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I'm looking at buying a 1BR condo in either Bronx or Tarrytown for around $200k. I am confused on how to compare my taxes . I believe Bronx has ~4% NYC resident tax but lower property tax than Tarrytown.
Tarrytown seems to have three taxes ( Village, School and town taxes ). Assuming my income is $150k/year, which town will I be paying more taxes ?
For Tarrytown, you have to find out the all in property tax rate on the assessed value of the home (my guess is ~2.5-3.5%) and that's what you would pay annually. I would look at a few recently sold houses or houses on the market, see what their assessed value is and the property tax amount listed is. I looked at 1 house and it was ~3.35%. I'm not sure if it's different for condos, but this is the rate for single family homes.
You should look at the condos in both areas and see what the monthly maintenance payment is. This should include your property taxes.
Your added taxes for the Bronx as you mentioned is the 4% NYC Income Tax so if you are making $150k/year, you'll pay ~$6k in incremental NYC Income tax.
I'm looking at buying a 1BR condo in either Bronx or Tarrytown for around $200k. I am confused on how to compare my taxes . I believe Bronx has ~4% NYC resident tax but lower property tax than Tarrytown.
Tarrytown seems to have three taxes ( Village, School and town taxes ). Assuming my income is $150k/year, which town will I be paying more taxes ?
One thing to consider.... I don't know about Tarrytown, but the Bronx does not have lots of condos overall. Most are co-ops. Are you set on one neighborhood in the Bronx or it doesn't matter? I know there are some new condos recently that have come online around the Bronx, but overall, I still think primarily of co-ops rather than condos. Your property taxes will definitely be lower in the Bronx though versus Westchester without a question. One of the advantages of buying in the City over Westchester.
Are you totally against doing a co-op? Also, where are you looking that you expect to find a condo for $200,000? That doesn't seem that realistic in the Bronx or Tarrytown quite frankly.
Thought that perhaps I was confused, so just did some online searches for condos in that range. I don't see anything in that price range but co-ops all over the Bronx, and Tarrytown, I have a hard time believing that a 1BR condo is going to be only $200,000. Tarrytown overall is an upper middle to upper class area.
Thought that perhaps I was confused, so just did some online searches for condos in that range. I don't see anything in that price range but co-ops all over the Bronx, and Tarrytown, I have a hard time believing that a 1BR condo is going to be only $200,000. Tarrytown overall is an upper middle to upper class area.
I suppose they are coops. Same game, different name, no? Why would condos be much more expensive?
I suppose they are coops. Same game, different name, no? Why would condos be much more expensive?
They have to be co-ops at that price... Not quite the same... Co-op means you are a shareholder, so you don't own the apartment, but rather shares of the apartment building. You have to go through board approval. You can be denied for any reason, even if you think you are qualified, so it can be rather stressful.
I believe there are proposals to force co-ops to state why going forward within a certain amount of time. Co-ops generally have more restrictions and tend to be older. Condos tend to be newer, with less strings attached (most construction going up now is for condos - less aggravation), so if for example, you wanted to rent out your place you could do so easier. Some co-ops have less restrictions than others, but still. Because of the board approval process, re-selling co-ops can be a hassle, and they don't appreciate in value at the same rate as a condo, in part because of the aforementioned reasons.
There are pluses and minuses for co-op vs condos. The bad thing about board approval is that you may not be approved, but the good thing is that you'll have more financially stable people in the building. With co-ops you generally can't rent them out to someone else if you wanted to (as far as I know). With condos you can do whatever you want, although there are disadvantages to that too since owners tend to take better care of the building since they have skin in the game.
The main condo development in the BX is Parkchester. There must be one bedrooms for under 200K there.
They have to be co-ops at that price... Not quite the same... Co-op means you are a shareholder, so you don't own the apartment, but rather shares of the apartment building. You have to go through board approval. You can be denied for any reason, even if you think you are qualified, so it can be rather stressful.
My guess is these horror stories of board approval are a tiny fraction of coop sales. The vast majority get approved with as much swiftness as a condo approval. It's more just smokes and mirrors to weed out undesirable buyers. If your finances are in order than I see no reason why the approval would be anything but fast. If it's not fast , then you probably don't want to be living there anyways..
So that goes back to my original question of why condos would be significantly more expensive than coops. I can understand maybe a 10% premium.
My guess is these horror stories of board approval are a tiny fraction of coop sales. The vast majority get approved with as much swiftness as a condo approval. It's more just smokes and mirrors to weed out undesirable buyers. If your finances are in order than I see no reason why the approval would be anything but fast. If it's not fast , then you probably don't want to be living there anyways..
So that goes back to my original question of why condos would be significantly more expensive than coops. I can understand maybe a 10% premium.
Condos tend to be newer construction, and have less restrictions. When I first started working, I was involved with management companies, and sometimes, co-op boards. How much money you have doesn't always matter. There is a certain "culture" if you will in each building, so if you're a big time celebrity that's going to garner lots of attention, some buildings don't want that and the board members may reject you. Then there is the "clickiness" of some boards. Basically some buildings can be a lot of drama, be it because of financials or other things, so you can be a qualified buyer, but still not get the apartment. That is a turnoff for many buyers. Furthermore, co-ops require a greater amount down than condos, so if you're a first-time buyer, you can perhaps get an FHA loan for a condo, but not for a co-op. I think on average, you need 20-30% down for a co-op. Not the case with a condo. Co-ops usually need work too, and you'll need to run the renovations by the board. When it comes time to sell, the board will need to approve the buyer, and again, even if they are qualified, that doesn't mean they'll be approved, so the whole red tape thing is annoying for some people, and as I said, since everyone is a shareholder, that's a major difference with a co-op. If you plan on staying in a place long-term, a co-op may be the way to go, and definitely ask about renovations in advance. Not saying all co-ops are annoying, but some can be difficult.
I know of a realtor who has the scoop on many co-ops in the Bronx. There are a few that will reject you if you don't have several months of liquid savings in addition to your downpayment to cover your mortgage. They are super anal about ensuring that each buyer has more than enough to cover their monthly expenses, so you are not getting in there so easily.
Then of course there are the financials of the co-op itself to worry about. Is your maintenance going to shoot up suddenly lr do they have solid financials to keep the building in a good state of repair?
For the Bronx, I am certain that some co-ops are not as anal depending on the area. As long as you have decent financials, you should be fine. Really depends on where you are looking and the amenities. If you're looking in Tarrytown, I would imagine you are looking in the better parts of the Bronx? Perhaps Morris Park, Woodlawn, Pelham Bay and Pelham Parkway? Riverdale could also be possible, particularly along Broadway, but some boards can be more difficult. Out of those areas mentioned, Riverdale has a ton of co-ops, probably followed by Pelham Parkway and Morris Park and Pelham Bay, with Woodlawn having the least being so small. Throggs Neck... Condos come to mind more so, particularly waterfront property, which is quite expensive. Kingsbridge and Van Cortlandt Village have some co-ops as well, which may be worth looking at.
Out of all of the areas though, price ranges for co-ops will vary the most in Riverdale. For example, you can find co-ops over a million dollars in Riverdale in places like the Villa Charlotte Brontë, but not too far away, find studios for $100-150k. All depends on the amenities and the location in Riverdale. Broadway tends to be the cheapest, since it is not uphill and lacks the Hudson River and Palisades views, but you do have Van Cortlandt Park across the street. Condos in most of the aforementioned areas will be out of your price range for a one bedroom since there are not many of them. In Riverdale, most are newer construction with pricing varying into the millions. Even in Throggs Neck, condos are quite expensive, so if $200k is hour goal, you have plenty of options co-op wise, provided you're up for some renovations. The South Bronx has some new condos as well that perhaps may be worth looking at if you up your budget a bit.
For Tarrytown, I have to think the prices even for co-ops will be more than $200,000. It is not a cheap town.
You reminded me of a couple I know that has a co-op in Hudson Heights/Cloisters area. They gut renovated the entire place. Absolutely stunning. It has all of the original historic details, with a huge sunken in living room, fantastic kitchen with a breakfast area and a dining area, I believe two bathrooms, an exercise area and probably two or three bedrooms, so my point is, if you look around, you can score a great co-op, which can have lots more character than any condo built today.
Last edited by pierrepont7731; 05-22-2021 at 12:10 PM..
There are pluses and minuses for co-op vs condos. The bad thing about board approval is that you may not be approved, but the good thing is that you'll have more financially stable people in the building. With co-ops you generally can't rent them out to someone else if you wanted to (as far as I know). With condos you can do whatever you want, although there are disadvantages to that too since owners tend to take better care of the building since they have skin in the game.
The main condo development in the BX is Parkchester. There must be one bedrooms for under 200K there.
Not sure that Parkchester is what the OP is looking for, but it consists of two condo associations (South and North), 1 bdrm condos are mostly 615- 630 sq ft (but there are larger ones), and the price range right now for 1 bdrm is $180k to $220k. There might be one or two in the $170k range, but maybe there are some problems with those. When you buy a condo in Parkchester, you still have to be approved by the condo association, but it is not a problem if your financial situation is straight-forward.
In a condo association, you own your condo and a share in common areas/land. In a co-op you own a share in everything, and lease your unit until you sell your share in the co-op. Condos generally cost more upfront, and have lower monthly maintenance dues (plus separate real estate taxes, which are abated in Parkchester for the first 8 years if i remember correctly, and are very low after that). I have one of the smallest units in Parkchester, where my mothly HOA dues are something like $430, and I think I paid about $400 total in real estate taxes last year (not per month, but for the whole year). Co-ops cost less upfront, but have higher monthly maintenance fees which include real estate taxes.
Apparently also, it tends to be easier to get a mortgage for a condo than for a co-op.
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