60k, working in Gramercy, in your early 30s, where would you live? (New York: relocate)

[peter_parker]

Hey Everyone,

Been meaning to post this for a while. Hope to see what some of you have to say.

Will be starting a new job late in August, working in the Gramercy area (mid 20s, near Madison Square Park), and am planning to move in August 1st or thereabouts. With my starting salary, I'm limited to $1500 rent (40x rule).

I'm a single male in my early 30s and want a neighborhood with cafes where I can read and write, with some restaurants and bars--i.e. an area where I wouldn't feel a need to hop on a train to go to a place to just hang out / people watch (I won't need to go to work every day). Also, I'd prefer needing only one train (no transfers) to get to a station near work. I'm used to big city life, having spent much of my life in Toronto and Taipei, and am really excited to be moving to NYC!

Given these criteria, and from what I have read (on here and elsewhere), I'm thinking about the following

• Brooklyn nabes around BoCoCa / Fort Greene (but where in this area?)
• Prospect Heights?
• Astoria or Woodside in Queens (though I'd like some help narrowing down where in Astoria)
• LIC is hard to get info on. Is it as barren as it sounds?
• Williamsburg might do as well (though I'm not sure what my hipster tolerance levels will be) [joke, kinda]
• the PATH from Hoboken stops nearby, but I don't know if I want to be dependent on the PATH to always get in and out of the city, and I don't know much about Hoboken at all.
• I see places list in the LES and Murry Hill areas that would fit my budget, but I normally dismiss them as likely being too small

I'm going to be in the city in mid-late June for several days and want to know which areas you would recommend that I check out.

Summary:
-in my early 30s
-working in Gramercy
-up to $1500 rent
-easy access to work
-area with cafes, bars, etc.



(Oh - a rooftop entrance where I could easily enter and leave for my webslinging jaunts around the city would also be good. )

[NJ Chutzpah]

washington heights/inwood, ridgewood/maspeth/middle village in queens

[Viralmd]

I just can't imagine a nice single guy who likes Manhattan living in Middle Village or Maspeth! I think Brooklyn might be more your speed.

[Henna]

I can't believe anyone would suggest Maspeth or Middle Village to this guy. Even Ridgewood is a stretch - there are so many better places for him. He told us exactly what he wants and what he can afford - so why try to make him go to some extremely quiet neighborhood in the middle of Queens that has limited subway access, if any at all? Crazy.

[jeffcon0]

The $1500 doesn't go as far as one would hope so. I would rule out Manhattan because anything you find in the $1500 range there is going to be closet-like and dumpy.

The most bang for your buck out of that list would be Astoria where you could get a one bedroom on your budget. I'm not a huge fan of Astoria but do have a number of friends in the area and it is becoming quite booming with the 20-something/30-something professional set. It is convenient to midtown, perfectly safe, and has enough in the area to keep you occupied. The famous beer garden there is brimming with people from all over the city on nice nights and is a cool and unique place. Plenty of other "normal" bars and restaurants throughout the area but very little to draw the hipster set like you would find in Williamsburg.

I was living in Fort Greene until a few weeks ago when I relocated to Bay Ridge (highly recommended if you can deal with a bit more of a commute!). I loved Fort Greene. Great, great neighborhood with a lot of nice restaurants, bars, and beautiful old brownstones. My rent on a studio apartment in prime Ft. Greene was raised to $1550 and I decided that was it for me and moved. Now in a awesome one bedroom for $1150 on the 77th St. R stop....but I digress. So, yeah, Ft. Greene is great. Lotta transportation options too if you are close to the Atlantic Terminal. Look between DeKalb and Fulton from S. Elliot to maybe Clermont. In my opinion that is the "prime" area. Be wary of brokers selling Clinton Hill (or even Bed-Stuy these days) as Fort Greene. Clinton Hill is nice but you are stuck in G train neverland if that bugs you.

I was always a fan of Greenpoint. It's sort of like a less hipsterish (but still plenty hipsterish) Williamsburg. It's also on the G train which ain't ideal but a studio can be had for $1500 in the prime areas.

I may recommend the "South Slope" along the R train which runs down 4th ave in Brooklyn. The R would get you to 23rd or 28th St. in Gramercy and there is plenty going on in the area if you walk an avenue over to 5th in Park Slope. Lots of young transplants moving into the area who have been priced out of Park Slope. Still a little gritty but it seems perfectly safe in my opinion. Look around Union St stops or even a couple stops further out. A studio will run you $1500ish. 4th ave in that area is a little *blah* with lots of auto shops, bodegas, and other non-spectacular retail and services. It won't win any aesthetic awards like say Park Slope, "BoCoCa", or Ft. Greene so don't expect much in the way of brownstone beauty.

"BoCoCa" (terrible but convenient realtor phrase) is all but out of reach in the $1500 range these days. There are probably still studios to be found in that range but even two years ago I was looking at studios in the $1400 range their. It is one of the most desireable areas of Brooklyn and would be pretty awesome if you could swing it.

I'm sure I'll take some flak for this but I think Prospect Heights is still sorta sketchy unless you are in the prime areas which center around Grand Army Plaza and are almost as nice as Park Slope.

That's my 2 cents. When I moved here I basically spent 3 days walking through all of these areas to get a better feel. I recommend you do the same if at all possible.

[crisp444]

If you're fine with a studio, you can do "BoCoCa" on $1500, but you will be spending near the top of your budget. It is a very nice area and satisfies your criteria, I would recommend it over everywhere else in Brooklyn except Brooklyn Heights. Fort Greene is alright, Prospect Heights is not very nice, and the far western reaches of Park Slope (near Fourth Avenue) is an area that is generally safe but gritty in appearance. Park Slope South / "Windsor Terrace" is not an aesthetically pretty area, but it is safe and has a lot of young people. Also, you will be a healthy walk (or very short subway ride) from coffeehouses, restaurants, shops, etc.

[Ace Rock]

Manhattan is where it's at if you want to experience "The City". It doesn't come cheap, so yes you'll have to sacrifice space just like anyone else on $60k.

If you're coming for "The Big City Experience", there's really no point to the outerboroughs other than saving money. The outerboroughs are just like any other random urban American city, except more expensive.

[peter_parker]

Originally Posted by Viralmd

I just can't imagine a nice single guy who likes Manhattan living in Middle Village or Maspeth! I think Brooklyn might be more your speed.

Originally Posted by Henna

I can't believe anyone would suggest Maspeth or Middle Village to this guy. Even Ridgewood is a stretch - there are so many better places for him. He told us exactly what he wants and what he can afford - so why try to make him go to some extremely quiet neighborhood in the middle of Queens that has limited subway access, if any at all? Crazy.

Viralmd, Henna: Yeah, I've been reading up on different nabes for a while and don't know a thing about Maspeth and Miiddle Village, which makes me think that it's not what I'm looking for.

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

The $1500 doesn't go as far as one would hope so. I would rule out Manhattan because anything you find in the $1500 range there is going to be closet-like and dumpy.

Thanks for your thoughtful response, jeffcon0! That's what I'm worried about. I'm not the type to hang out at home much, so a lot of room is not THAT big of an issue. But I just can't believe I'll find something I'll really like at that price point.

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

The most bang for your buck out of that list would be Astoria where you could get a one bedroom on your budget. I'm not a huge fan of Astoria but do have a number of friends in the area and it is becoming quite booming with the 20-something/30-something professional set. It is convenient to midtown, perfectly safe, and has enough in the area to keep you occupied. The famous beer garden there is brimming with people from all over the city on nice nights and is a cool and unique place. Plenty of other "normal" bars and restaurants throughout the area but very little to draw the hipster set like you would find in Williamsburg.

From what I've heard Astoria can be pretty vibrant but aesthetically.... ho-hum. It's the one area I have least experience of and am most curious to walk through and check out. The F, V, and W stop close enough to my work (though I forget at the moment which of these go through Astoria). As an aside, when I tell friends of mine who used to live in NYC a long time ago that I'm looking at Queens as a possibility, they just look at me with a blank star on their face!

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

I was living in Fort Greene until a few weeks ago when I relocated to Bay Ridge (highly recommended if you can deal with a bit more of a commute!). I loved Fort Greene. Great, great neighborhood with a lot of nice restaurants, bars, and beautiful old brownstones. My rent on a studio apartment in prime Ft. Greene was raised to $1550 and I decided that was it for me and moved. Now in a awesome one bedroom for $1150 on the 77th St. R stop....but I digress. So, yeah, Ft. Greene is great. Lotta transportation options too if you are close to the Atlantic Terminal. Look between DeKalb and Fulton from S. Elliot to maybe Clermont. In my opinion that is the "prime" area. Be wary of brokers selling Clinton Hill (or even Bed-Stuy these days) as Fort Greene. Clinton Hill is nice but you are stuck in G train neverland if that bugs you.

Bay Ridge might be something to look at down the line. Basically, based purely on research and logistics, I'd like to be in Brooklyn somewhere in the vicinity of BoCoCa my first year or two if at all possible. One big draw--apart from amenities--is all the trains going through the area.

I think your use of "prime" is key here. I'm looking to be pretty close (ten minute walk) to where there's a lot going on, so if I can get into, say, Fort Greene prime area studio for $1500 it may be tempting.

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

I was always a fan of Greenpoint. It's sort of like a less hipsterish (but still plenty hipsterish) Williamsburg. It's also on the G train which ain't ideal but a studio can be had for $1500 in the prime areas.

Thanks. I'll try to get a feel for Greenpoint, too. I don't hear it talked about much, but it sounds like it might be a spillover area from Williamsburg (maybe similar to East Williamsburg?). The G train can get me to the L at Metropolitan within a couple of stops, and then it's a straight shot across to 3rd, so it wouldn't be bad for work, but for other stuff....

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

I may recommend the "South Slope" along the R train which runs down 4th ave in Brooklyn. The R would get you to 23rd or 28th St. in Gramercy and there is plenty going on in the area if you walk an avenue over to 5th in Park Slope. Lots of young transplants moving into the area who have been priced out of Park Slope. Still a little gritty but it seems perfectly safe in my opinion. Look around Union St stops or even a couple stops further out. A studio will run you $1500ish. 4th ave in that area is a little *blah* with lots of auto shops, bodegas, and other non-spectacular retail and services. It won't win any aesthetic awards like say Park Slope, "BoCoCa", or Ft. Greene so don't expect much in the way of brownstone beauty.

23rd on the R would be very convenient. I think this would depend on how much more I'd get for my 1500 compared to other areas. But I've heard from others that South Slope should be something to consider.

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

"BoCoCa" (terrible but convenient realtor phrase) is all but out of reach in the $1500 range these days. There are probably still studios to be found in that range but even two years ago I was looking at studios in the $1400 range their. It is one of the most desireable areas of Brooklyn and would be pretty awesome if you could swing it.

Yeah, here's hoping I get lucky. But then again, I won't know how I feel about the area until I'm there, i suppose.

Originally Posted by jeffcon0

I'm sure I'll take some flak for this but I think Prospect Heights is still sorta sketchy unless you are in the prime areas which center around Grand Army Plaza and are almost as nice as Park Slope.

So i read on another board (a Brooklyn board) that PH can be pretty shady and is not the most welcoming area. I don't know if that would bother me, but out of all the places listed it seems as though PH gets the most mixed reviews. Maybe I'll limit my tour to the areas around Grand Army Plaza.

(BTW--does anyone know what people normally call the trinagle area wedged in between BH, PS and PH?)

Originally Posted by crisp444

If you're fine with a studio, you can do "BoCoCa" on $1500, but you will be spending near the top of your budget. It is a very nice area and satisfies your criteria, I would recommend it over everywhere else in Brooklyn except Brooklyn Heights. Fort Greene is alright, Prospect Heights is not very nice, and the far western reaches of Park Slope (near Fourth Avenue) is an area that is generally safe but gritty in appearance. Park Slope South / "Windsor Terrace" is not an aesthetically pretty area, but it is safe and has a lot of young people. Also, you will be a healthy walk (or very short subway ride) from coffeehouses, restaurants, shops, etc.

Thanks crisp444. On the face of it Windsor Terrace doesn't look like a bad place to live, having a lot of park nearby. Looks like the F runs through there. Which areas would be a healthy walk away where I could find coffeehouses, etc.? Park Slope?

Originally Posted by Ace Rock

Manhattan is where it's at if you want to experience "The City". It doesn't come cheap, so yes you'll have to sacrifice space just like anyone else on $60k.

If you're coming for "The Big City Experience", there's really no point to the outerboroughs other than saving money. The outerboroughs are just like any other random urban American city, except more expensive.

Thanks, Ace Rock. I'm actually coming for a job. The fact that it's in NYC is just icing on the cake, really. I've been living in NC for the past few years and believe me, most random urban American cities would suit me fine right now! (Even though i'll miss the balmy weather here...) So I think the outer boroughs could be good. As you say, Manhattan is always tempting, especially for newcomers like me. I might look into a roommate situation to swing it. I suppose I can go to a broker and see what I can get for $1500, but I'm not holding my breath.

Maybe I wasn't specific enough. I'm not sure I'd prefer living in the northern areas of Manhattan, as this would seem to be less convenient for me given where I work. So I'd want to limit myself to somewhere not to far from the Gramercy area which, price-wise, seems to limit me to maybe parts of the LES?

[Henna]

Greenpoint has some spillover from hipster-Williamsburg, but it is not a "spillover area" as it has its own identity, a bit of interesting architecture (a few historic streets), strong Polish presence, some pretty good shopping on Manhattan Ave and quite a few decent and good restaurants. It's a nice area, and it's nothing like East Williamsburg except that some hipsters have managed to find homes in both places.

[peter_parker]

Thanks, Henna. Found this article (though it's several years old now):

If You're Thinking of Living In/Greenpoint; An Inviting Area, Once You Get There - New York Times

Sounds quaint-ish, but given the proximity to the L it might be something to look into.

Originally Posted by Henna

Greenpoint has some spillover from hipster-Williamsburg, but it is not a "spillover area" as it has its own identity, a bit of interesting architecture (a few historic streets), strong Polish presence, some pretty good shopping on Manhattan Ave and quite a few decent and good restaurants. It's a nice area, and it's nothing like East Williamsburg except that some hipsters have managed to find homes in both places.