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Old 12-15-2014, 03:05 PM
 
Location: Glendale NY
4,841 posts, read 7,886,870 times
Reputation: 3507

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It's nothing new. I use to watch those machines at my former job I has last year. People hate them.
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Old 12-15-2014, 04:05 PM
 
10,008 posts, read 8,492,915 times
Reputation: 5886
Jobs exist because someone needs work performed, and the work creates enough value to justify paying someone to perform it. Once that is no longer the case, or if there's a way of performing the work without having to pay some individual to do it, that job goes away.

Then people wonder why, when they force the pay rate for a job above either what its worth, what what alternate methods of performing the work cost, the job goes away. You always have to be careful what you wish for.

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Originally Posted by 11KAP View Post
To each is own. It's just kind of crazy how people can justify killing jobs instead of creating more jobs. Cash still rules tho.
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Old 12-15-2014, 04:42 PM
 
3,333 posts, read 3,297,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoomDan515 View Post
It's nothing new. I use to watch those machines at my former job I has last year. People hate them.
I've seen these abroad but not domestically until now.

Quote:
Jobs exist because someone needs work performed, and the work creates enough value to justify paying someone to perform it. Once that is no longer the case, or if there's a way of performing the work without having to pay some individual to do it, that job goes away.

Then people wonder why, when they force the pay rate for a job above either what its worth, what what alternate methods of performing the work cost, the job goes away. You always have to be careful what you wish for.
I don't see this as a net negative at all and I support raising the minimum to $15. Why?

Of course some or many low wage jobs will be eliminated but that's not a bad thing. As it stands now, the taxpayer is subsidizing businesses who employ extremely low wage workers (relative to each cities minimum COL; in NYC that's prob around $13- $15/hr).

Some will see their wages rise and some will lose their job. Those that lose their job will either find new work (desperation creates initiative in some; some will retrain , some will move to areas with a shortage of labor, etc) or will go on the government dole. I suspect that the net benefit will be less government support of low wage workers overall as only so much can be automated.

For example; If the government supports 1,000 low wage workers to the tune of $10 / year = $10,000
If the minimum wage is hiked to $15/hr and let's say 400 workers (automation cuts the workforce by 40% which is generous) are cut and now the government has to completely support them to the tune of $20/year (in essence the govt was subsidizing low wage employers to the tune of 100%), now the payout for the government is only $8,000. Net benefit.

The important questions are:

A. what is the rate (percentage wise) of subsidization by each state government and the Federal government?
B. to what extent will the new minimum wage decrease that rate?
C. to what extent will automation increase unemployment?

This equation will be a net positive to society at a high enough minimum wage level (especially with corporate profits at record levels) but not too high that it hurts corporate competitiveness.
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Old 12-15-2014, 04:54 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
7,925 posts, read 6,509,803 times
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Raise the minimum wage to reflect reality, but eliminate welfare completely. Succeed or fail, your choice and your problem.
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Old 12-15-2014, 05:00 PM
 
7,603 posts, read 4,075,358 times
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Shush with this tyranny. Politicians will never stand for a lack of dependency. Mutual parasitic dependency. Voters for them. Them for voters.
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Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
Raise the minimum wage to reflect reality, but eliminate welfare completely. Succeed or fail, your choice and your problem.
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Old 12-15-2014, 05:58 PM
 
Location: Orange Virginia
814 posts, read 653,286 times
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I get paid in billable hours, commissions, and service sales, how would you like to get paid like that? I would love to have a guaranteed salary, I wouldn't make the money I do but I would have a safety net.

I'm a technician and when I read about these kiosks and robotic animation I'm like build em and flood the market with em because when they break down I would charge you 85 an hour for diagnostics plus mark up on parts and labor.

These things will be a money maker.
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Old 12-15-2014, 06:00 PM
 
3,333 posts, read 3,297,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
Raise the minimum wage to reflect reality, but eliminate welfare completely. Succeed or fail, your choice and your problem.
There's a natural rate of unemployment and its not 0.
Some people will be in the dumps no matter what they do. You ever play poker? Some people tend to run -EV their entire lives. Call it fate if you must. Others encounter highly improbable events. Most events tend to fall in the 95% range but probability theory tells us that 5% falls in the highly unlikely category (>2 s.d). 2.5% of that is extreme good luck and 2.5% is extreme bad luck. What about these folks?

So there has to be some form of welfare. You don't want true darwinism because you'll be harmed by it as well.

Airborne guy? Military? So you should know probability theory intuitively. How many soldiers have done dumb **** and survived while others mitigated risk and yet got killed?
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Old 12-15-2014, 06:23 PM
 
Location: Staten Island
1,653 posts, read 1,699,749 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sirtiger View Post
that should crush their union dreams
That's exactly what it's meant to do.
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Old 12-15-2014, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Not where I want to be
4,827 posts, read 6,950,838 times
Reputation: 7645
Quote:
Originally Posted by wawaweewa View Post
Went in to get a coffee at the McD's on 23rd near Madison and there were 2 automated ordering kiosks installed with a few corporate McD's suites watching.
Is that like the kiosks that some grocery stores have in their deli dept where you can order your items, get a number, go about your shopping, and then they announce when your order is ready for pick up? In other words, do you just punch in your order, get a number, they call you when it's ready and you pay and go? Or do you also pay at the kiosk? I would LOVE that.
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Old 12-15-2014, 06:28 PM
 
3,333 posts, read 3,297,215 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amisi View Post
Is that like the kiosks that some grocery stores have in their deli dept where you can order your items, get a number, go about your shopping, and then they announce when your order is ready for pick up? In other words, do you just punch in your order, get a number, they call you when it's ready and you pay and go? Or do you also pay at the kiosk? I would LOVE that.
Order, pay at the kiosk, and receive a receipt.
Turn in the receipt for food at the counter.
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