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DAS you can say the same thing about almost every nabe. What neighborhood doesn't have rats in the garbage? What neighborhood doesn't have loud people? People hanging out? It is getting marginally whiter, yes, but the real story is that it has become far more Hispanic, like much of NYC.
Latinos are not something that you notice as increasing as much in Harlem, since Latinos have always been part of the population. Maybe more Mexicans now than a decade ago. But then there are less Puerto Ricans than a decade ago also. But are there really? since many just married Dominicans, or Black, or White, or Asian people and the children are still Puerto Ricans to some degree so you don't notice it really because they are still speaking Spanglish.
White you notice, Asian, Middle Eastern you notice because there weren't that many before.
As for the garbage and the rats, the loud music, loud people that is my point. You won't find that on 57th Street. Why? Because rich and powerful people live there. The people moving in Harlem now are not rich and powerful, they can't change anything. Everything is still the same. They may improve how some of the surroundings look but that was bound to happen. After something crumbles it has to be renewed in order to re-sell it. That's just business.
Yes rent is high, houses, condos, and coops are going through the roof. But they are lower in price than the UES or the UWS so the rich people that can afford those areas are still going there. No rich and powerful are moving in to Harlem, just maybe some upper middle class, but they are just replacing those that owned before. The main difference was that owners probably didn't live in Harlem before, now they will live there.
Why doesn't Harlem just hurry up and gentrify and stop gentrifyING. There are still rats in the garbage lined in bags on the streets the night before garbage pick up day. There are still groups of men hanging on the corners. There are still people out playing loud music and yelling on weeknights while people are trying to sleep, so they can go school and to work. It is only getting Whiter and the stores are looking better, but nothing is changing. I don't see any real money makers with power around to change anything. Just more White people. Why do people think White means rich. If they were rich and powerful, things would change.
There are rats in bin liners on streets of Manhattan everywhere, not just Harlem. So think we can exclude that from the criteria of "gentrified" areas. *LOL*
DAS I understand what you are saying..makes sense. But remember, you have to start somewhere. If in fact the billionaires moved enmasse to Harlem and started flexing their muscle to change things they way you are saying it should be changing, the city would be in an uproar over "whites taking control of Harlem and creating a new white billionaires row." The headlines would be insane, the Mayor would be condemning it, and it would paralyze this city. So while in theory I understand what you are saying, it doesn't work that way, and if it did, it would grind to a halt and would never happen. So the answer is: It takes time.
I've lived in Hamilton Heights for about four years now. I like it a lot and I've been casually looking at buying a 2+ bedroom in the area.
I can certainly afford it, but when I think about the long term, the schools might end up becoming a limiting factor in how long I can stay in the area. No kids yet, but they're a possibility within the next few years. But then you figure they won't be in school for another 5 years or so after they're born, so that may be sufficient time for things to change, or (maybe more likely), me to win the powerball.
I currently have a rent stabilized apartment, which makes it really tough for the math to come out in favor of buying.
I've lived in Hamilton Heights for about four years now. I like it a lot and I've been casually looking at buying a 2+ bedroom in the area.
I can certainly afford it, but when I think about the long term, the schools might end up becoming a limiting factor in how long I can stay in the area. No kids yet, but they're a possibility within the next few years. But then you figure they won't be in school for another 5 years or so after they're born, so that may be sufficient time for things to change, or (maybe more likely), me to win the powerball.
I currently have a rent stabilized apartment, which makes it really tough for the math to come out in favor of buying.
Where in Hamilton Heights? Don't have to be exact.
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Depending on what you pay for your apt, just because it is rent stabilized doesn't mean you have a deal. The fact that you recently moved in means you are likely not to have much of a deal and in fact simply paying market rate with limited increases however. That being said, even if you were renting at market rate, it's almost always a worse financial investment to buy in NYC, rather than rent. In fact, your best bet is to rent in this city, buy somewhere else if you feel you must own a place, and invest the difference in the stock market.
Latinos are not something that you notice as increasing as much in Harlem, since Latinos have always been part of the population. Maybe more Mexicans now than a decade ago. But then there are less Puerto Ricans than a decade ago also. But are there really? since many just married Dominicans, or Black, or White, or Asian people and the children are still Puerto Ricans to some degree so you don't notice it really because they are still speaking Spanglish.
White you notice, Asian, Middle Eastern you notice because there weren't that many before.
As for the garbage and the rats, the loud music, loud people that is my point. You won't find that on 57th Street. Why? Because rich and powerful people live there. The people moving in Harlem now are not rich and powerful, they can't change anything. Everything is still the same. They may improve how some of the surroundings look but that was bound to happen. After something crumbles it has to be renewed in order to re-sell it. That's just business.
Yes rent is high, houses, condos, and coops are going through the roof. But they are lower in price than the UES or the UWS so the rich people that can afford those areas are still going there. No rich and powerful are moving in to Harlem, just maybe some upper middle class, but they are just replacing those that owned before. The main difference was that owners probably didn't live in Harlem before, now they will live there.
Welcome back.
In terms of "power" it mostly goes to those who vote and otherwise make noises. As we recently saw with the SMH re-election of Charles Rangel AAs still have powerful political control of Harlem. Many of the recently arrived whites or whatever are not in numbers to counter the established minority power base.
There may also be a bit of those new arrivals see themselves "living" in Harlem but otherwise do not bother getting too involved unless things have potential to affect themselves directly. New York City has some of the worse voter apathy in the United States. That BdeB can become mayor of NYC with only 24% of the electorate turning out tells you something.
Yes, parts of Harlem are beautiful and *more* different demographics are moving up there, but it would take generations of sustained white and or upper income influx of residents to turn the place into say "Park Slope" of upper Manhattan.
No, you aren't going to find Goldman Sachs, Citibank, JP Morgan CEO's or their ilk up there, but then again you don't find them in Brooklyn or elsewhere besides certain enclaves in Manhattan below 96th either.
DAS you can say the same thing about almost every nabe. What neighborhood doesn't have rats in the garbage? What neighborhood doesn't have loud people? People hanging out? It is getting marginally whiter, yes, but the real story is that it has become far more Hispanic, like much of NYC.
Harlem already had Hispanic parts, so your point shouldn't come as some sort of surprise. As for nabes with rats, I can think of several. Harlem is certainly up there when it comes to rat infestation, and I mean BIG ones too.
Where in Hamilton Heights? Don't have to be exact.
The 140's, between Broadway and Riverside.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BronxyDude
Depending on what you pay for your apt, just because it is rent stabilized doesn't mean you have a deal. The fact that you recently moved in means you are likely not to have much of a deal and in fact simply paying market rate with limited increases however. That being said, even if you were renting at market rate, it's almost always a worse financial investment to buy in NYC, rather than rent. In fact, your best bet is to rent in this city, buy somewhere else if you feel you must own a place, and invest the difference in the stock market.
Right now I have a sizeable 1 bedroom. Elevator building, laundry downstairs, quiet neighbors, for a little over $1,200 a month. So it's a fair amount below market, but not crazy cheap either.
The only reason I'd want to move is for long term planning. Eventually, when I wind up having a kid, a 2 bedroom is going to be a necessity. My thinking now is to possibly go ahead and buy a two bedroom unit before prices in the area climb more then they already have.
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