The future of Washington Heights (New York, Union: income, to live in, restaurants)

[Guywithacause]

Ogden..yes true...but is seemed to have devolve into racial percentages. I am not clear as to what it matters whether anyone is 60% white, or 10% white. In my observation as a longtime Mott Haven resident with a HEAVY Puerto Rican population, the population is clearly a mix of everything..some are slightly whiter..some slightly darker, most are in between...and are clearly a mix. To assert that these people are white is laughable, as they are most accurately heavily mixed. They MAY identify as whatever they want, but at the end of the day, they are far more weighted toward a mixed race population than any one race.

[NooYowkur81]

I've met some very fair-skinned Puerto Ricans. Some of them are family and close friends. They are White in my eyes. How is a darker Italian or Jewish person automatically classified as White, but a Puerto Rican tends to get classified as mixed? Perplexing. As most matters of race are. Point being, racial classifications are very flawed when you take a close look at them.

Hispanic and Latino is not a race afterall.

Dominicans are mostly mixed, and some of us face an identify crisis at some point in our life, especially Dominicans born here. At times I don't feel 100% American, and the times I've been in DR, I haven't felt totally accepted or comfortable there as well. In DR people tend to get classified more specifically by their specific shade of skin color, since the majority is mixed.

Whereas, in the U.S.A a mixed person is often forced to choose a racial classification. People of a mixed heritage are often forced to believe that they have to classify themselves as Black. The one drop rule, so and so forth.

Personally I consider myself both, Black and White, and I've learned to accept who I am and not get hung up on other people's classifications. I'm here in the U.S. and will be here more than likely the rest of my life.

[DAS]

How is a darker Italian or Jewish person automatically classified as White, but a Puerto Rican tends to get classified as mixed? Perplexing. As most matters of race are. Point being, racial classifications are very flawed when you take a close look at them.

NYer's tend to think that NYer's have assimilated into American culture more so than others according to some of the latest post on this thread. I think NY is a unique city in the US if not the world. One of the unique things is that you can hold on to your culture and not assimilate 100% into American culture. I think we like that we can do this. We get to live near and work with people from around the world and we learn so much from each other. No other city will give you that like NY will to the degree that NY does that.

I have family originally from North Dakota as my grandparents are from there. My Grandmother is Sioux and my grandfather is white. My mother and her siblings weren't accepted too well by either group. Always being called half breed by both groups. But this was more than 50 years ago things are different now and then again they are not so different. I visit out there every few years because we have family reunions.

Anyway, I can tell you that in some of those places out there, a Jewish person and an Italian person would not be considered white. They are just not considered that, they consider them an other, or another minority group, like African Americans or Latin Americans. But here in NY and other eastern states they are considered white. That is why I don't think it matters what others considers a person, it just matters what you consider yourself. In the end its up to you, what you do with your life, things like racial classification don't mean anything really.

[Guywithacause]

I understand NooYowker..I don't doubt that you have seen and met some "white looking" PRs..but that does not make them white. White, in the eyes of THIS country, is reserved for Europeans and the like...not for those of multiracial backgrounds. What's the big deal exactly? Sure there may be 10% of PRs that can classify as "white", and 10% that can classify as "black" but the vast majority is mixed in one way or another.

Yes Italians are mixed, as are alot of Europeans, but at the end of the day, Europeans are given this distinct classifications, Hispanics are not, no matter how snowy white they may LOOK. Whether it is right or wrong, or how you define white is moot, that's just the way it is. And PRs are NOT white..they are genuinely mixed, probably the mixed group of people on the planet actually. Take pride in that diversity, it provides them strength and beauty...as proven by those yearly Miss Universe titles..they just keep winning...yummy.

[NooYowkur81]

Originally Posted by Guywithacause

I understand NooYowker..I don't doubt that you have seen and met some "white looking" PRs..but that does not make them white. White, in the eyes of THIS country, is reserved for Europeans and the like...not for those of multiracial backgrounds. What's the big deal exactly? Sure there may be 10% of PRs that can classify as "white", and 10% that can classify as "black" but the vast majority is mixed in one way or another.

Yes Italians are mixed, as are alot of Europeans, but at the end of the day, Europeans are given this distinct classifications, Hispanics are not, no matter how snowy white they may LOOK. Whether it is right or wrong, or how you define white is moot, that's just the way it is. And PRs are NOT white..they are genuinely mixed, probably the mixed group of people on the planet actually. Take pride in that diversity, it provides them strength and beauty...as proven by those yearly Miss Universe titles..they just keep winning...yummy.

Nothing wrong with being mixed, white, purple, green, whatever. I'm all for being proud of who you are. I was just pointing out the flaws in racial classifications. Also just because something has been done for years does not make it right or bulletproof. Some of our backwards thinking and traditions should be questioned.

And your wrong about all Hispanics not being considered White. A lot of Cubans are commonly considered White, as well as Argentinians. It is not strictly a Euro thing. It's all BS anyway! So whatever.

[SuperMario]

Originally Posted by Guywithacause

Ogden..yes true...but is seemed to have devolve into racial percentages. I am not clear as to what it matters whether anyone is 60% white, or 10% white. In my observation as a longtime Mott Haven resident with a HEAVY Puerto Rican population, the population is clearly a mix of everything..some are slightly whiter..some slightly darker, most are in between...and are clearly a mix. To assert that these people are white is laughable, as they are most accurately heavily mixed. They MAY identify as whatever they want, but at the end of the day, they are far more weighted toward a mixed race population than any one race.

Nice article BTW.

But I agree with what you wrote here. I don't for a second believe that 80% of Puerto Ricans are white, even if it is just on the Island. There cannot be such a discrepancy between them and Dominicans, who claim 16% white. I've seen much much more white Puerto Ricans than black ones. However, just because they appear white does not me that they don't have African or Taino blood in them. In no way are ANY Puerto Ricans 100% Spaniard. Yes they have stronger Spanish influence than the other Caribbean Islands which is why they are lighter but at the end of the day they are mixed. Same beef I have with Dominicans generally being called black. While they have more African in them than PR/Cuba, they are still mixed. You wont find any 100% African heritage Dominican. There are always other bloodlines that go into them.

Mixed is Mixed. Wether your PR, DR, Cuba, Mexican, Colombian etc

[NooYowkur81]

I have to warn some of you that comparing the demographics of Cuba, DR, and Puerto Rico can be a bit tricky. Yes, three similar Caribbean countries, but each had different circumstances demographics-wise.

[Guywithacause]

Your post on Cubans is an anomoly as they self-identify themselves as white or White Hispanic, where as this country (as in everyone else) considers them just Hispanic, and mixed racial background just as every other carribean island. I don't doubt that there are many that may see a "white" cuban, PR, or Dominican, but that does not make them anymore "white" than a "white" person who LOOKs Puerto Rican is Hispanic or Non-white.

As for Argentina...they are not a racially mixed population, where as everywhere else in South America is. Yes some are mixed, but the racist and rabid killing and/or elimination of indians and africans prevented any mixing. As a result, the VAST MAJORITY of Argentinians are White, as they are directly from Europe, where as the VAST MAJORITY of Cubans, PRs, and DR are mixed racially, with small groups being white.

When the country redefines "white" we can reclassify groups. Until then, DR, CUbans, and PR are mixed and not white (with few exceptions), where as Argentina is white (with few exceptions). What's the big deal?

[NooYowkur81]

Originally Posted by Guywithacause

Your post on Cubans is an anomoly as they self-identify themselves as white or White Hispanic, where as this country (as in everyone else) considers them just Hispanic, and mixed racial background just as every other carribean island. I don't doubt that there are many that may see a "white" cuban, PR, or Dominican, but that does not make them anymore "white" than a "white" person who LOOKs Puerto Rican is Hispanic or Non-white.

As for Argentina...they are not a racially mixed population, where as everywhere else in South America is. Yes some are mixed, but the racist and rabid killing and/or elimination of indians and africans prevented any mixing. As a result, the VAST MAJORITY of Argentinians are White, as they are directly from Europe, where as the VAST MAJORITY of Cubans, PRs, and DR are mixed racially, with small groups being white.

When the country redefines "white" we can reclassify groups. Until then, DR, CUbans, and PR are mixed and not white (with few exceptions), where as Argentina is white (with few exceptions). What's the big deal?

There is no big deal. If it were up to me there would be no racial classifications. I just can't help but point out the flaws in racial classifications. Whenever people commonly accept flawed thinking, there is a part of me that wants to make them question it.

[Guywithacause]

Yes clearly there are flaws...and the reality is we are ALL mixed..just to different degrees and in different variations.