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Old 12-12-2013, 09:24 AM
 
Location: Wilmette, IL
420 posts, read 818,167 times
Reputation: 306

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Glad I moved from Inwood back to Queens since I just saw a map from the EPA of wintertime air quality and while better than it's been in the past noticed how polluted Upper Manhattan was: pic.twitter.com/J0h38kCvCy

Most likely due to the GW Bridge traffic and Cross Bronx Expressway. Why are the levels on UWS and around 86th Street on the UES high btw? These neighborhoods have higher air pollution than Midtown... is it because of Riverside Drive and the FDR?
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Old 12-12-2013, 11:13 AM
 
2,255 posts, read 2,373,451 times
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The BS from city hall is spreading all over the city. An air purifier will do nothing for you !
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Old 12-12-2013, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Wilmette, IL
420 posts, read 818,167 times
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/\ Also defeats Bloomberg's war of fast food if we're eating healthy but breathing in polluted air....

A bit unrelated but along the same lines did anyone see the study released about how riding the London Tube for 20-30 minutes is nearly equivalent to smoking a cigarette? Makes me look at the soot covered tracks of the subway in a different way. Hopefully DeBlassio will tackle air quality issues in the city.
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Old 12-12-2013, 01:01 PM
 
1,431 posts, read 2,190,551 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ehanson View Post
/\ Also defeats Bloomberg's war of fast food if we're eating healthy but breathing in polluted air....

A bit unrelated but along the same lines did anyone see the study released about how riding the London Tube for 20-30 minutes is nearly equivalent to smoking a cigarette? Makes me look at the soot covered tracks of the subway in a different way. Hopefully DeBlassio will tackle air quality issues in the city.
The subway doesn't seem so bad.

I remember when I lived in Washington Heights, every time I walked past the bridge, under the bus terminal, it really felt like breathing poison...I would try to breathe as little as possible there.
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Old 12-12-2013, 01:12 PM
 
3,445 posts, read 5,062,810 times
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Stop breathing..its polluted air...you will die.

Stop eating fast food too...you will be fat.
Stop eating salt...you will die of a stroke.
Dont own a gun...you will shoot yourself.
Dont drink soda...you will become as fat as a fast food eater...

Why are you people in NYC so paranoid? Most come with the territory.
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Old 12-12-2013, 02:14 PM
 
32,089 posts, read 32,986,776 times
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After working in China twice for a few months each time, I know that the air pollution in the NYC is so much lower and nothing to worry about it in comparison.
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Old 12-12-2013, 05:54 PM
 
20,770 posts, read 13,763,409 times
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Poor air quality on UWS and UES is due in large part to the emissions from the fuel burned in boilers to produce heat and hot water. Report: City’s Highest Air Pollution Levels Found On Upper West Side « CBS New York

Bunker fuel/diesel is one of the most nasty pollutants in terms of particulate matter. It is a major part of the black soot that covers windowsills and probably everything else the air reaches. It is also the reason why historically trucks, buses and other things that run on diesel fuel are considered air polluters, and why states like CA have strict standards for cars and things that use diesel fuel.

Air purifiers can and do work very well in NYC/Manhattan, if you know how to use them property and purchase a decent unit. They are best used in closed rooms and or those with minimal outdoor air entering. This is because none of the small portable units can deal with keeping indoor air "clean" with a constant exchange of the same coming from outside.

First time I cleaned the filters on ours was aghast at how black some of them were (there are three), that was all the soot, dirt, and god only knows what else we were breathing in from outdoors.

Many persons one the UWS or UES do not open their windows much or often because of the effects of all that soot. I can clean the inside windows and ledges on Saturday and by Monday there is already a thin layer of black. A week later things are back to where they were before.

People also keep heavy drapes closed to help "filter" the air as much of the soot is trapped by the fabrics. OTOH if you want to keep those things clean you keep the windows closed.
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Old 12-12-2013, 05:59 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,146 posts, read 23,668,851 times
Reputation: 11622
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
Poor air quality on UWS and UES is due in large part to the emissions from the fuel burned in boilers to produce heat and hot water. Report: City’s Highest Air Pollution Levels Found On Upper West Side « CBS New York

Bunker fuel/diesel is one of the most nasty pollutants in terms of particulate matter. It is a major part of the black soot that covers windowsills and probably everything else the air reaches. It is also the reason why historically trucks, buses and other things that run on diesel fuel are considered air polluters, and why states like CA have strict standards for cars and things that use diesel fuel.

Air purifiers can and do work very well in NYC/Manhattan, if you know how to use them property and purchase a decent unit. They are best used in closed rooms and or those with minimal outdoor air entering. This is because none of the small portable units can deal with keeping indoor air "clean" with a constant exchange of the same coming from outside.

First time I cleaned the filters on ours was aghast at how black some of them were (there are three), that was all the soot, dirt, and god only knows what else we were breathing in from outdoors.

Many persons one the UWS or UES do not open their windows much or often because of the effects of all that soot. I can clean the inside windows and ledges on Saturday and by Monday there is already a thin layer of black. A week later things are back to where they were before.

People also keep heavy drapes closed to help "filter" the air as much of the soot is trapped by the fabrics. OTOH if you want to keep those things clean you keep the windows closed.
I had no idea that boilers in the city were powered by bunker fuel. It seems like such a ridiculously straightforward fix--I wonder why the city hasn't legislated towards that. What's more is that if they are so old to be using that then they are probably terribly inefficient compared to newer systems so there is little financial incentive to keep with it and it's not like charcoal or wood fired ovens where you want to retain the smoky flavor of your hot water or radiator.
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Old 12-12-2013, 06:41 PM
 
20,770 posts, read 13,763,409 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
I had no idea that boilers in the city were powered by bunker fuel. It seems like such a ridiculously straightforward fix--I wonder why the city hasn't legislated towards that. What's more is that if they are so old to be using that then they are probably terribly inefficient compared to newer systems so there is little financial incentive to keep with it and it's not like charcoal or wood fired ovens where you want to retain the smoky flavor of your hot water or radiator.
If you read the above linked article, Bloomberg's administration has basically outlawed the two most horrible types of fuel oil, numbers four and six. Banned Heating Oils | Inhabitat New York City

Of the two #6 (bunker fuel C by the Navy) is the most dirty. IIRC it literally is the "sludge" of what is left after everything else has been refined out of oil. As such it is cheap and often plentiful, which is why many landlords burn the stuff in their boilers.

Many new buildings in our area of UES and those that undergo substantial renovation have switched in whole or part to natural gas. Some buildings switch between the two depending upon factors such as price and outdoor temperature. Indeed ConEd has been digging up parts of UES to lay new gas mains due to increased demand.

Many older buildings had boilers that burnt coal, when that was phased out the burners were switched over to oil. You can walk around Manhattan and peep into basements and still find those hold huge coal boilers with huge doors. Only again they burn oil not coal.
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Old 12-12-2013, 06:51 PM
 
20,770 posts, read 13,763,409 times
Reputation: 14431
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
I had no idea that boilers in the city were powered by bunker fuel. It seems like such a ridiculously straightforward fix--I wonder why the city hasn't legislated towards that. What's more is that if they are so old to be using that then they are probably terribly inefficient compared to newer systems so there is little financial incentive to keep with it and it's not like charcoal or wood fired ovens where you want to retain the smoky flavor of your hot water or radiator.
Switching from oil to gas is not always an easy nor cheap process for any building. That is why many from high end co-ops to tenement RS buildings have resisted in the past. Landlords of rental properties in particular worry about the costs and that laws often prevent them from recouping the outlay for years and even not then. I mean if you own a building where the majority of tenants are RS and a good portion of that are below market, then where is the money for a new boiler and such going to come from?

Depending on several factors it could mean having dual burner systems for the boiler (one for oil, the other gas), others have two separate boilers for each type of fuel. Either way unless the current gas mains from the street to property can supply NG as required, you are looking at another cost for having new mains done.

Since a majority of NYC apartment buildings heated with at first coal then oil often the gas mains are sized to deliver for cooking purposes only. Same as with electric where you have apartments with barely 100amps of service. When a unit wishes to upgrade say to install one of those fancy European laundry appliances and or just wishes to live in the 21st century with mod cons it can mean an extensive electrical power survey. If the cables supplying the building cannot send enough power to the meter/fuse boxes, then they must be upgraded , something Con Edison charges a pretty penny.

All this applies to persons living out on SI, LI etc.. that use oil for heating. Many would love to convert to NG, but the cost of running pipes to their property can be high. IIRC the smart thing to do is for several neighbors to agree for the upgrade at the same time. That way the costs for the last person are much less than him being the first and or only. In theory this applies to large apartment buildings in NYC as well. If all buildings on a block agree to use NG for heating then larger mains can be done at once with costs lower because it not separate jobs done one at a time.
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