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Old 10-30-2008, 02:24 PM
 
373 posts, read 944,103 times
Reputation: 99

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There's a discussion going on about the 2 boys shot by the NYPD after they allegedly shot into a crowd outside a nightclub. I personally think the police did the right thing under the circumstance. But it's stupid and it's tragic.

I think most everyone will agree that we need a tighter gun control. I personally think we should get rid of gun ownership, but I know it's not that simple. I'm very naive on this subject so I'm hoping to learn more.

So what are the forces that prevent us from getting rid of gun ownership or at least getting a tighter regulation.

NRA, the constitutional right, ... please educate me.
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Old 10-30-2008, 02:39 PM
 
3,225 posts, read 5,427,716 times
Reputation: 845
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningMcQueen View Post
There's a discussion going on about the 2 boys shot by the NYPD after they allegedly shot into a crowd outside a nightclub. I personally think the police did the right thing under the circumstance. But it's stupid and it's tragic.

I think most everyone will agree that we need a tighter gun control. I personally think we should get rid of gun ownership, but I know it's not that simple. I'm very naive on this subject so I'm hoping to learn more.

So what are the forces that prevent us from getting rid of gun ownership or at least getting a tighter regulation.

NRA, the constitutional right, ... please educate me.
You just stated the answers yourself - powerful lobby of the NRA and gun manufacturers, arguments about the right to bear arms.

Let me forewarn you that this simply stated thread can create a firestorm of controversy, bitterness, and political partisanship.

I personally am not an ideologue or a demagogue so I can tell you quite frankly that I see it as being one of two ways for us to move forward as a nation in this regard - either nationally outlaw the sale of firearms that obviously have nothing to do with hunting animals or if we aren't going to do that, at least give every citizen including me the right to bear arms so that we can protect our property, lives, and the lives of our loved ones. Give me an even chance against the thugs who will always have access to guns if you can't or won't stop them from arming themselves.

My argument is for equity for us all - I could care two shakes about the gun industry's profits, or being a Republican vs. a Democrat, where this issue is concerned.
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Old 10-30-2008, 03:18 PM
 
373 posts, read 944,103 times
Reputation: 99
Mods, if this doesn't belong in the NYC forum, feel free to move it to where ever it belongs.

Back to the discussion... as far as the right to bear arms is concerned... and I know it's a constitutional right but I have no idea what the political process is to change that, but why can't we change this? We're not in colonial days or wild wild west days anymore.

So, if the process to change the constitution is too complicated and too political at the national level because of groups like NRA and whatever, does that mean that we can't do things at a local city level? What's wrong with putting a law in to place that says, unless you're in law enforcement, you can't have a gun in NYC? Or is there something like that already but it's hard to enforce?

Again, I'm very unfamiliar with the issue.
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Old 10-30-2008, 03:32 PM
 
Location: Central, NJ
1,924 posts, read 2,947,240 times
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Are you under the impression that the guns these 2 "boys" had were legal? There are gun laws in place - they just don't apply to criminals.
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Old 10-30-2008, 03:42 PM
 
373 posts, read 944,103 times
Reputation: 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Eyes View Post
Are you under the impression that the guns these 2 "boys" had were legal? There are gun laws in place - they just don't apply to criminals.
I guess I'm trying to get a grasp of what the issues are. I understand these were illegal guns. But why do we have guns on the street in the first place? I know there are some gun laws in place... (I don't really know what these laws are exactly, which is what I'm trying to figure out.)... but are these laws stringent enough to limit illegals guns from getting into the hands of these thugs?

Or are there no laws good enough if thugs just continue to be thugs?
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Old 10-30-2008, 04:03 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
7,903 posts, read 13,948,073 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Eyes View Post
Are you under the impression that the guns these 2 "boys" had were legal? There are gun laws in place - they just don't apply to criminals.
The guns that were used were more than likely bought in a state with more lax gun control laws...
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Old 10-30-2008, 04:38 PM
 
373 posts, read 944,103 times
Reputation: 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by NooYowkur81 View Post
The guns that were used were more than likely bought in a state with more lax gun control laws...
Ok, so that even if we had strict local laws, there are other ways guns make it into the city. But I'm sure someone more important and smarter than me already thought about these issues. What are some of the porposed solutions and why aren't they plausible?

I guess, the only sure way to stop illegal guns is to cut it off at the manufacturers, but I guess that's where groups like NRA comes into play. Godddd... this sucks.

If you want to hunt, use bows and arrows. That's more challenging and fair(er) to the animals anyway.
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Old 10-30-2008, 04:51 PM
009
 
1,119 posts, read 4,415,644 times
Reputation: 532
There's already a lengthy debate on the issue on the "Great Debates" section of this site. Check it out: gun control
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Old 10-30-2008, 04:58 PM
 
Location: Rockland County New York
2,984 posts, read 3,694,974 times
Reputation: 1258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irish Eyes View Post
Are you under the impression that the guns these 2 "boys" had were legal? There are gun laws in place - they just don't apply to criminals.
I think you hit the hammer on the nail. How do you keep out of the hands of criminals? You can't. Those who will do evil will use what ever means possible to carry out their foul ends. I am the son and grandson of a New York City Police Officer. From my father I have heard some terrible things committed by citizens bent on crime. One can not expect these individuals to respect the laws sent down by our government officials. Sadly owning a handgun might be the only way to protect one's life. A well aimed shot placed by a well trained female hand would cut down on a number of rapes and murders.
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Old 10-30-2008, 05:04 PM
 
Location: Rockland County New York
2,984 posts, read 3,694,974 times
Reputation: 1258
Quote:
Originally Posted by LightningMcQueen View Post
There's a discussion going on about the 2 boys shot by the NYPD after they allegedly shot into a crowd outside a nightclub. I personally think the police did the right thing under the circumstance. But it's stupid and it's tragic.

I think most everyone will agree that we need a tighter gun control. I personally think we should get rid of gun ownership, but I know it's not that simple. I'm very naive on this subject so I'm hoping to learn more.

So what are the forces that prevent us from getting rid of gun ownership or at least getting a tighter regulation.

NRA, the constitutional right, ... please educate me.
They were not boys. They were in their early 20's and had been arrested on prior charges. They were anything but choir boys.
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