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Old 07-16-2017, 03:28 PM
 
11,493 posts, read 5,547,302 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Dale View Post
Most conservatives do not support random stop and frisk. For the most part, stop and frisk means nothing to us as it isn't prevalent in conservative neighborhoods. But if it were, conservatives would be against 100% because it attacks freedoms.

Most conservatives do not support war. We support a federal government that provides a concentration of its resources on defense. For example, cyber security should be a priority, but Democrats obviously dropped the ball on that one. We need a special investigation as to why the Obama administration couldn't keep our networks safe.
Most conservatives seem to support stop and frisk. Just look at City Data. Of course they wouldnt want it to happen to them, but they want black people to be stoppee and frisked.

And most conservatives supported the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.

Oh and most conservatives support the death penalty, while real libertarians do not.

 
Old 07-16-2017, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
7,901 posts, read 6,472,299 times
Reputation: 7088
Libertarianism is a fantasy world. No one should follow it any more than they should religion.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 03:34 PM
 
1,975 posts, read 1,234,875 times
Reputation: 1182
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Dale View Post
Parents in underprivileged neighborhoods should have the freedom to send their kids to school outside their district. Not institutionalized bussing, but better options should be available if their local government fails them.
Bad schools are a result of bad parenting. There not enough good schools in NYC to spread around the amount of bad parenting going on. The good parents will be overwhelmed and move to the suburbs or private school. There is a reason NYC DOE caters to middle class families and it because without them NYC public school will be a even bigger failure than it already is.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 03:37 PM
 
1,975 posts, read 1,234,875 times
Reputation: 1182
Quote:
Originally Posted by l1995 View Post
Most conservatives seem to support stop and frisk. Just look at City Data. Of course they wouldnt want it to happen to them, but they want black people to be stoppee and frisked.
90% of violent crimes in NYC is committed by black and Hispanic. Even people in the ghetto call out for stop and frisk. If you dislike stop and frisk it most likely, because you yourself fit the description and personality of someone who would commit a violent crime.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 04:02 PM
 
23,247 posts, read 16,049,776 times
Reputation: 8529
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYer23 View Post
90% of violent crimes in NYC is committed by black and Hispanic. Even people in the ghetto call out for stop and frisk. If you dislike stop and frisk it most likely, because you yourself fit the description and personality of someone who would commit a violent crime.
No. I don't support stop and frisk. It's a violation of constitutional rights.

The majority of people who did time due to stop and frisk got caught with drugs. So while poor ghetto people get busted for drugs, white people who consume large numbers of drugs don't get caught. Especially well off white people.

There is a constitutional amendment that actually forbids unreasonable search and seizure, which is why stop and frisk was found unconstitutional by the federal courts. The cops have to see you actually commit a crime before stopping and frisking you. You cannot legally stop someone because they MIGHT commit a crime, and at that level it really doesn't matter what SOME people call for, and whether they are from the ghetto or not.

If someone is breaking into a store or has shot someone, of course they can be stopped and frisked as they have been seen to commit a crime. If someone isn't seen to be doing a criminal act, they can't be stopped and frisked.

Given the current mood towards cops and the lawsuits that arise if someone is even hurt, you can read Airborneguy's posts on how cops will not risk their pension and all they have worked for over such foolishness. In short they aren't doing anything unless something bad goes down.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 04:08 PM
 
3,333 posts, read 3,280,911 times
Reputation: 2834
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
No one is expecting someone to let homeless sleep in their houses, give away all their disposable income to the poor, etc (at least no one who isn't either mentally ill or extremely low IQ).

However pointing out the hypocritical attitudes of people or if the city as a whole is valid and justice. New York City claims to love it's diversity and love it's immigrants and minorities, yet they protect the wealthiest white people in a district called zone 2 where other people cannot send their kids to go to school. Granted those are the only wealthy white Manhattan neighborhoods (the district doesn't include the UWS or LES) but there is no excuse for maintaining this kind of segregation in a city where all residents in some form or another are paying taxes.

I think one reason why people point that out is that it's not okay for these schools to take in one or two non whites while excluding the rest of the city. People who live in the outer boroughs and upper Manhattan (all those minorities/immigrants) are paying taxes for public schools in NYC as well. It's called tokenism (superficially choosing one or two individual minorities to deflect accusations of racism). People these days easily see through this, and it's just not acceptable.

I think that's where wawaweewa is coming from.
Correct. Furthermore, the residents of District 2 are gaming the school system. It's become a deal that is too good to pass up.

District 2 public schools are essentially private schools run with public money. Instead of sending their children to private school at $40K+/child, the parents pay a few thousand per child into the PTA coffers and get themselves a private school at the public expense. The PTA boards are the real administrators of these schools.

District 15 in Brooklyn is becoming another District 2.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 04:19 PM
 
9,871 posts, read 7,676,937 times
Reputation: 4669
Quote:
Originally Posted by l1995 View Post
Most conservatives seem to support stop and frisk. Just look at City Data. Of course they wouldnt want it to happen to them, but they want black people to be stoppee and frisked.

And most conservatives supported the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.

Oh and most conservatives support the death penalty, while real libertarians do not.
Maybe they just want neighborhoods in which the taxpayers financially support the living existence within it to not have drastically higher crime rates than the national average. Is it the conservatives fault these happen to be Black/Hispanic majority neighborhoods?

Most Liberals supported the Iraq and Afghanistan wars too.

Death penalty? How many chances do you need? We are all very replaceable. Liberals rather just kill them before they are born. Before they ever even had one chance.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 04:22 PM
 
9,871 posts, read 7,676,937 times
Reputation: 4669
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYer23 View Post
Bad schools are a result of bad parenting. There not enough good schools in NYC to spread around the amount of bad parenting going on. The good parents will be overwhelmed and move to the suburbs or private school. There is a reason NYC DOE caters to middle class families and it because without them NYC public school will be a even bigger failure than it already is.
I'm sure the city can reallocate plenty of other inefficient programs towards the DOE instead. More than plenty for that matter.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 04:29 PM
 
11,493 posts, read 5,547,302 times
Reputation: 5949
Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Dale View Post
Maybe they just want neighborhoods in which the taxpayers financially support the living existence within it to not have drastically higher crime rates than the national average. Is it the conservatives fault these happen to be Black/Hispanic majority neighborhoods?

Most Liberals supported the Iraq and Afghanistan wars too.

Death penalty? How many chances do you need? We are all very replaceable. Liberals rather just kill them before they are born. Before they ever even had one chance.
Even the "bad" parts of NYC aren't particularly dangerous anymore, and stop and frisk is almost gone now.

Obviously some areas will need more policing than others, but systematic stop and frisk is a violation of consitutional rights. Conservatives would be furious if their children were ever stopped and friskes.

No, most liberals did not support war, though some did at first.

Anyway my point is that most conservatives are not libertarians, which I don't think you're disagreeing with.
 
Old 07-16-2017, 04:30 PM
 
9,871 posts, read 7,676,937 times
Reputation: 4669
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
No. I don't support stop and frisk. It's a violation of constitutional rights.

The majority of people who did time due to stop and frisk got caught with drugs. So while poor ghetto people get busted for drugs, white people who consume large numbers of drugs don't get caught. Especially well off white people.

There is a constitutional amendment that actually forbids unreasonable search and seizure, which is why stop and frisk was found unconstitutional by the federal courts. The cops have to see you actually commit a crime before stopping and frisking you. You cannot legally stop someone because they MIGHT commit a crime, and at that level it really doesn't matter what SOME people call for, and whether they are from the ghetto or not.

If someone is breaking into a store or has shot someone, of course they can be stopped and frisked as they have been seen to commit a crime. If someone isn't seen to be doing a criminal act, they can't be stopped and frisked.

Given the current mood towards cops and the lawsuits that arise if someone is even hurt, you can read Airborneguy's posts on how cops will not risk their pension and all they have worked for over such foolishness. In short they aren't doing anything unless something bad goes down.
It is a false narrative that most people do time for drugs as a result of stop and frisk. In reality they got caught with drugs, but they also happened to have a pistol. So if they really want to reduce prison terms in NYS, they should legalize pistols too.

And in stop and frisk neighborhoods there are more reports of crime called in by the people living in the neighborhood. So naturally cops look for the culprit.
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