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Old 10-01-2019, 08:24 PM
 
3,773 posts, read 1,458,506 times
Reputation: 1775

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Retired View Post
Opinion:
Just traveled through your beautiful pristine and classy city. Young 30's something tailored folks going off
respectfully to work. Reminds me of days long ago in New York. Not any more. Please make sure you attend
every city,civic and community board meeting and vote to keep public assistance for the very elderly and physically
disabled only. Criminal History and young and fit of working age are void............It is the only way to keep the city
from turning into a urinal..........
You don't see hard working 30's tailored people going off to work in this City ? How have you missed them ? As you know people work even harder today then they once did and for less.
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Old 10-01-2019, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
20,312 posts, read 35,344,875 times
Reputation: 8750
Quote:
Originally Posted by bxlover View Post
You don't see hard working 30's tailored people going off to work in this City ? How have you missed them ? As you know people work even harder today then they once did and for less.
When you're retired and sitting home and not being part of the rat race its real easy to miss

Out of touch
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Old 10-01-2019, 09:00 PM
 
3,773 posts, read 1,458,506 times
Reputation: 1775
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeventhFloor View Post
When you're retired and sitting home and not being part of the rat race its real easy to miss

Out of touch
I believe that some people who have retired are living in the past and a past that actually really never existed. This sense of nostalgia is comforting but I doubt accurate. I am 48 and I see younger people working harder then I did for less. I don't get it I tell you. That's a rather conspicuous thing to miss.
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Old Yesterday, 08:37 AM
 
Location: Confines of the 101 Precinct
20,312 posts, read 35,344,875 times
Reputation: 8750
Quote:
Originally Posted by bxlover View Post
I believe that some people who have retired are living in the past and a past that actually really never existed. This sense of nostalgia is comforting but I doubt accurate. I am 48 and I see younger people working harder then I did for less. I don't get it I tell you. That's a rather conspicuous thing to miss.
The baby boomers are oblivious to what its like living a modern-day NYC "middle class" lifestyle.
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Old Yesterday, 09:37 AM
 
623 posts, read 134,608 times
Reputation: 632
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBMW View Post
Having lived directly through it and watching it happen, I categorically reject that entire concept. The changes in law enforcement that occurred in the early 90's were unquestionably the cause of the rapid reduction of crime in that time frame. Any other explanation are likely just liberal academic claptrap, meant to further the left wing, police are evil mentality, and push the failed social services methodology for trying to solve the crime problem.

Aggressive policing and an unforgiving criminal justice system work. What happened in NYC and really the rest of the country in the 90's and 00's prove it.
Good article here in CSM:


Quote:
One of the most recent reports, published in June by the city's Department of Investigation, found no correlation between cracking down on low-level quality-of-life offenses, such as public urination, and a decrease in the felony crime rate.
https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justic...hange-New-York
Quote:

Some criminologists suggest that a number of other factors may have played a role in the drop in crime. In a 2006 article published in the University of Chicago law review, political theorist Bernard Harcourt and economist Jens Ludwig argue that the decrease in crime throughout the 1990s and early 2000s paralleled the natural decline in the crack epidemic; other critics have suggested that the lowered crime rates could be at least partially attributed to a decline in unemployment around the same time.



Criminologist Franklin Zimring, a professor at the University of California at Berkeley and author of "The City That Became Safe: New York's Lessons for Urban Crime and Its Control," has argued that about half of the crime drop was probably due to changes in policing under Bratton's leadership, such as a 41 percent increase in the number of officers between 1990 and 1999.


One controversial program introduced under Bratton's leadership in 1994 is CompStat – short for computerized or comparative statistics – which uses data collected by officers to determine where and how to police in the future. Though one recent analysis by the Brennan Center for Justice found that the system, which has since been adopted by other police departments, reduced homicides nationally by 11 percent, critics of CompStat say the system encourages officers to make as many arrests as possible for the sake of data collection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
I'm far away at the moment, but here in Singapore there are huge monetary fines for littering and even chewing gum (because if you stick a gum somewhere, it is very hard to clean). This equivalent of "broken windows" policy is most definitely associated with high degree of civilized everyday behavior and nearly zero crime in this city-state, pop. 5.8 million. ANY violent crime, when it rarely happens, is a front-page news for weeks. They have capital punishment, ie, they do hang a few people almost every year (it appears mostly drug dealers, in the absence of any direct murderers. Possession of more than 30 grams of cocaine is a capital offense). 95% of Singaporean voters support capital punishment. This place, with a population equal to almost 3/4 of all five boroughs of NYC and almost 1/2 larger than the population of LA, is entirely safe, anywhere in the city, 24 hours a day. There is no such thing as a ghetto or unsafe neighborhood. The closest it comes to a ghetto are two city blocks in Little India with legalized brothels (sort of like in Amsterdam), but even these two blocks are just sleazy, not dangerous. You can design a "social study" to show pretty much anything that the author wants it to show, but when you look at the definite reality of crime-free Singapore, you must admit that strict law enforcement at all levels (from fines for littering, to subsequently less and less necessary hanging for murder) does create a safe society.
Singapore ain't NYC. The test of the theory there would be to lower the fines for littering and stop them for chewing gum. I seriously doubt the murder rate would increase.
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Old Yesterday, 11:33 AM
 
1,960 posts, read 719,068 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mascoma View Post

Singapore ain't NYC. The test of the theory there would be to lower the fines for littering and stop them for chewing gum. I seriously doubt the murder rate would increase.

There is a longer response I could write, but is like 1:30 am here, so want to go to sleep... After this wonderful public transportation system was built in Singapore, people were jamming the doors of trains with chewing gum to the point that the transportation could not function. When chewing gum was outlawed (I think the fine is $1,000 right now), the problems with sabotaged trains completely disappeared, so the chewing gum fines ain't getting removed in Singapore, sorry :-). People also say that parts of the city looked like a sewer before high littering fines were instituted. Violent incidents do exist, but one out of 28,000 people has been murdered in each of the recent years in NYC (which is the famous "much lower" murder rate than in the 1980s), while the same has been happening to one out of 600,000 Singaporeans during the same years (the 10 or so murders per year are generally all between people closely known to each other, and a significant % of those few Singapore murderers are foreigners).



The chewing gum story shows you that people will keep doing nasty things if they can get away with it - in Singapore or NYC, no difference - so the solution to the problem of both nuisances and serious crimes is to have strict laws for both, and to strictly enforce these laws. Human behavior mostly results from conditioning, and if you receive an electrical shock every time you try to eat a banana, you will lose all interest in bananas after you try about two or three of them. A short sharp shock, as Margaret Thatcher used to call it :-). Also, people who are habitually decent to other people on a daily basis, and follow social contract in small matters, are definitely less likely to commit violent crimes - while not all minor offenders progress into violent crimes, most violent offenders have a record of previous minor crimes. All of these are good reasons to go agressively after minor crimes (and after major ones, of course).
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Old Yesterday, 12:15 PM
 
2,244 posts, read 700,651 times
Reputation: 1622
Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
There is a longer response I could write, but is like 1:30 am here, so want to go to sleep... After this wonderful public transportation system was built in Singapore, people were jamming the doors of trains with chewing gum to the point that the transportation could not function. When chewing gum was outlawed (I think the fine is $1,000 right now), the problems with sabotaged trains completely disappeared, so the chewing gum fines ain't getting removed in Singapore, sorry :-). People also say that parts of the city looked like a sewer before high littering fines were instituted. Violent incidents do exist, but one out of 28,000 people has been murdered in each of the recent years in NYC (which is the famous "much lower" murder rate than in the 1980s), while the same has been happening to one out of 600,000 Singaporeans during the same years (the 10 or so murders per year are generally all between people closely known to each other, and a significant % of those few Singapore murderers are foreigners).



The chewing gum story shows you that people will keep doing nasty things if they can get away with it - in Singapore or NYC, no difference - so the solution to the problem of both nuisances and serious crimes is to have strict laws for both, and to strictly enforce these laws. Human behavior mostly results from conditioning, and if you receive an electrical shock every time you try to eat a banana, you will lose all interest in bananas after you try about two or three of them. A short sharp shock, as Margaret Thatcher used to call it :-). Also, people who are habitually decent to other people on a daily basis, and follow social contract in small matters, are definitely less likely to commit violent crimes - while not all minor offenders progress into violent crimes, most violent offenders have a record of previous minor crimes. All of these are good reasons to go agressively after minor crimes (and after major ones, of course).
Singapore is a much different country with much different values from us. The United States is much more freedom minded.
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Old Yesterday, 12:20 PM
 
169 posts, read 34,334 times
Reputation: 100
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBMW View Post
They were completely proper in going hard after minor crimes. This is a basic tenant of the "Broken Windows" policing strategy that worked spectacularly in NYC for twenty years. Take care of the minor crimes, and for a large part, that will take care of the major crimes also. The last thing the city needs in an "anything goes" attitude on the street.

As far a Garner, if he just calmed down and let the cops cuff him up, he'd have been out in a few hours with a disappearance ticket. And his primary cause of death was his own poor health.
Broken window is a fallacy, crime in the US has been going down in both cities with broken window policy and those without. No economist or crime expert still talk about Broken windows as the reason for crime reduction. but somehow the public still believe it is.
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Old Yesterday, 12:28 PM
 
317 posts, read 79,748 times
Reputation: 542
Now everyone wants to diminish the achievements of Giuliani the Magnificent. The contrast between the before and after of Giuliani the Magnificent's election are STARK and JARRING. You had to be there. It doesn't matter that it's continued to decline. The point is it was a WAR ZONE out there before Giuliani the Great and NOBODY believed it could ever change. He showed everyone that it could change and he began to lead us on the long march back into sanity.
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Old Yesterday, 12:55 PM
 
760 posts, read 262,668 times
Reputation: 548
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeventhFloor View Post
The baby boomers are oblivious to what its like living a modern-day NYC "middle class" lifestyle.
Baby boomers had it given to them and after they got it they pulled up the ladder so no one else can climb it. the younger generation had to build their own ladder just to reach the ladder the baby boomers pulled up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elnrgby View Post
There is a longer response I could write, but is like 1:30 am here, so want to go to sleep... After this wonderful public transportation system was built in Singapore, people were jamming the doors of trains with chewing gum to the point that the transportation could not function. When chewing gum was outlawed (I think the fine is $1,000 right now), the problems with sabotaged trains completely disappeared, so the chewing gum fines ain't getting removed in Singapore, sorry :-). People also say that parts of the city looked like a sewer before high littering fines were instituted. Violent incidents do exist, but one out of 28,000 people has been murdered in each of the recent years in NYC (which is the famous "much lower" murder rate than in the 1980s), while the same has been happening to one out of 600,000 Singaporeans during the same years (the 10 or so murders per year are generally all between people closely known to each other, and a significant % of those few Singapore murderers are foreigners).



The chewing gum story shows you that people will keep doing nasty things if they can get away with it - in Singapore or NYC, no difference - so the solution to the problem of both nuisances and serious crimes is to have strict laws for both, and to strictly enforce these laws. Human behavior mostly results from conditioning, and if you receive an electrical shock every time you try to eat a banana, you will lose all interest in bananas after you try about two or three of them. A short sharp shock, as Margaret Thatcher used to call it :-). Also, people who are habitually decent to other people on a daily basis, and follow social contract in small matters, are definitely less likely to commit violent crimes - while not all minor offenders progress into violent crimes, most violent offenders have a record of previous minor crimes. All of these are good reasons to go agressively after minor crimes (and after major ones, of course).
Im just waiting for you to start posting to convince people to move to Singapore
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