Is East Harlem really that bad? (Hamilton, Hope: houses, neighborhood, subsidized)

[SuperMario]

Originally Posted by yellowtail

Are you from NYC? Have you lived here for a substantial period of time? If not, then please go somewhere else with your "but on Youtube, yada yada...the blacks" nonsense. Sorry, but some, probably most, of the poorest neighborhoods in the city are predominantly Latino ones, Washington Heights, Inwood, Grand Concourse area in the Bronx, Spanish Harlem, etc. Partly this is a result of the majority of the residents of these areas being recent immigrants, many of them being unskilled and at a disadvantage b/c of language.

Central and West Harlem are light years ahead of East Harlem in terms of livability for the middle class (regardless of race)

To the OP, stay out of El Barrio. It's way too poor.

Yes I am from NYC...born and raised in the Bronx. Just my opinion growing up in the west Bronx which houses a large amount of hispanics, the area is poor but the areas with the higher crime are usually more towards the central and south...or predominantly black areas. But I am really coming out sounding like a rascist ....sorry but im just defending my people. I aknowledge the fact that Latinos also cause crime, are poor etc etc..and whites too....so I apologize if I offended anyone but I stand by my point.



Forget my east/central/west Harlem comments....even though I go to school in west harlem, I haven't been in east/central harlem enough to judge it.

[yellowtail]

Originally Posted by SuperMario

Yes I am from NYC...born and raised in the Bronx. Just my opinion growing up in the west Bronx which houses a large amount of hispanics, the area is poor but the areas with the higher crime are usually more towards the central and south...or predominantly black areas. But I am really coming out sounding like a rascist ....sorry but im just defending my people. I aknowledge the fact that Latinos also cause crime, are poor etc etc..and whites too....so I apologize if I offended anyone but I stand by my point.



Forget my east/central/west Harlem comments....even though I go to school in west harlem, I haven't been in east/central harlem enough to judge it.

Unless someone posts crime stats, I can't really agree with you. The drug trade is alive and booming in upper, upper Manhattan, east of Broadway. With that, comes crime. Unfortunately, the ethnic group who is dealing with that the most right now are Latinos.

[SuperMario]

Originally Posted by yellowtail

Unless someone posts crime stats, I can't really agree with you. The drug trade is alive and booming in upper, upper Manhattan, east of Broadway. With that, comes crime. Unfortunately, the ethnic group who is dealing with that the most right now are Latinos.

I noticed something when I was figuring out the crime rates for some bronx neighborhoods back in september......just looking at the latino make-up in the neighborhoods, the ones which were predominantly Puerto Rican had more crime than the Dominican neighborhoods. Here were the top neighborhoods in terms of crime:

Hunts Point - Puerto Rican
Melrose/Morrisania- Puerto Rican
East Tremont- Puerto Rican
Mott Haven- Puerto Rican
University Heights/Fordham- Dominican
Soundview/Castle Hill-????
Morris Heights- Dominican

Next to the neighborhood, I wrote the largest latino concentration found there. As you can see, Puerto Rican nabes top the list....Dominican nabes are nothing to write home about but there is less crime found there. Highbridge which is another Dominican neighborhood didn't make the top 7.

Now alot of these neighborhood's are mixed. You could find PR's/DR's/AA in any of the above. But there are majorities in most places. In the above Melrose/Morrisania, East Tremont, Soundview/Castle hill are heavy in African American populations aswell.

more examples:

Washington Heights/Inwood which are Dominican neighborhoods have a lower crime rate than Spanish Harlem which is a Puerto Rican neighborhood (or used to be)

Anybody know why this is the case?

[scatman]

As a kid, I used to stay with my uncle and his family in the Wagners! I used to go through the path made through a vacant lot to get to the 4 train at 1-2-5. That vacant lot is now the PathMark!

I'll say this: East/Spanish Harlem isn't peaches and cream. But the condos ARE going up! The OP should check the neighborhood (day and evening) and get a feel for it!

[apvbguy]

Originally Posted by SuperMario

Forget my east/central/west Harlem comments....even though I go to school in west harlem, I haven't been in east/central harlem enough to judge it.

so why do you comment on something that you admit to knowing little about? and then why do you attack the people who show how ill informed the comment was?
A good rule of thumb to follow when posting comments is that when you don't know something, don't post a message prentending that you have insight about the subject

[DAS]

I can't believe I'm really reading this thread and it's going like this. East Harlem has always been known as Spanish Harlem at least for the last 60 years. But it is not really only immigrants of Spanish speaking countries and their descendents. There are plenty of black people and others that have grown up there and still live there.

Here is a list of books you can read on East Harlem.

Tenants of East Harlem/ Russel Leigh Sharman: East Harlem shown through the eyes of residents of different races. This is recent history.

Book of photos by Joseph Rodriguez. This is recent history.

Flying over 96th St: Memoir of East Harlem/Thomas L Webber: a white man that grew up in the PJ's in the late 1950's - 1960's

and the classic Down These Mean Streets/Piri Thomas: growing up in the late 40's, 50's and early 60's in East Harlem

I also had a discussion with some co-workers that referred to the West side from 125th and Amsterdam to the River going up to 155th as Spanish Harlem. They are from Brooklyn and Queens and don't go uptown to often. They didn't know the Spanish Harlem most people are referring to is on the East side.

Has anyone else ever heard of this area of the west side of Harlem referred to as Spanish harlem? I had never heard that used before when speaking about that area. I would like to know.

[apvbguy]

Originally Posted by DAS

Has anyone else ever heard of this area of the west side of Harlem referred to as Spanish harlem? I had never heard that used before when speaking about that area. I would like to know.

no, spanish harlem, east harlem, el barrio, whatever name you care to call it is generally east of 5th ave and above 96 st

[yodel]

My husband grew up in East Harlem and his family still lives there. It has lots of problems but is way better than it was when we met. 10 years ago when he took me to where he lived, there were several large empty garbage filled lots on his block. Now all the lots have been built on - one is a co-op or condo building with prices that we couldn't afford. This has happened all over East Harlem. It's been an amazing transformation. Even with the progress and proximity to Manhattan, I don't think I'd be ready to live there. There are sooo many projects, and lots of garbage on the street. In his mom's building (around Lex and 119th), which isn't a project, people graffitti the halls and pee in the elevator. Also, it's just generally not a very attractive area architecturally, I mean really a mish-mash of buildings. Its nicer closer to Marcus Garvey park--there are some beautiful brownstones over there, but I'm not sure if that's technically East Harlem.

[SuperMario]

Originally Posted by DAS

Has anyone else ever heard of this area of the west side of Harlem referred to as Spanish harlem? I had never heard that used before when speaking about that area. I would like to know.

When I applied to City College on 138th and Amsterdam, I was told by most people that the area was Spanish Harlem. I think it has to do with the heavy Dominican presence in the neighborhood; so by default people just started calling it Spanish Harlem.

[Guywithacause]

Here is my two cents:

1-Spanish Harlem is clearly on the east side of Harlem and any other neighborhood that uses this name, or people who choose to use this name, on another area of the city is wrong.

2-I do not like East Harlem because of the monumental housing projects...and not much else in the area. Central and West Harlem have brownstones/coops in the mix as well as far more retail/amenities.

3-Although East Harlem is improving, buildings are being rehabbed, condos/coops/luxury rentals are being built at a frantic pace, the area will be as is for the immediate future.

4-I have felt much safer walking around Mott Haven than East Harlem. I cannot tell you why specifically...but I purposely avoid East Harlem. Something (or alot of things) just feel wrong. Then again I am from Mott Haven so I am biased.