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Yes, most of Port Richmond in particular around "Port Richmond Avenue" (who thought that one up?).
Back in the day Richmond Avenue was a main shopping district for much of the North Shore (Lobels, Woolworths, Gabby's DJ, Oven Bake, etc...) with the area a mixture of blacks or whites depending upon what section. Once the SI Mall was opened shopping gradually drifted out that way. Richmond Ave went into decline and much of the area became a ghetto; then the latinos/Hispanics started arriving.
they should have made the Bayonne light rail connect to the Staten island rail and ferry stop.
Cannot be done as the ROW of the former North Shore RR is in very bad state for much of it and quite a lot has simply fallen into the water. Also IIRC the new "Wheel" and mall project will sit on the land that once was part of the ROW out of the Ferry area. In fact now that one thinks about it the baseball park and whatever else that has been built down there since the 1990's probably takes up space as well.
That would certainly be the death of the Staten Island Ferry. It's such a shame that they don't allow cars on it anymore
True, so true. Understand why they stopped in this post 9/11/01 NYC, but there are times you just don't feel like hitting the Gowanus or NJTP to get back into the City. At least on the ferry you could catch a few winks, get out and walk around (that breeze on a cool or cold night is just right for waking you UP), or whatever.
Because it is not as close geographically... Lots of what is now NYC was an urban/suburban area as a different municipality before being annexed as New York City... hence, why lots of people still would never refer to anywhere in queens or brooklyn as the city.
Cannot be done as the ROW of the former North Shore RR is in very bad state for much of it and quite a lot has simply fallen into the water. Also IIRC the new "Wheel" and mall project will sit on the land that once was part of the ROW out of the Ferry area. In fact now that one thinks about it the baseball park and whatever else that has been built down there since the 1990's probably takes up space as well.
well. that sucks. what about having nj transit from edison going to staten island?
^Ha.
Staten Island suffers from the lack of any kind of visionary planning and from being ignored by politicos for decades. It's what happens when you don't invest in public transportation and let tasteless post-war developers build what they like with no oversight. It's also unfortunate that Staten Island developed at a time when this country forgot how to build good urban neighborhoods.
At least the few historic areas are nice and the north shore has some real potential
Problem with "public" transportation on Staten Island is many of the roads and streets were laid out ages ago. Most have too many curves for light rail and in any event the streets are too narrow for both light raid and cars. Think of Victory Blvd. You would think it would be an ideal east to west throughway for light rail. That is on paper, if you've ever drove the thing you'd know why it isn't.
If you look at the North Shore from Saint George going west towards Mariners Harbour you see and understand why blocks off Richmond Terrance going south are more densely populated than once you cross say Castleton or Forest Avenues; the North Shore RR once ran along Richmond Terrance so it was easier to get to and from the Ferry or points along that part of the NS.
Building subways for scores of reasons isn't going to happen either; so that leaves the form of public transportation Staten Island has had in abundance for years; buses.
Problem with buses is they are subject to the same traffic problems created by over development of SI as cars. Though the MTA has created some new "bus only" lanes to speed things up they have received mixed results. Also the natives by and large aren't happy with the things, in particular since it appears the cameras observing the lanes have been leading to lots of tickets being issued.
In short the traffic congestion you see currently on SI was something many old school/natives warned about back in the 1980's and 1990's when the City was allowing vast development. But no one wanted to hear about it when there was money to be made.
To make matters worse in order to accommodate the parking problem (not enough of it) all this new development has brought streets and traffic patterns have had to be altered. This creates more congestion. Am speaking of the various parts of streets or avenues carved out of traffic for parking.
Richmond Terrace never had the 90 degree parking you see now from much of the ferry area going west. That was put there for parking by the NYPD to serve 120 station house.
Remember one year made a right onto Cebra Avenue off Victory Blvd going towards Hylan. Now for years that was a simple two lane avenue. So here's me driving down only to encounter a broad swath of street has been "reserved" for parking to serve the home owners. Mind you those homes have been there in some cases for >100 years and managed to do without, but never the less...
Parking is a *HUGE* issue on SI in many areas because there simply is not enough of it. Developers torn down small homes and put up two family townhouses and or densely packed one family homes but guess what? The street is what it is so there isn't enough parking. While some homes do have a driveway and or garage that often isn't enough as families often have two or three cars. So what do they do? Far as Staten Island residents are concerned by and large they "own" the spot in front of their homes. When they move their car a cone or rubbish can in put in it's place to hold the spot. You value your life and or your car cheaply if you move that place holder.
The other modern thing for these "new' Staten Islanders is to pave over their entire front and or back yards to make space to park all their cars. I've never seen anything like this on the Island before. Homes that for years had beautiful back yards, you pass by one day and the entire thing has been paved with concrete and now is a parking lot.
Multiply all these new homes with on average two or more cars per household and you begin to understand why there is a traffic congestion problem on SI. For my part always try to arrive early in the AM and usually leave late. At least on holidays most of the traffic on the VNB is going onto the Belt so am good until the Gowanus merges into the FDR. That is when I just pay the toll and take the tunnel.
mass transit was kept out of lots of area's long ago...
Exactly and for very good reasons.
Much of Brooklyn and Queens were just as rural and suburban as Staten Island at one time; then came the subways.
As subways expanded deeper and further into Brooklyn and Queens it brought development, lots of development. Talk to "old timers" that lived in those areas say before WWII and just after versus today.
There is no such thing as a typical Staten Island block. You can cherry pick a ghetto block in the barrio from the northern part of the Island, or you can pick a block in the south where everyone's name ends in a vowel and they all have two or three luxury cars in their driveway/garage.
Newark is extremely urban compared to Staten Island. No question about it. More than half the population of SI and a fraction of the size.
It's still possible for blocks to have a similar density even if they have different demographics. For instance, here's a block on the South Shore, and here's one in Port Richmond. The first block group has a density of 30,000 ppsm, while the second one is a little under 20,000 ppsm.
Same goes for Bayonne and Elizabeth all of which share the same thing in common with Newark; they were major centers of industry/manufacturing which brought employment and persons seeking to live.
Staten Island has historically been rural/suburban with very little industry. What little there was ringed the North Shore and mostly has long since gone.
Did I not just say that I already knew those cities had the greater population density? I'm saying it's not by that much of a margin. 8,000 for SI compared to 11,000 for Newark & Bayonne.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcampo13
Good job cherry picking blocks in Newark and Elizabeth with zero apartment buildings on them. These are not average blocks in those cities necessarily. The difference between Newark and Elizabeth and SI is that Newark and Elizabeth have CBDs. Newark even has a skyline, Elizabeth has a very dense area on Broad as well. Bayonne is more balanced but remember those home are four family homes. The vast majority of Bayonne is not single-family, in stark contrast to Staten, which is predominately suburban. You don't need a car in any of those 3 cities, you pretty much need one on 90% of Staten.
Staten Island has about 8,000 people per square mile with ample parkland included, Bayonne has 11,000 or so per square mile with about 50% water and another 30% being purely industrial. In residential areas Bayonne is far denser. Elizabeth and Newark are both between 10 and 12 thousand as well. Both of those cities have huge swaths of land which aren't residential as well. This isn't even mentioning JC or the Gold Coast which are far denser than any of these three cities.
Alright, this post makes sense.
I randomly dropped the Streetview guy on a random block in the city that wasn't in an industrial area. FWIW, from the parts of Elizabeth that I've driven around, I haven't really seen too many apartment buildings. Newark obviously has that whole dense area around Newark Penn, but once you get further away, you start seeing more houses, where the density is comparable to that of the North Shore.
I didn't realize the Bayonne number included so much water (I knew about the industrial land, though).
Quote:
Originally Posted by NooYowkur81
There's a "barrio" in staten island?
Port Richmond is considered the main Hispanic area on Staten Island, and actually has one of the highest percentages of Mexicans in NYC. But I wouldn't consider it a barrio like say Corona or Washington Heights, because there's still a lot blacks and whites still in the area.
There's other areas on the North Shore with a lot of Hispanics as well, but again, I wouldn't consider them barrios.
And when I say barrio, I don't mean it in any derogatory way: I just mean it's a heavily Hispanic area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerous-Boy
they should have made the Bayonne light rail connect to the Staten island rail and ferry stop.
They should extend it down the West Shore, or in a worst-case scenario, leave it in Elm Park. But it's not necessary to go back east towards St. George.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal
Exactly and for very good reasons.
Much of Brooklyn and Queens were just as rural and suburban as Staten Island at one time; then came the subways.
As subways expanded deeper and further into Brooklyn and Queens it brought development, lots of development. Talk to "old timers" that lived in those areas say before WWII and just after versus today.
And now look. They're building new developments left and right, regardless of the fact that there's no subway service.
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I'm saying it's not by that much of a margin. 8,000 for SI compared to 11,000 for Newark & Bayonne.
