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Old 12-24-2016, 12:40 AM
 
1,952 posts, read 1,300,923 times
Reputation: 2489

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post
If you want to win any election in NYC. The biggest voting blocks are blacks and Jews. Yeah, ugh ugh. Black and Jewish. Black and Jewish, black and Jewish, black and Jewish. If I was running for mayor, on day one I'm going to synagogue and a Baptist church.
Great strategy ! A captive audience who will follow a leaders instruction. Easier than going house to house, block to block.

 
Old 12-24-2016, 01:09 AM
 
31,909 posts, read 26,979,379 times
Reputation: 24814
Israel and the Jews living there have a problem; they are surrounded by neighbors that would love nothing more than to blow that state off the face of earth. Thus far this fate has been avoided for a few reasons but mainly because Western European governments and the USA have always had Israel's back (pay back over in action over the Holocaust/WWII?).


However for a group that never misses a beat to remind the world of those horrible events, Israel has been doing some pretty nasty things to Palestine including constant expansion and land grabs. For this and other things the aforementioned western governments long have given Israel a pass.


As the Baby Boom generation begins to age and or die off, the generations behind who came of age or are born well beyond the post WWII period see things in quite a different light. It also isn't going to help Israel's case in that within those same demographics you have young Jews whose ideas and opinions are not formed by the clouds of WWII.


When people like Chuck Schumer finally leave politics (and or this earth) those who step into their shoes are likely to have very different ideas about foreign policy as it relates to Israel.
 
Old 12-24-2016, 01:30 AM
 
25,556 posts, read 23,975,910 times
Reputation: 10120
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
Israel and the Jews living there have a problem; they are surrounded by neighbors that would love nothing more than to blow that state off the face of earth. Thus far this fate has been avoided for a few reasons but mainly because Western European governments and the USA have always had Israel's back (pay back over in action over the Holocaust/WWII?).


However for a group that never misses a beat to remind the world of those horrible events, Israel has been doing some pretty nasty things to Palestine including constant expansion and land grabs. For this and other things the aforementioned western governments long have given Israel a pass.


As the Baby Boom generation begins to age and or die off, the generations behind who came of age or are born well beyond the post WWII period see things in quite a different light. It also isn't going to help Israel's case in that within those same demographics you have young Jews whose ideas and opinions are not formed by the clouds of WWII.


When people like Chuck Schumer finally leave politics (and or this earth) those who step into their shoes are likely to have very different ideas about foreign policy as it relates to Israel.
Obama in 2008 didn't incorporate support for Israel into his platform, and nor did Trump. The Jewish people Trump's kids married honestly could care less about Israel, as you just mentioned their ideas and opinions are not formed by the clouds of WWII.
 
Old 12-24-2016, 02:38 AM
 
Location: Bronx
16,200 posts, read 23,045,839 times
Reputation: 8345
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
Obama in 2008 didn't incorporate support for Israel into his platform, and nor did Trump. The Jewish people Trump's kids married honestly could care less about Israel, as you just mentioned their ideas and opinions are not formed by the clouds of WWII.

What are you talking about? Trump is the most Jewish candidate in us presidential history. Israel was on Trump platform from the get go. Let me pull up a brother nathanael video. What the last part.

https://youtu.be/kxslhsO9iPY


https://youtu.be/G59mNNfLZx8

Last edited by Bronxguyanese; 12-24-2016 at 02:48 AM..
 
Old 12-24-2016, 02:45 AM
 
25,556 posts, read 23,975,910 times
Reputation: 10120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post
What are you talking about? Trump is the most Jewish candidate in us presidential history. Israel was on Trump platform from the get go. Let me pull up a brother nathanael video.
There is no way Trump gives a rat's butt about Israel, and he is not a Jewish candidate.

You're stereotyping Jews as being all in real estate or finance or media.

In NYC, you have many more Jewish people working in education or social services or in small businesses than you do in those sectors. The Jews in anything to do with government funding in NYC are in fear of the rise of Trump. Most Jewish people in NYC are not RICH!
 
Old 12-24-2016, 03:32 AM
 
Location: Chicago
6,359 posts, read 8,833,185 times
Reputation: 5871
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugsyPal View Post
Israel and the Jews living there have a problem; they are surrounded by neighbors that would love nothing more than to blow that state off the face of earth. Thus far this fate has been avoided for a few reasons but mainly because Western European governments and the USA have always had Israel's back (pay back over in action over the Holocaust/WWII?).


However for a group that never misses a beat to remind the world of those horrible events, Israel has been doing some pretty nasty things to Palestine including constant expansion and land grabs. For this and other things the aforementioned western governments long have given Israel a pass.


As the Baby Boom generation begins to age and or die off, the generations behind who came of age or are born well beyond the post WWII period see things in quite a different light. It also isn't going to help Israel's case in that within those same demographics you have young Jews whose ideas and opinions are not formed by the clouds of WWII.


When people like Chuck Schumer finally leave politics (and or this earth) those who step into their shoes are likely to have very different ideas about foreign policy as it relates to Israel.
I am hesitant to use the term "Israel" anymore. I prefer the more accurate term, "Israel Palestine". Israel's military, certainly with the backing of the United States, is incredibly powerful so I don't see much fear of the military of the surrounding neighbors. What I do see is the destruction of the so called Jewish state internally.

Demographics will destroy the concept of zionism. Already between the Jordan and the Mediterranean, you have a basic 50/50 split among Jews and Palestinians (and that doesn't even take into account all the"guest workers" (who aren't going anywhere), refugees from Africa, and other assorted groups. Israel killed the very notion of remaining a "Jewish state" by allowing mass scale settlements to build up scattered throughout the West Bank. And that 50/50 split between Jews and Arabs will change. Palestinian brith rates exceed Jewish ones, so the numbers don't favor the Jewish state.

So they face reality: you cannot separate Jew from Palestinian and there is not an ounce of possibility of a two state solution. Israel/Palestine is one.....and the old saw is right....you can't be both Jewish and democratic at the same time.

The world community has had it with the human rights violations of the zionist state and through movements like BDS will continue to pressure Israel to end apartheid and become a state for all its people. A weakening US will not be able to continue its meaningful backing of Israel and its excesses.

I'm a 70 year old Jewish man and I find absolutely nothing Jewish about the so called Jewish state. It was a land grab from the start and a stain on the Jewish people. It goes against the strong, liberal Jewish tradition of seeking justice and equality for all. Look at American Jewry and its history:we have been at the forefront of every progressive movement in this nation, arguably from the era starting at the end of the Civil War.

Israel doesn't give a rat's ass about world Jewry and so much of anti-semitism comes from falsely equating "Jew" with "Israel".

Today, huge numbers of American Jews fight the injustices of Israel and its treatment of the Palestinian people. We don't believe in a "Jewish state" because we don't believe in a state for any group of people: a state is there to serve the needs of all its people. equally. Israel does not stand for Jewish values.

And today's younger Jews, raised in a pluralistic world, embracing diversity, more and more turn against Israel.

Jews are not victims. They (we) are not the only ones to receive prejudice, discrimination, and far worse. And when it comes to those things, Jews have been on the "giving" end every much as we have on the "receiving" end. Thank you, Israel, for bursting any notion of Jews being different. You managed to blast a big hole in the concept of Jewish exceptionalism.

Israel is a colonial/settler society, doing what westerners (Europeans) have been doing since the time of Columbus: taking over the lands of others. My own nation, the United States, is a colonial/settler society, our record as such has been dispicable on my levels. But please do not conflate the US with Israel. Yes, we took lands from others, but when we did, we did not make those who lived there legally less than we Americans. From New Orleans acquired from France, the annexation of Texas and the land grab that followed from New Mexico to California, the people that were taken in by the expanding American borders were granted full American citizenship.

You can't control demographics. Never have. Never will. They change. So during this very century, even before its midpoint, white America will fall from majority to plurality; already the children of America are a non-white majority. And side by side, Israel's demographics change, too, becoming less Jewish and certainly, soon enough, to a non-Jewish majority. Whites belong in the US....but this is not a white nation. Jews belong in Israel....but it is not a Jewish nation. Whites in America and Jews in Israel are fabrics of their respective societies; but they don't "own" them, nor should their status be special.

To me, Israel truly is the anti-Jewish state, an abomination of ethnocentrism, scarily little more than a half century removed from how that concept played out in mid-20th century Europe. I oppose zionist Israel, the self-proclaimed "Jewish state" for many reasons.....but no reason as important as my being a Jew.

Last edited by edsg25; 12-24-2016 at 03:48 AM..
 
Old 12-24-2016, 04:45 AM
 
43,659 posts, read 44,393,687 times
Reputation: 20559
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pruzhany View Post
President Obama used his lame-duck period in office for a major anti-Israel action, by not providing the customary U.S. veto to this resolution.

US abstains as UN demands end to Israeli settlements
US abstains as UN demands end to Israeli settlements - CNNPolitics.com

So, Have the Democrats just lost it's footing in NYC?
I doubt it especially since President Obama will no longer be president in less than a month.
 
Old 12-24-2016, 05:19 AM
 
Location: Bronx
16,200 posts, read 23,045,839 times
Reputation: 8345
The Jewish people are historically a divided people. 2200 years ago, Jews were divided to rather or not they should embrace the wider culture of the Mediterranean known has hellenism that spread from Greece to far west as Spain, and for inland as the city of Babylon. Jews were giving their kids greek names and even building greek styled Complexes building. After all, the Jews saw the Greek king, Alexander the great as thier liberator from Persian rule. 300 years later Jews were divided about rather submitting to Rome or not. Most resisted and the Romans kicked the Jews out of Palestine for good in the year of 72 ad. During the American Revolution, many Jews were iffy about supporting the rebellion against the British here in NYC due to the fact Jews in the city depended on commercial business and mercantile trade of Britain. While most Jews in America vote Democrat and centrally liberal. Some are Republicans as well. Some Jews support Israel, while others can careless. Ultra othrodox Jews don't believe in the existence of a Jewish state. Israel is an issue that divides all Jewish people who lives outside of Israel.
 
Old 12-24-2016, 06:45 AM
 
25,556 posts, read 23,975,910 times
Reputation: 10120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post
The Jewish people are historically a divided people. 2200 years ago, Jews were divided to rather or not they should embrace the wider culture of the Mediterranean known has hellenism that spread from Greece to far west as Spain, and for inland as the city of Babylon. Jews were giving their kids greek names and even building greek styled Complexes building. After all, the Jews saw the Greek king, Alexander the great as thier liberator from Persian rule. 300 years later Jews were divided about rather submitting to Rome or not. Most resisted and the Romans kicked the Jews out of Palestine for good in the year of 72 ad. During the American Revolution, many Jews were iffy about supporting the rebellion against the British here in NYC due to the fact Jews in the city depended on commercial business and mercantile trade of Britain. While most Jews in America vote Democrat and centrally liberal. Some are Republicans as well. Some Jews support Israel, while others can careless. Ultra othrodox Jews don't believe in the existence of a Jewish state. Israel is an issue that divides all Jewish people who lives outside of Israel.
It means they are like any other PEOPLE. There is no such group of people where everyone feels or thinks the same way, and there never will be.

People are not the BORG from Star Trek.
 
Old 12-24-2016, 06:52 AM
 
Location: Elsewhere
88,580 posts, read 84,795,337 times
Reputation: 115100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxguyanese View Post
Dude. Wtf are you talking about. I'm talking about the origin of American Jews which are overwhelmingly Ashkenazi. And from central and. Eastern Europe. I did not mention the origins of Jews. In matter of fact Sephardic Jews is not the oldest. It's Mizrahi Jews which lived throughout the middle east and thr Levant for centuries. Sephardic Jews originated from the Iberian peninsula in the city of toledo.
Sephardic Jews were in NYC first, 1654. Congregation Shearith Israel.

ETA: Oops, saw you mentioned that further down.
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