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I was watching "The Honeymooners" and they mentioned living in Benson hurst. What kind of neighborhood was that in the 1950's and what is it like now? Just curious.
I was watching "The Honeymooners" and they mentioned living in Benson hurst. What kind of neighborhood was that in the 1950's and what is it like now? Just curious.
In the 1950s it would have been a mostly middle class community of various European immigrants and children of immigrants. Largest group would have been Italians, but a lot of Jews, Irish and Germans also and some presence of other European groups that were less numerous (Scandinavians, e.g., who were more common in the nearby neighborhood of Sunset Park).
Until about 15 years ago, it was a predominantly Italian neighborhood (became more Italian and less other European groups over the course of the second half of the twentieth century as Italian immigration continued into the 50s and 60s while German, Irish and Jewish immigration mostly stopped after 1950). However, the Italian population has collapsed in recent years as elderly residents have retired and moved away or died, with their children and grandchildren mostly choosing not to remain in the neighborhood, and the neighborhood is rapidly becoming predominantly Chinese (though isn't quite there yet, and there are still a lot of mostly elderly Italians left). Still largely a middle class neighborhood.
The core of the neighborhood has been around since the early 20th century, when the BMT train lines were built, although a lot of the area was built up in the inter-war period (20s and 30s). It's almost entirely residential with a few retail strips, largely single-family homes, many of which are attached or semi-detached and a fair number of which have been converted over the years into two or three units. Predominantly brick architecture, though aluminum siding has covered the brick in a lot of places. (This was obviously not yet the case in the 1950s.)
Coming from California, I would compare it to the Sunset District or the Richmond District in San Francisco. Very similar in a lot of ways.
Last edited by BrownstoneNY; 06-18-2016 at 12:32 PM..
In the 1950s it would have been a mostly middle class community of various European immigrants and children of immigrants. Largest group would have been Italians, but a lot of Jews, Irish and Germans also and some presence of other European groups that were less numerous (Scandinavians, e.g., who were more common in the nearby neighborhood of Sunset Park).
Until about 15 years ago, it was a predominantly Italian neighborhood (became more Italian and less other European groups over the course of the second half of the twentieth century as Italian immigration continued into the 50s and 60s while German, Irish and Jewish immigration mostly stopped after 1950). However, the Italian population has collapsed in recent years as elderly residents have retired and moved away or died, with their children and grandchildren mostly choosing not to remain in the neighborhood, and the neighborhood is rapidly becoming predominantly Chinese (though isn't quite there yet, and there are still a lot of mostly elderly Italians left). Still largely a middle class neighborhood.
The core of the neighborhood has been around since the early 20th century, when the BMT train lines were built, although a lot of the area was built up in the inter-war period (20s and 30s). It's almost entirely residential with a few retail strips, largely single-family homes, many of which are attached or semi-detached and a fair number of which have been converted over the years into two or three units. Predominantly brick architecture, though aluminum siding has covered the brick in a lot of places. (This was obviously not yet the case in the 1950s.)
Coming from California, I would compare it to the Sunset District or the Richmond District in San Francisco. Very similar in a lot of ways.
I don't think it was ever a middle class community. It was working class then and it is working class now. The racial /ethnic composition has changed but that's about it. Ralph was a bus driver,Ed worked in the sewers, Trixie was a night club dancer.
I don't think it was ever a middle class community. It was working class then and it is working class now. The racial /ethnic composition has changed but that's about it. Ralph was a bus driver,Ed worked in the sewers, Trixie was a night club dancer.
It was middle income, and it still is. It's actually slightly higher income than the city average currently, though I agree that it is less well-off now, relative to the country as a whole, than it was in the 50s (though not by a big margin). Definitely less wealthy than most of the immediately adjacent neighborhoods, but that's neither here nor there. Dyker Heights, Bath Beach and Gravesend were wealthy in the 50s and are still somewhat above middle income.
Kramden's lived at 328 Chauncey St in Bushwick part of Brooklyn. The show incorrectly puts it in Bensonhurst, even assigning the phone number exchange BEnsonhurst 0-7741.
The address of 383 Himrod St, was given to Alice in the Babysitting episode (with above phone number), which is not close to the Kramden's Chauncey street address despite instructions given as being "only a few blocks".
Bushwick from the 1800's through post WWII years was largely white/European (Germans, Italians, etc...), fed by easy access once the Els and later subway system plus the once plentiful jobs (mostly industrial including large numbers of breweries), that once were in the area. By the 1970's social changes began affecting demographics. Whites fled and in their place came African-Americans and Latino/Hispanic (mostly PR). Final nail in the coffin was the famous 1977 blackout and looting which followed. What whites remained in the area along with many businesses packed up and left.
Working to perhaps lower middle class then Bushwick suited the Kramdens more than Bensonhurst. Ralph and Alice lived in an old cold water tenement flat with a ice box and little other mod-cons besides electricity and indoor plumbing.
Kramden's lived at 328 Chauncey St in Bushwick part of Brooklyn. The show incorrectly puts it in Bensonhurst, even assigning the phone number exchange BEnsonhurst 0-7741.
The address of 383 Himrod St, was given to Alice in the Babysitting episode (with above phone number), which is not close to the Kramden's Chauncey street address despite instructions given as being "only a few blocks".
Bushwick from the 1800's through post WWII years was largely white/European (Germans, Italians, etc...), fed by easy access once the Els and later subway system plus the once plentiful jobs (mostly industrial including large numbers of breweries), that once were in the area. By the 1970's social changes began affecting demographics. Whites fled and in their place came African-Americans and Latino/Hispanic (mostly PR). Final nail in the coffin was the famous 1977 blackout and looting which followed. What whites remained in the area along with many businesses packed up and left.
Working to perhaps lower middle class then Bushwick suited the Kramdens more than Bensonhurst. Ralph and Alice lived in an old cold water tenement flat with a ice box and little other mod-cons besides electricity and indoor plumbing.
They looked like they lived in a poor area of the city.
Bushwick at that time resembled many parts of NYC including Manhattan. You had plenty of those old tenement or otherwise buildings from the Lower East Side all the way through Harlem in Manhattan for instance. Urban Renewal among other schemes fixed that; armed with government money large numbers of those "slum" areas were marked for clearance and new housing (often projects) went up in their place.
Watched a great old movie last night on "Movies!" channel; The Love Nest with Marilyn Monroe. It was set in a 1952 busted tenement that a returning GI's wife purchased for their first home.
Ralph Kramden obviously didn't serve in the military, or maybe I missed something. Had he done so they would have been entitled to housing money from the GI bill and could have moved to something better; though on Ralph's salary don't think a house in the suburbs may have been possible.
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