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Old 12-17-2016, 02:53 PM
 
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Same thing with these this mythical artist class we hear about turning neighborhoods around. Just because someone is 22 with a degree that cost their parents 100,000 dollars does NOT even remotely make them an artist. It just makes them turning the hood into a post-college dorm for infantalized adults.
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Old 12-17-2016, 03:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by antinimby View Post
No, as usual you are wrong. Red states don't improve conditions for LGBTQ on their own. Growing numbers of this community moving in and start changing the political climate there. And the reason why they are growing in those places? They are forced out of the traditional liberal coastal cities because of economics so they go to cheaper red states. If the red states were expensive, they wouldn't be going there.

You, of course, are going to argue and come up with some nonsense just so you can get in the last word and be the NYC Citydata forum champ.
Present actual evidence that gay people have changed any red state politically. You can't because none exists. People are moving to where they can afford to live and making the best of things, but this is true of all people of all orientations, genders,and race. And that's GOOD.
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Old 12-17-2016, 03:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Aquarius37 View Post
As a gay person myself (although I identify more as an autosexual/asexual), it gets tiresome seeing people talking about how gays make awful places great again. It's really only the gays with money who couple up, many times with with rich older men caring for poor younger men. It's quite a stereotype (while not a negative stereotype, it is a stereotype nonetheless and it would be nice is straight-indentifying humans stopped with saying gays save neighborhoods and make it better for others). Straight people (of all colors) have done just as much work in turning neighborhoods around.
Honestly straight people do more. Neighborhoods like Chelsea in the end did not become expensive because of gay people. Institutional investors and developers got huge tax credits to build all the new luxury housing in Chelsea and to redevelop the neighborhood with high end retail. This had nothing to do with gay people. It has a convenient location between downtown and midtown which made it attractive to investors. Ditto the Village. If anything gay people got displaced from the West Village and Chelsea. Or with gay bars going out of business in those places, the neighborhoods no longer had the same level of attraction (plus social media has reduced the need for gay bars).
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Old 12-17-2016, 03:07 PM
 
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Originally Posted by EastBoundandDownChick View Post
A lot of my gay friends have left for my hometown of Detroit. While it's a liberal city, it's very much a Red State nowadays in Michigan. And very affordable with a robust and growing creative scene. One couple I know has amazing property there they bought during the housing crisis, an authentic Frank Lloyd Wright house they'd NEVER be able to afford here, furnished with authentic Murano glass chandeliers and beautiful artwork, interior design done by a local well-known professional. Over 3,000 square feet and a full yard with a garden and reflecting pool. I visited and it was restored as intended, absolutely stunning, in a safe area. They are able to afford it running a florist business in a wealthy nearby suburb. I can't really blame them. Before they lived in a smaller Brooklyn condo, had no yard, and nowhere near the quality of life they enjoy now from what I can tell. No one judges their lifestyle and they seem very happy. The only time it gets that way is when you get far out of the metro area and into the ultra-conservative parts. I'm pretty sure gay people know their way around this stuff quite well.
Yes. A lot of the wealthier gays who had property in Manhattan (owned a co-op or condo, say one or two bedrooms) have sold and bailed out for cheaper destinations where they have much more. Many to "red" states. But even if someone went to upstate NY, upstate NY is very red.

The couple you mentioned was just very smart and ahead of the trend, as some people are.
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Old 12-17-2016, 03:08 PM
 
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Agreeance. Straight people LOVE giving gay people credit for turning neighborhoods around, but it's a totally false narrative. I think they feel better about themselves as horrible gentrifiers if gay people caused the locals to get kicked out than their own straight white butts and international investors. But people love to believe what the love to believe.
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Old 12-17-2016, 03:10 PM
 
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And hey straight people? Gay people are NOT your pets. Get over yourselves, cuz you stink!
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Old 12-17-2016, 03:55 PM
 
Location: Glendale NY
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Austin, Texas is pretty gay friendly.
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Old 12-17-2016, 04:31 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquarius37 View Post
As a gay person myself (although I identify more as an autosexual/asexual), it gets tiresome seeing people talking about how gays make awful places great again. It's really only the gays with money who couple up, many times with with rich older men caring for poor younger men. It's quite a stereotype (while not a negative stereotype, it is a stereotype nonetheless and it would be nice is straight-indentifying humans stopped with saying gays save neighborhoods and make it better for others). Straight people (of all colors) have done just as much work in turning neighborhoods around.
There was a documentary on PBS called 'Flag Wars', which talked about the transformation of East Columbus, OH, and the unintended clash between the long living African American residents and the newer gay residents. It was a very interesting program. From watching the program, I didn't see the gays featured as 'having money'. They had enough to either rent or buy the properties (which, in their dilapidated state, were considered cheap!). But they weren't high execs or CEO's, and what not!

As a Black man who is wary of stereotypes, I must ask whether the ability of a group, or any group, of people to see value somewhere, settle there, create a vibrant scene over of time and not only transform that community, but to have some power and influence; is that 'stigma' necessarily a bad thing? I saw Park Slope, Bed Stuy and Harlem. I learned about the transformation of San Francisco East Columbus and Atlanta. And now, potentially, Detroit.....!
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Old 12-17-2016, 04:37 PM
 
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^ thanks, I am going to look that up and watch it
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Old 12-17-2016, 04:53 PM
 
23,269 posts, read 16,114,118 times
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Originally Posted by scatman View Post
There was a documentary on PBS called 'Flag Wars', which talked about the transformation of East Columbus, OH, and the unintended clash between the long living African American residents and the newer gay residents. It was a very interesting program. From watching the program, I didn't see the gays featured as 'having money'. They had enough to either rent or buy the properties (which, in their dilapidated state, were considered cheap!). But they weren't high execs or CEO's, and what not!

As a Black man who is wary of stereotypes, I must ask whether the ability of a group, or any group, of people to see value somewhere, settle there, create a vibrant scene over of time and not only transform that community, but to have some power and influence; is that 'stigma' necessarily a bad thing? I saw Park Slope, Bed Stuy and Harlem. I learned about the transformation of San Francisco East Columbus and Atlanta. And now, potentially, Detroit.....!
Yes it is a bad stigma. A few gays, or a few hundred gays moving into a neighborhood does not magically transform it. Many gays because of discrimination in the workforce only have access to low paying service sector jobs. There is NOT ENOUGH MONEY in the gay community to truly gentrify a significant part of any city. The gentrification is done by straight investors, straight governments passing public policies that encourage inner city investment, straight banks giving out the loans and mortgages, etc.
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