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Old 10-05-2019, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
9,139 posts, read 7,361,965 times
Reputation: 8659

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bxlover View Post
Well I came out of some rough projects and did not cling to victim status. I am successful. Did not commit crimes. Did not take the easy way. Not taking the easy way, my wife and I stayed in the Bronx. We add to the tax base, vote, do jury duty, sweep in front of our house, serve as an example to our child and children who observe us working and contributing in our neighborhood that is middle class/with many on public assitance section 8, and we have the Castle Hill projects not too far away. Any policing strategy implemented should respect people like me and not make me feel uncomforble. I expect the criminals to be jerks, that's why we have the police. By and large my interactions with cops have been pleasant. I called the police a year ago to my home and when they came, we shared bottles of water and soda as it was hot outside and they were guests to our homes. But when people like me raise a complaint it's not because we are being unreasonable.
I was by no means directing that comment at you. I donít get the victimhood vibe from you in the slightest.
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Old 10-05-2019, 04:36 PM
 
4,039 posts, read 1,502,798 times
Reputation: 1875
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
I was by no means directing that comment at you. I donít get the victimhood vibe from you in the slightest.
I know you didn't mean me. Just saying maybe people who complain are not always people who believe they are victims Your a good man.
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Old 10-05-2019, 08:16 PM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
3,219 posts, read 6,410,499 times
Reputation: 1297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cida View Post
I find this happens a lot, from my point of view, but this was a really obvious example.

The perpetual primary discussion issue was whether or not there was an illegal choke-hold. It always seemed to me that a primary discussion might have been, why is the police expending so much manpower/force on someone selling loose cigarettes? And then there's the broader issue of whether ultimately a main reason for his death was his being overweight.
"Broken Windows" gone amok!

Overzealous policing on little crimes! Everyone knew what the result would be! And they got that result!
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Old 10-06-2019, 09:17 AM
 
2,004 posts, read 732,526 times
Reputation: 2124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
I too refuse to acknowledge victimhood. My fatherís family is Armenian. They fled our genocide as Iím sure you experienced in Yugoslavia. They had to change the spelling of our last name to garner acceptance, even in NYC! I canít imagine what the first members of my bloodline experienced. But they worked - hard. They refused to commit crimes and join gangs. They made sure their kids paid attention in school, they bought houses, they didnít complain. So here I am now. The same path is open to everyone.

Right, Armenians also had a horrible history, and have generally done well everywhere as immigrants supporting themselves whith their own efforts. Here in Singapore there is Armenian Street and a little historic Armenian Church. The most well known Armenians here were four brothers who came to malarial joungles of Southeast Asia to run initially modest traveler accomodations in four different cities - the one in Singapore has subsequently grown into a grand historic tropical hotel which is probably the most famous landmark in Singapore. There was no section 8 when the Armenian guy arrived to the malarial joungle to run his inn, and there is no section 8 (or any other form of welfare) in Singapore now. Every citizen is legally required to contribute a major part of income to their own safety fund, from which they draw if they become unemployed. There are occupational training and job-matching centers that quickly place unemployed people into jobs. There is a legal requirement to take care of one's own family members if they become financially distressed. Getting a gift of taxpayer money just because one has kids and no job would be a totally incomprehensible idea here.
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Old 10-06-2019, 09:50 AM
 
2,004 posts, read 732,526 times
Reputation: 2124
Quote:
Originally Posted by bxlover View Post
Well I came out of some rough projects and did not cling to victim status. I am successful. Did not commit crimes. Did not take the easy way. Not taking the easy way, my wife and I stayed in the Bronx. We add to the tax base, vote, do jury duty, sweep in front of our house, serve as an example to our child and children who observe us working and contributing in our neighborhood that is middle class/with many on public assitance section 8, and we have the Castle Hill projects not too far away. Any policing strategy implemented should respect people like me and not make me feel uncomforble. I expect the criminals to be jerks, that's why we have the police. By and large my interactions with cops have been pleasant. I called the police a year ago to my home and when they came, we shared bottles of water and soda as it was hot outside and they were guests to our homes. But when people like me raise a complaint it's not because we are being unreasonable.

But what exactly did NYPD do to you that you considered disrespectful? Stopping a person and checking their ID or some other things is not disrespectful, it is what the police normally does. Since you are a solid upright citizen that you are, don't you want your neighborhood and your family to be safe? How is NYPD going to offer you that safety if they do not patrol the neighborhood and make safety checks? They don't automatically know who you are without checking you out.


I just thought of one more personal encounter with police-like authorities. In the summer of 2004 I was working on a contract in California for a few months, and used a free 3-day weekend to explore the desert. My boyfriend could join me for only one day in Joshua Tree, the other two days I roamed around alone. Among other places, I went to Organ Pipe Cactus national monument area on the border of Arizona and Mexico. Surprisingly (but enjoyably), maybe because it was August and incredibly hot, there was almost nobody else in the area, I maybe saw two other cars in five hours. Well, somewhere in that area I was flagged down by two police-like looking guys woth a police-like dog standing next to a police-like car (they turned out to be border guards). They just said "your ID please", I gave them the driving license and the rental car documents, asked if I was going too fast --- they said probably not but they weren't traffic police, they asked what I was doing in the area, I said I was working temporarily in CA and came to AZ for a day as a tourist to see the cactuses, I gave them my US work permit (which was my only international ID at the time, since I became stateless during the breakup of ex-Yu. My Yu passport at that point had no function since there was no country any more to back it up --- and I did not have the US citizenship yet either because my immigration case had been pending for many years at that point, and was going to be pending for two more years until I got a Green Card in 2006). They looked at the work permit, they asked me to open the back hatch of the car and step out of the car, the dog jumped into the car and sniffed around, then jumped into the hatch, jumped out, and sat on the ground. The guys handed me back my papers, and said I was good to go. They were serious and reserved, but they did not do anything I would remotely call disrespectful. I also wasn't doing anything illegal when they stopped me, I was just driving through a designated scenic area, but I did not consider their act of stopping me and checking me and the car disrespectful - I considered it a part of their job. How would they know without checking that I was not a criminal?
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Old 10-06-2019, 12:36 PM
 
4,039 posts, read 1,502,798 times
Reputation: 1875
8
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
But what exactly did NYPD do to you that you considered disrespectful? Stopping a person and checking their ID or some other things is not disrespectful, it is what the police normally does. Since you are a solid upright citizen that you are, don't you want your neighborhood and your family to be safe? How is NYPD going to offer you that safety if they do not patrol the neighborhood and make safety checks? They don't automatically know who you are without checking you out.


I just thought of one more personal encounter with police-like authorities. In the summer of 2004 I was working on a contract in California for a few months, and used a free 3-day weekend to explore the desert. My boyfriend could join me for only one day in Joshua Tree, the other two days I roamed around alone. Among other places, I went to Organ Pipe Cactus national monument area on the border of Arizona and Mexico. Surprisingly (but enjoyably), maybe because it was August and incredibly hot, there was almost nobody else in the area, I maybe saw two other cars in five hours. Well, somewhere in that area I was flagged down by two police-like looking guys woth a police-like dog standing next to a police-like car (they turned out to be border guards). They just said "your ID please", I gave them the driving license and the rental car documents, asked if I was going too fast --- they said probably not but they weren't traffic police, they asked what I was doing in the area, I said I was working temporarily in CA and came to AZ for a day as a tourist to see the cactuses, I gave them my US work permit (which was my only international ID at the time, since I became stateless during the breakup of ex-Yu. My Yu passport at that point had no function since there was no country any more to back it up --- and I did not have the US citizenship yet either because my immigration case had been pending for many years at that point, and was going to be pending for two more years until I got a Green Card in 2006). They looked at the work permit, they asked me to open the back hatch of the car and step out of the car, the dog jumped into the car and sniffed around, then jumped into the hatch, jumped out, and sat on the ground. The guys handed me back my papers, and said I was good to go. They were serious and reserved, but they did not do anything I would remotely call disrespectful. I also wasn't doing anything illegal when they stopped me, I was just driving through a designated scenic area, but I did not consider their act of stopping me and checking me and the car disrespectful - I considered it a part of their job. How would they know without checking that I was not a criminal?
If I told you would you listen ? Would you believe me ? Why would you even ask if you took me on good faith. I would not be constantly and respectfully pushing back about the reality of bad policing in my community if it was merely being treated as you were above. How about not asking me to make an argument to convince you. There are thousands of other who have complained. But if you want to know, PM me. And your statement above puts the burden on me to tolerate mistreatment under the premise it's for my own good. Well no, it's not for my own good if I am subjected to that treatment and if it happened to you you would agree.

Last edited by bxlover; 10-06-2019 at 12:44 PM..
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Old 10-06-2019, 05:00 PM
 
Location: Staten Island, NY
9,139 posts, read 7,361,965 times
Reputation: 8659
I became a supervisor partly to stop cops from doing things that I felt embarrassed my uniform. Unfortunately then DeBlasio was elected and policing became a liability so now I am hiding from as much of it as possible. You cannot demonize ALL cops for too long before even the ones you want out there working hard start to realize it is too much of a risk.

And it is ALL cops because in the end I am a faceless person in a uniform who can do everything 100% righteously for 17 years and then in one moment of youtube infamy watch my entire career and livelihood disappear in the name of political expediency.

So since my kid’s welfare matters far more than anyone else’s in this world, I made a choice. My paycheck is tied to that. I keep my paycheck by not doing what I used to do. IE, risking my ass for other people.
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Old 10-06-2019, 08:10 PM
 
Location: NY
4,603 posts, read 1,216,790 times
Reputation: 2671
Quote:
Originally Posted by bxlover View Post
So blacks in the City today are not hard working, patriotic, and moving to successful lives now ? So your solution is that if all blacks were Republicans all social problems would be resolved ? Guess what I know black Republicans. I have voted Republican several times in National and local elections and guess what, we still have been stereotyped by not what we think or by what political party we support. Instead we have been stopped and harassed based on our appearance alone. Your retired, great, but that does not forgive or explain how you have chosen to bury your head in the sand of nostalgia and ideology.
Opinion:
Give Credit to all those young men and woman where credit is due rather than disparage.
Negativity breeds negativity. Keep thinking like that and you will draw nothing but bad luck into your life.
For the rest nothing but Success................Good Luck. Your Life .Your Thoughts. Your Choices................
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Old 10-06-2019, 08:14 PM
 
Location: NY
4,603 posts, read 1,216,790 times
Reputation: 2671
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
I became a supervisor partly to stop cops from doing things that I felt embarrassed my uniform. Unfortunately then DeBlasio was elected and policing became a liability so now I am hiding from as much of it as possible. You cannot demonize ALL cops for too long before even the ones you want out there working hard start to realize it is too much of a risk.

And it is ALL cops because in the end I am a faceless person in a uniform who can do everything 100% righteously for 17 years and then in one moment of youtube infamy watch my entire career and livelihood disappear in the name of political expediency.

So since my kid’s welfare matters far more than anyone else’s in this world, I made a choice. My paycheck is tied to that. I keep my paycheck by not doing what I used to do. IE, risking my ass for other people.
Opinion:
Your choice.....
It's was Right over Wrong...
You could not have said it better. Never Gamble.
Let the chips fall where they may...............

Last edited by Mr.Retired; 10-06-2019 at 08:32 PM..
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Old 10-07-2019, 06:50 AM
 
4,039 posts, read 1,502,798 times
Reputation: 1875
Quote:
Originally Posted by Airborneguy View Post
I became a supervisor partly to stop cops from doing things that I felt embarrassed my uniform. Unfortunately then DeBlasio was elected and policing became a liability so now I am hiding from as much of it as possible. You cannot demonize ALL cops for too long before even the ones you want out there working hard start to realize it is too much of a risk.

And it is ALL cops because in the end I am a faceless person in a uniform who can do everything 100% righteously for 17 years and then in one moment of youtube infamy watch my entire career and livelihood disappear in the name of political expediency.

So since my kid’s welfare matters far more than anyone else’s in this world, I made a choice. My paycheck is tied to that. I keep my paycheck by not doing what I used to do. IE, risking my ass for other people.
Note, I have made a point not to disparage all officers. I'm mature enough to make the distinction. I don't generalize. Making the point that treatment like I am alluding to is counterproductive to making things better for cops or the community.

Last edited by bxlover; 10-07-2019 at 06:58 AM..
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