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Old 11-27-2016, 07:00 AM
 
5,230 posts, read 5,142,801 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wawaweewa View Post
I think NYC is very hard to judge in this regard for a number of reasons.

1. Many immigrants will tell you that they're paycheck to paycheck even if they're millionaires. That's just immigrant culture. There are a lot of immigrants in NYC.
And there are many that have no problem putting the fact that they have money out there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post

The end paragraph is true. I have been saying this as well as others such as NYwriterdude. One thing is this, that NYC no longer creates talent locally. The city used to create plenty of local talent, but that talent did not do much for the city when it went economically went under in the 70s. THe city learned its lesson and instead it attracts talent instead of creating talent. I do agree that native New Yorkers are not well heeled enough for certain jobs that are competitive. This past year I was in a professional work group. A group of 7. I was the only native New Yorker. One was an H1b visa Indian, another was from Missouri Indian, 2 were from the Midwest, and the other was from Long Island who owned his truck business. These folks made so much money here, double or triple from what I make. These folks have no intentions on moving back to where they are from. Cities such as DC, SF and NYC. These such cities are elite cities, and employers are competitive and want to keep up with the growing demands of the market. Also employers pluck students out of top schools to work in ciites like DC, NYC and SF. If not top schools, one must be highly skilled, and plenty of New Yorkers are not skilled compared to Transplants.
Many jobs explicitly state they do not sponsor. And there are plenty of places that use H1b not to attract talent but to pay visa holders less not more for the same work---let's not pretend that doesn't happen.
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Old 11-27-2016, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Bronx
16,110 posts, read 18,605,434 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
Besides being a terrible idea, your statements here contradicts each other. First you say you want to create a law to demand companies to hire some people locally (not free market) but then you say you support a free market for companies to leave.

You obviously have not thought this through. Seems you want "natives" to be hired and employed but by making NYC unfriendly to business, they will flee and take their jobs with them, leaving natives with even less job opportunities. It makes absolutely no sense. If that is populist, I want no part of it.

If you want to fix the problem of some natives not being prepared for the NYC workforce, you have to figure out the root cause. Slapping on more regulations in an already over regulated, highly bureaucratic city will only add to the many problems this city faces.

The root cause is the education system. Why is it not preparing the natives for the jobs in this city? Fix this and you don't need to drive companies and jobs out with more crazy laws.

Another thing you are mistaken is thinking somehow the midwest is some brain factory. It isn't. Plenty of blue collar, unhighly educated people there. The best and brightest come from schools on the coast (e.g. Ivy league, Stanford), not Iowa.
Of course you don't want any part you Mr. Liberal. Of course I did not think this through. Of course it would have to be modified. And of course the nyc education system is a root problem. Education in NYC won't be fixed overnight. If nyc can't fix housing issues and transportation issues, imagine trying to fix education? I'm just trying to reduce income inequality. Didn't GE move thier financial and R&D to new England.? Especially since it is near plenty of college pool applicants. Harvard, Yale, MIT, boston college

Last edited by Bronxguyanese; 11-27-2016 at 07:32 AM..
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Old 11-27-2016, 08:02 AM
 
Location: New Jersey
5,499 posts, read 2,862,052 times
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LOL, I'm absolutely not liberal. Trump supporter here.

At least you realize that NYC's systems (government, transportation, education, etc.) are tough to fix. It's that way because of years and years of trying to fix problems by adding layers and layers of laws and regulations. Instead of fixing the root cause of problems, they slap on tons of bandaids that the newest layer is only trying to keep the next layer beneath from falling off. More regs = the bandaids.

Are you really fixing income inequity or are you rewarding failure and punishing success? Why should someone that studied hard to get good grades and good education make the same as a slacker?

People make what they are generally worth in the job market. There are individual exceptions of course but for the most part, it is true.

A person that put in the hard work and time to go to medical school shouldn't be "income equal" to a high school drop out.

All those natives that aren't making a lot of money from your personal anecdotes are not making lots of money because they aren't good enough, not because the system is unfair. Plenty of natives have made it...and made it big, in some cases.

Last edited by antinimby; 11-27-2016 at 08:10 AM..
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Old 11-27-2016, 08:09 AM
 
71,036 posts, read 71,338,147 times
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i am not surprised . nyc has always attracted and had an abundance of unskilled low level labor .
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Old 11-27-2016, 09:48 AM
 
3,252 posts, read 1,534,004 times
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From experience , living in Queens along the line. .. People do live paycheck to paycheck due to low pay jobs, high rent, BS expenses.

Imagine a 2 earner household making $60,000 to $80,000 per year, before tax. After tax , maybe $45,000 to $60,000 in pocket. The workers making this kind of money are Mid Level Managers, Manhattan Hotel Employees, Cab Drivers, Barbers, Physical Therapist. On the lower end , you have Department Store employees, and Service jobs in the other Boroughs. ,

The expenses are $1700 (avg) for rent, $500 utilities and mass transit, $600 food, we at $2800 mth / $32,000 yr with out the extras! Extras like if you own a car, spend at the mall, eat out, vacation, etc., this adds up!

So as you can see, $32.000 just to live and eat at home kinda comfortable, out of a take home salary of $45,000 to $60,000 per year, living here does takes up a big part of your income.

What people have to start doing is putting away money, direct deposit, in a separate account that is hard to get at. $100 a week at least, and dont even think about it. Not everyone is doing this, since they know no better. A number of people get careless with the credit cards, and carry a balance that never shrinks. $10 to $20 k balance on a credit card is probably the norm.

There is a lot of truth to the report. I would say there are many people 3 paychecks from homelessness as well.
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Old 11-27-2016, 12:22 PM
 
24,132 posts, read 17,508,177 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wawaweewa View Post
I think NYC is very hard to judge in this regard for a number of reasons.

1. Many immigrants will tell you that they're paycheck to paycheck even if they're millionaires. That's just immigrant culture. There are a lot of immigrants in NYC.

2. There is a huge underground economy and many will not divulge their off-the-books earnings.

3. Many are paycheck to paycheck because they spend too much not a as a result of earning too little.

4. As a result of the generous welfare state in NYC, many have an incentive to underreport/hide income.

5. A substantial percentage of NYC'ers only source of income is via government transfers (welfare, SSI, etc). Although they may be paycheck to paycheck in the technical sense, when was the last time the SSA missed a payment?
Immigrants come from very different countries, and very different cultures. There is no such thing as immigrant culture. Having grown up in a heavily Latino and South Asian neighborhood, there were many people living 20 people to an apartment, or 50 people to a house. These people weren't millionaires by any stretch of the imagination.

As for the underground economy, the majority of people involved in that are not living that well off either. Yes a drug dealer has more money than someone who works at McDonalds. Many dealers are in and out of prison, and even the dealers themselves would not argue that is a good life.

To get a residence in a nice part of town, it costs a fantastic amount of money ($3k) for a studio and you will need to earn 40 times that amount.

NYC has had skyrocketing numbers of homeless, so if things were so great with jobs and for that matter off the books income we would not be seeing all these homeless.

Btw, social services has been cut and many landlords won't take welfare vouchers.
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Old 11-27-2016, 03:46 PM
 
20,612 posts, read 13,629,904 times
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Staten Island Advance had an interesting take on this "study".
Study: 60 percent of New Yorkers could end up homeless | SILive.com


Basically both on the Rock like the rest of NYC "cheap" housing is vanishing and everyone else is paying more, especially rentals. People are finding themselves strapped after paying housing costs to the point there isn't much left in the kitty, this includes putting away for savings.


Staten Island has very little rental housing, and much of what does exist comes from apartments in private homes (one, two or whatever family). When a place is sold today more likely than not it is to a developer who plans to tear it down and build townhouses. That is good for someone looking to buy I suppose, but if you need to rent...
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Old 11-27-2016, 03:58 PM
 
2,835 posts, read 3,756,703 times
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The more we try to fix the problem the worst it will get. Even if you take housing out of the picture, many people simply aren't making the kinds of funds needed to live here comfortably, nor have the skillset to get the jobs needed to do so. I know I'll get called heartless, but many people need to head to lower COL places period if they want any hope of getting ahead. The other part of the picture as Antinimby pointed out is education. It's time for NYC to embrace school choice.
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Old 11-27-2016, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
19,492 posts, read 34,556,555 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shizzles View Post
The more we try to fix the problem the worst it will get. Even if you take housing out of the picture, many people simply aren't making the kinds of funds needed to live here comfortably, nor have the skillset to get the jobs needed to do so. I know I'll get called heartless, but many people need to head to lower COL places period if they want any hope of getting ahead. The other part of the picture as Antinimby pointed out is education. It's time for NYC to embrace school choice.
But do those lower COL places have enough jobs?
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Old 11-27-2016, 04:04 PM
 
2,835 posts, read 3,756,703 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeventhFloor View Post
But do those lower COL places have enough jobs?
Depends. Major metros like Dallas, Atlanta, Phoenix and Charlotte do. Obviously, you shouldn't relocate to Youngstown, OH or Buffalo.
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