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Old 12-15-2014, 03:43 AM
 
Location: New York City
929 posts, read 1,231,462 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citylove101 View Post
You're right in that the black population has dropped. That in no way changes the most important part of this story: G's base of white ethnic , working class, outer borough voters is dying off or leaving the city. DiB doesn't need their votes and won't pander to them or their adoration of Saint Guiliani. It ain't 1994 anymore and wishing it was won't make it so.
The Giuliani coalition was the Bloomberg coalition. A white liberal Republican could still be elected in this city with little trouble. This past election campaign was unique. Everyone and their mother thought for sure that Quinn had it in the bag. Lhota never stood a chance. He had no name recognition, and what little name recognition he did have was negative. Too many people hate the MTA. He had no charisma. He was too conservative. De Blasio was a breath of fresh air to a lot of people who didn't like Quinn and Weiner.

Have De Blasio attack the cops for a few more years, let crime go up, give Al Sharpton the key to the city, and do nothing as the people of New York complain about the awful speed limit law, and watch De Blasio lose by a historic number, only four years after winning by a historic number.

Are there less Italians and Irish than there were 20 years ago? Sure. There's also a lot more Russians, and they went for Lhota. Other than blacks in Coney Island and Chinese in Bensonhurst, Lhota swept Southern Brooklyn. Likewise, other than black and Latino slums, Lhota swept Staten Island... and Lhota was an inferior candidate.

Breezy Point, Howard Beach, all of the predictable white neighborhoods went for Lhota. For the Republicans to win again, things only need to continue to go the way they're going. Jews, Asians, and many other traditionally liberal groups support the police and don't want thugs in their neighborhoods. Bloomberg was too successful. Crime was too low. People don't look for a law & order conservative when they're not afraid to go out at night.
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Old 12-15-2014, 05:34 AM
 
Location: Bronx
14,780 posts, read 17,404,166 times
Reputation: 7508
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby BK View Post
The Giuliani coalition was the Bloomberg coalition. A white liberal Republican could still be elected in this city with little trouble. This past election campaign was unique. Everyone and their mother thought for sure that Quinn had it in the bag. Lhota never stood a chance. He had no name recognition, and what little name recognition he did have was negative. Too many people hate the MTA. He had no charisma. He was too conservative. De Blasio was a breath of fresh air to a lot of people who didn't like Quinn and Weiner.

Have De Blasio attack the cops for a few more years, let crime go up, give Al Sharpton the key to the city, and do nothing as the people of New York complain about the awful speed limit law, and watch De Blasio lose by a historic number, only four years after winning by a historic number.

Are there less Italians and Irish than there were 20 years ago? Sure. There's also a lot more Russians, and they went for Lhota. Other than blacks in Coney Island and Chinese in Bensonhurst, Lhota swept Southern Brooklyn. Likewise, other than black and Latino slums, Lhota swept Staten Island... and Lhota was an inferior candidate.

Breezy Point, Howard Beach, all of the predictable white neighborhoods went for Lhota. For the Republicans to win again, things only need to continue to go the way they're going. Jews, Asians, and many other traditionally liberal groups support the police and don't want thugs in their neighborhoods. Bloomberg was too successful. Crime was too low. People don't look for a law & order conservative when they're not afraid to go out at night.
Very true, a white liberal republican can still be elected but it will be more hard this time due to the fact that their is change in racial and socio economic class in this city. You have a decline of native whites and a decline in NYC middle class families. Even Bloomberg who had support from working class native whites, what did Bloomberg do for native whites especially in the wake of Hurricane Sandy and those snow days that crippled the city? Nothing. Bloomberg only cared about money and not his voter base, unless is voter base came from money. I knew Quinn did not have it in the bag, but surprisingly she did very well in most of Manhattan especially in affluent and hip areas. What hurt Quinn was her close relationship with Bloomberg which no one really never liked along with her support of term limit extensions. If it was Quinn vs lhota believe me I would vote for Lhota in a heartbeat. Also Lhota never liked Bloomberg also had a very different rhetoric than Bloomberg. To be honest I don't think the affluent New Yorkers did not go out to vote last year because Quinn was out of the running.
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Old 12-15-2014, 08:58 AM
 
4,456 posts, read 3,533,560 times
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Re: 'Save us Guiliani'...

You know that looks like a snowball through hell...no way man. The city's demos now mitigate anybody like him right now. I'm sure native New Yorkers can see the great change. This aint grandaddy's city. We're in a different time now...kind of like back to the future where Manhattan is the castle keep surrounded by the East and Hudson River moats and the serf majority trudge in every day and 'money' drives everything 'round here. The extremes here are great and toxic.

The mayor sees the disparity between the haves and have nots and arguably his liberalism gets weighted too much in one direction. Look how can anything be normal in this city when three Manhattan zip codes probably have more moolah in trust than Bronx, SI and Queens altogether??? This city could be cruisin' for a bruisin' if somebody doesn't pay attention. Just saying.
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Old 12-15-2014, 09:22 AM
 
23,247 posts, read 16,056,508 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby BK View Post
You're wrong. Blacks are leaving.

Blacks Leave City as Asians Propel Growth - WSJ

I'm glad that De Blasio is such a far-left kook. If he were reasonable, he'd be a shoo-in for re-election. The mayor being a wingnut makes the next election actually interesting to follow. If we're all lucky, Rudy will run against him and we'll all get a show for the ages.

It took Rudy to save New York from Dinkins. Now, his ideological son and heir threatens the city. Save us, Giuliani.
Indeed, poor Blacks are leaving. But over the decades the white working class has diminished in NYC as well. Manufacturing is gone, and the new whites moving in tend to be pretty well educated and professional. So there has been big changes in the white demographics in NYC as well.
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Old 12-15-2014, 09:31 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Western Massachusetts
45,740 posts, read 39,621,992 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby BK View Post
Breezy Point, Howard Beach, all of the predictable white neighborhoods went for Lhota. For the Republicans to win again, things only need to continue to go the way they're going. Jews, Asians, and many other traditionally liberal groups support the police and don't want thugs in their neighborhoods. Bloomberg was too successful. Crime was too low. People don't look for a law & order conservative when they're not afraid to go out at night.
A friend (white, not native to NYC but moved) whose a registered Republican was puzzled why Republican campaign mailing kept emphasizing "law and order" and "tough on crime" issues. Weren't issues that were a big priority to him.
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Old 12-15-2014, 09:33 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Western Massachusetts
45,740 posts, read 39,621,992 times
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Immigrants tend not to vote, for one thing, most aren't citizens. The biggest demographic shift is more the recent immigrant population and their descendants vote now than 20 years ago, when fewer were citizens.
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Old 12-15-2014, 09:48 AM
 
250 posts, read 217,820 times
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Giuliani is an unabashed racist. He lives and breathes dogmatism. His former parks commissioner discriminated against blacks and latinos. It was the BUSH Justice department back in 2002 (U.S. SUIT CITES BIAS IN CITY PARK DEPT. - NYTimes.com) that sued the parks department for openly discriminating against blacks and latinos. Giuliani's whole entire history has been to serve on behest on white who have anti-black sentiments. He created racial profiling in the city. He never spoke to any top black NYC political figure. He created the racial divide in the city. His own former school's chancellor admitted this much. His only claim to fame was 9/11. If not for those tragic events on that day, he would have gone into political obscurity! Never to be mentioned by anyone ever again.

He is the only political figure that I truly detest. More so than any other political figure I have encountered in my lifetime! Bloomberg was a dick imo, but he never showed that kind of hatred towards blacks that Giuliani displayed for 8 years as mayor.


And when people say "Oh he was ok with a few blemishes" are being disingenuous. Those weren't "blemishes."

Last edited by belltolls; 12-15-2014 at 09:59 AM..
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Old 12-15-2014, 09:55 AM
 
9,952 posts, read 8,441,593 times
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As Bla moves way from the policies of the Giuliani and Bloomberg administrations, that had the effect of making NYC a much more safer and more livable city then it had previously been, we'll likely see the return of the problems that preceded those policies. Much of the population of NYC either wasn't around when those problems last manifested themselves, or have forgotten. They're much more fixated on the perceived negative effects of those policies, so they supported Bla. However when the problems come back, and these people start getting impacted, they'll be screaming for Giuliani (or a successor with a similar attitude), to return.

We saw all this in the late 80's. Everyone was euphoric when Dinkins was elected. They were so happy to have a black mayor, to show how progressive the city was. Then he promptly ran it in the ground, and let crime get out of control (with the murder rate peaking at over 2,600 murders per year.) When it came to for the next election, no one wanted to have anything to do with him, and Giuliani was elected. If history repeats itself, history will repeat itself. Except for skin color, I see lots of Dinkins in Bla.
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Old 12-15-2014, 09:58 AM
 
250 posts, read 217,820 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
A friend (white, not native to NYC but moved) whose a registered Republican was puzzled why Republican campaign mailing kept emphasizing "law and order" and "tough on crime" issues. Weren't issues that were a big priority to him.

Because the GOP doesn't have a sound economic message to get white working class voters out of the rut they are currently in. The White working class/white middle class are worse off now than they have been and it's puzzling how many of them continue to support a party that will never address the class divide that exists it's largely due to the racial politics that prevents them from seeing that.

Crime is still down. What else can they run on that would benefit them in long run? Absolutely nothing.
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Old 12-15-2014, 10:02 AM
 
2,228 posts, read 2,947,298 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belltolls View Post
Because the GOP doesn't have a sound economic message to get white working class voters out of the rut they are currently in. The White working class/white middle class are worse off now than they have been and it's puzzling how many of them continue to support a party that will never address the class divide that exists it's largely due to the racial politics that prevents them from seeing that.

Crime is still down. What else can they run on that would benefit them in long run? Absolutely nothing.
Let me ask you this? Are blacks in NYC better off with Obama as POTUS? Were Blacks better off with Dinkins as Mayor?
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