent of the City's GDP. The city's economy is growing stronger every year and unlike Detroit, which never recovered from the collapse of the American auto industry, the middle class has been returning to city for over a decade. Could the city use some budget trimming? Definitely, what city couldn't,but the city is not going bankrupt anytime soon.
NYC is not going the way of Detroit anytime soon, your claims are ridiculous. Yes, the city's debt totals 110 billion, but that's less than 10 percent of the City's GDP. The city's economy is growing stronger every year and unlike Detroit, which never recovered from the collapse of the American auto industry, the middle class has been returning to city for over a decade. Could the city use some budget trimming? Definitely, what city couldn't,but the city is not going bankrupt anytime soon.
Dude wtf is wrong with you, I never said NYC is going to be like Detroit. The city middle class has declined unless you consider an Michigoan who moved Manhattan living with roommates a middle class person! Detroit has been going under for the past 40 years. You should stop and read some history the collapse of the auto industry is not the only thing that caused Detroit's demise. Not that city can be bankrupt but it should watch its belly. Plenty of idiots on here think NYC is perfect. Saying stuff like this wont happen to NyC is like saying you wont catch hiv!
Dude wtf is wrong with you, I never said NYC is going to be like Detroit. The city middle class has declined unless you consider an Michigoan who moved Manhattan living with roommates a middle class person! Detroit has been going under for the past 40 years. You should stop and read some history the collapse of the auto industry is not the only thing that caused Detroit's demise. Not that city can be bankrupt but it should watch its belly. Plenty of idiots on here think NYC is perfect. Saying stuff like this wont happen to NyC is like saying you wont catch hiv!
Put like this. Earning 50k a year and want your own apartment or place in the city? You probably have to move to the Bronx, or maybe the furthest reaches of Brooklyn and Queens.
You do have a middle class in NYC, but to live what most Americans consider a middle class lifestyle, in big parts of the city you'd need to be well into the upper middle class.
If a lot of transplants don't leave in a few years, I think NYC will be ugly in a decade or two. Why? What happens to all these people when they get too old to work, and they are still trying to rent in NYC? Its out in the streets or the HOMELESS SHELTER. If you're in a 3k with one other person and say making 50k a year, what happens when its time for you to collect social security? The high rents gentrifications brings are not sustainable for your whole life.
I actually do know a midwestern transplant who moved to NYC in the 70s . Unfortunately, he stayed in the city too long. He grew old, and with his social security can barely cover the rent and has to go to soup kitchens. Do keep in mind the typical job in NYC doesn't have such great benefits unless you're working for a Fortune 500 company, are upper management, or in a union.
Now none of this means the city will end up like Detroit. But in much of the rest of the country, a person making 50k could reasonably buy their own house, and in old age, not have to worry about escalating rent costs. But current transplants move to NYC too late. A lot of people who were young in the 60s and 70s got rent controled apartments frozen at low rates and got set for life . A transplant who has never had his own NYC apartment and is always living in other people's apartments is setting himself/herself up for a potentially poor future . After all, there is a rising group of WHITE homeless people in Manhattan.
I'm from michigan, been to both cities and have studied them. I just don't get this thread tbh, some of you new yorkers just don't know how Detroit really is and why some people from here/midwest move to a city like NYC. I want to move to NYC, but I don't think it's perfect or as great as people make it seem, but as far as cities in the U.S. NYC and Chi are where it's at for me.
People arguing that the middle class is the key, take a look at the country, the middle class regardless of where they live get less and as time passes the wealthy get more. A lot of those gentrifying types come from middle class families, though they may be poor themselves.
I'm from michigan, been to both cities and have studied them. I just don't get this thread tbh, some of you new yorkers just don't know how Detroit really is and why some people from here/midwest move to a city like NYC. I want to move to NYC, but I don't think it's perfect or as great as people make it seem, but as far as cities in the U.S. NYC and Chi are where it's at for me.
People arguing that the middle class is the key, take a look at the country, the middle class regardless of where they live get less and as time passes the wealthy get more. A lot of those gentrifying types come from middle class families, though they may be poor themselves.
While that's true for the country as a whole, in NYC the attack on working people and the amount of money you must make to qualify for the middle class go to an all new level. I'd say in Manhattan you need well into the six digits to live like a middle class person.
NYC is not going the way of Detroit anytime soon, your claims are ridiculous. Yes, the city's debt totals 110 billion, but that's less than 10 percent of the City's GDP. The city's economy is growing stronger every year and unlike Detroit, which never recovered from the collapse of the American auto industry, the middle class has been returning to city for over a decade. Could the city use some budget trimming? Definitely, what city couldn't,but the city is not going bankrupt anytime soon.
I cant believe this idiot is saying the middle class is returning to the city, hell i almost loled in my pants when I read that. Reading your post makes me want to vomit. NYC has a lower middle class rate than the national average, also NYC middle has been free falling for the past ten years.
Census data showed -- NYC has been leaking middle class, working families. In the last 10-15 years the leak has slowed, but it is still there anyways. NYC population however grew, primarily due to foreign emigration, and secondly, Iowa farm boys finishing Brown U, moving to the City for a few years to gain experience, money, before marrying, having kids, and moving to the suburbs.
Another point -- many families with kids are staying in the city, which is good. However the only reason they are staying is Law and Order. If new Mayor is soft, if NYPD get neutered, crime will return, and these families will get in their station wagons and move out.
Some of youse made the comment that "many other cities are in bad shape, like us. We are not alone, so we won't fall." It's like saying, me and my frinds will jump off the 5th floor windows, and because we are so many, we won't fall. As if the laws of gravity do not apply to the group. It is nonsensical IMO.
It shows me is that if / when these cities fall, they will be like a deck of cards, and it won't be pretty.
Another point -- why didn't Obama bail out Detroit? I think he could, be for some reason he didn't. I am not advocating that he should -- IMO let Detroit suffer the consequences of their actions, inactions and choices.
While that's true for the country as a whole, in NYC the attack on working people and the amount of money you must make to qualify for the middle class go to an all new level. I'd say in Manhattan you need well into the six digits to live like a middle class person.
True, NYC also has a much bigger wealthy to upper middle class population, let alone a larger regular middle class. Many people who go to NYC are ambitious and can reach success, many also go to try to just survive and leave soon lol.
I suppose the normal person that just wants a normal life obviously shouldn't aim for manhattan, but rather than saying Detroit is an example of NYC's future... I'd think it's better to say NYC is an example of Americas future. You gotta realize the demographic background of Detroit, the wealth lies in the suburbs here, rich or wealthy in Michigan does not equal the same out east. The same suburban home in Michigan compared to jersey could range from 2 to 4 times cheaper in Michigan. Most of Michigan is suburban sprawl, no great city to boost housing values etc.
What I mean by saying NYC could be an example of Americas future is this... basically it's going to take more for a person to get less, and the person can look at it two ways, they either have no skill in demand that could lead to them becoming wealthy or not. They realize they can't become anything they want anymore so just try to find a place with cheap living that really isn't great but at least you got family. In America the best in anything are rewarded, 2nd best is even looked down upon lol.
Everyone will either get more competitive, and that could mean people getting more desperate to make money legally or illegally. People may get fed up with how things are run and cause change, some people may leave the country. I read a NYtimes article on expats from NYC moving to Sao Paolo, Brazil.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
