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Old 12-07-2016, 10:42 AM
 
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Originally Posted by bg7 View Post
We'd be a whole lot better off if the North East coast and West coast states formed their own union, and the remainder of the states formed theirs. Then we'd all be happier - everyone would have the tax, gun, welfare and educational policies that suits them. No doubt there'd be some migration between the two different unions occurring, but it'd work out a whole lot better than trying to shoehorn increasingly diametrically opposed groups into one pot.

This would be the right thing to do, but unfortunately, there are studies that confirmed that the poorer states already receive more in aid from the wealthier states/cities than what they pay in taxes so fat chance they'll agree to a decoupling (which is also the same case with the UK brexiters vis--vis City of London). Furthermore, the poorer states KNOW that their credit worthiness will suffer (and hence cost of borrowings will go up) if the wealthier states leave the union and they will face perpetual social and political instability because of it. In a way, the northeasterners who opposed the Louisiana Purchase were being prescient by anticipating that the treaty would bring in a demographic that is not in sync with them.
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Old 12-07-2016, 10:44 AM
bg7
 
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Originally Posted by Forest_Hills_Daddy View Post
This would be the right thing to do, but unfortunately, there are studies that confirmed that the poorer states already receive more in aid from the wealthier states/cities than what they pay in taxes so fat chance they'll agree to a decoupling (which is also the same case with the UK brexiters vis--vis City of London). Furthermore, the poorer states KNOW that their credit worthiness will suffer (and hence cost of borrowings will go up) if the wealthier states leave the union and they will face perpetual social and political instability because of it. In a way, the northeasterners who opposed the Louisiana Purchase were being prescient by anticipating that the treaty would bring in a demographic that is not in sync with them.
Oh we could still send them some welfare money to get their guns and bibles off our backs. We already send them it so whats the difference?
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Old 12-07-2016, 10:53 AM
 
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Originally Posted by bg7 View Post
Oh we could still send them some welfare money to get their guns and bibles off our backs. We already send them it so whats the difference?

As long as they're fine with welfare money and not make it our burden to provide them with "middle class jobs". As it looks today, the Trump gameplan is twofold. One, use the progressive states' high creditworthiness to borrow money and fund a massive pointless infrastructure program in the Midwest where furloughed blue collar workers can land construction jobs. Two, use fortune 500 corporations headquartered in progressive states as vehicles for crony capitalism and the propagation of rent-seeking jobs (e.g., UTI). None could be achieved without CA, NY, CT, WA etc. in the union. I guess it makes things simple if we just gave them money to go away like the Byzantines paid off the Huns.
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Old 12-07-2016, 11:10 AM
bg7
 
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Originally Posted by Forest_Hills_Daddy View Post
As long as they're fine with welfare money and not make it our burden to provide them with "middle class jobs". As it looks today, the Trump gameplan is twofold. One, use the progressive states' high creditworthiness to borrow money and fund a massive pointless infrastructure program in the Midwest where furloughed blue collar workers can land construction jobs. Two, use fortune 500 corporations headquartered in progressive states as vehicles for crony capitalism and the propagation of rent-seeking jobs (e.g., UTI). None could be achieved without CA, NY, CT, WA etc. in the union. I guess it makes things simple if we just gave them money to go away like the Byzantines paid off the Huns.
Well at the very least I think there'd be a whole lot less anger in the two unions summed as compared to the present union.
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Old 12-07-2016, 07:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by bg7 View Post
We'd be a whole lot better off if the North East coast and West coast states formed their own union, and the remainder of the states formed theirs. Then we'd all be happier - everyone would have the tax, gun, welfare and educational policies that suits them. No doubt there'd be some migration between the two different unions occurring, but it'd work out a whole lot better than trying to shoehorn increasingly diametrically opposed groups into one pot.
If that were to happen the whole economy would just collapse. You'd just be accelerating the end of the empute. Its our diversity of states, geography, thought, beliefs, etc...that makes our nation so great. The red states would just raid and pillage the blue states. Just remember where the guns and most of the military members are. Attempting to split the union would lead to civil war, and the bankers, lawyers, techies, and scholars don't stand a chance in the battlefield.
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Old 12-07-2016, 08:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Forest_Hills_Daddy View Post
This would be the right thing to do, but unfortunately, there are studies that confirmed that the poorer states already receive more in aid from the wealthier states/cities than what they pay in taxes so fat chance they'll agree to a decoupling (which is also the same case with the UK brexiters vis--vis City of London). Furthermore, the poorer states KNOW that their credit worthiness will suffer (and hence cost of borrowings will go up) if the wealthier states leave the union and they will face perpetual social and political instability because of it. In a way, the northeasterners who opposed the Louisiana Purchase were being prescient by anticipating that the treaty would bring in a demographic that is not in sync with them.
These so called wealthier states have a crapload of debt. Some parts of California might already be insolvent.
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Old 12-07-2016, 08:16 PM
 
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These so called wealthier states have a crapload of debt. Some parts of California might already be insolvent.
No, California is not insolvent. Quite the opposite. They have an AA- credit rating.
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Old 12-07-2016, 10:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Forest_Hills_Daddy View Post
No, California is not insolvent. Quite the opposite. They have an AA- credit rating.
I didn't realize we're still trusting those credit ratings. I bet you also think CalPERS is actuarially sound. Hopefully their investment allocation scheme is riding the Trump rally too. He might just be their savior. Assuming they're not overweight on their own biotech stocks.
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Old 12-08-2016, 04:28 AM
 
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Originally Posted by G-Dale View Post
I didn't realize we're still trusting those credit ratings. I bet you also think CalPERS is actuarially sound. Hopefully their investment allocation scheme is riding the Trump rally too. He might just be their savior. Assuming they're not overweight on their own biotech stocks.
We should trust them. It's an accurate measure of creditworthiness and borrowing capacity, which explains why cost of capital across the entire usa is so low (an indisputable fact that the trump states take for granted).
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Old 12-08-2016, 04:45 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Forest_Hills_Daddy View Post
We should trust them. It's an accurate measure of creditworthiness and borrowing capacity, which explains why cost of capital across the entire usa is so low (an indisputable fact that the trump states take for granted).
Its a lot more reassuring to lend to the coasts, which have the overwhelming number of the ports that can distribute the goods that the lending allows them to purchase. So makes sense they'd have higher creditworthiness. Does that give the coasts reason to cut off the rest of the country from goods? The coasts can get greedy while racking up immense debt at the same time. The blue states are instigating a revolution that they can't win. The smug attitude the liberals have has to eventually end, whether by their choice or not. At this point its just a matter of when.
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