Has Manhattan Real Estate Appreciation Value MAXED OUT??? (New York, Liberty: rent, health insurance)

[mathjak107]

why buy a stabilized building? the answere is like most jobs or careers. they all look good and promising when you start.. its afterwards that taxes,expenses and bad tenents make it no longer the origional deal you though you were buying.... why is it every day another business fails? its like asking them why they bought a bad business

[A_Better_Bronx_2morrow]

Originally Posted by mathjak107

why buy a stabilized building? the answere is like most jobs or careers. they all look good and promising when you start.. its afterwards that taxes,expenses and bad tenents make it no longer the origional deal you though you were buying.... why is it every day another business fails? its like asking them why they bought a bad business

Not only that Math, but when rent stabilization first started, us landlords were PROMISED that rents would keep up with EXPENSES.

At first it didn't but after awhile EXPENSE increased higher than rent increases and the RBG refused to balance the numbers creating this MONSTER we have today.

[mathjak107]

that exactley what happened. everyone was pursuaded to climb aboard in exchange for a 10 year tax abatement,which by the way our family got in 1963 .... we were told it was merely to prevent rent gouging... yeah right..... the rent increases for political reasons were so puny that it didnt take long to fall behind and the returns sucked .... luckily we went co-op in the 80's and although non eviction when the origional tenent leaves thats it, no more regulation finally.

now we just have been paying them 50,000 bucks to terminate the leases so we can sell the apartments at market

[SeventhFloor]

Originally Posted by quelinda

I wholeheartedly agree with a_better_bronx's rant. I am all for subsidizing housing for the poor, just not out of the landlord's pocket. This should come from the government in the form of public housing and section 8 vouchers. If you qualify for a section 8 voucher then you can get some help toward your rent, but if you're for example an accountant making six figures, then why should you pay my father $500 to live in an apartment that is worth $2000??? In effect, the landlord is being asked to subsidize this person's heat and hot water, which often costs more than the rent they get from the rent stablized tenant, who in many cases earns more than enough money to pay his fair share. That's a true story and its totally unfair.

this is a true story?

[SeventhFloor]

Originally Posted by A_Better_Bronx_2morrow

Not only that Math, but when rent stabilization first started, us landlords were PROMISED that rents would keep up with EXPENSES.

At first it didn't but after awhile EXPENSE increased higher than rent increases and the RBG refused to balance the numbers creating this MONSTER we have today.

since im not a landlord, i'll bite....what are your expenses for the month for running your building? and another question...your building is in the bronx...what do you think tenants should be paying to live for a 2 bedroom in your building for example? where is your building located? dont need specific address but just the neighborhood will do fine.

[quelinda]

Originally Posted by SeventhFloor

this is a true story?

Yes, the part about the tenant who earns six figures paying my father $550 per month to rent his apartment that is worth around $1900 per month (at the very low end). This private subsidy went on for decades. Unfortunately for that tenant, after years of subsidized rent for someone who certainly didn't need the help income-wise, Daddy needed an apartment for his daughter and had to evict him (after we had the baby I got two to put together). LOL

The sort of funny thing is that in one small sense, this system prevented that tenant from moving into older age owning some valuable real estate that would've been paid for by retirement age. I say this because about 10 years ago Dad needed an apartment for his own use and had to evict another rent stablized tenant (sorry but it IS his building and sorry if he wanted to live in his own residence). Well that tenant also had a good income and turned around and bought herself a co-op that is now worth lots and lots more than she paid for it. So she is on her way to owning something outright by the time she retires.

[Woozle]

Originally Posted by quelinda

sorry but it IS his building and sorry if he wanted to live in his own residence.

Good lord, don't apologize. THEY are the thieves. Not your father who only claimed back some stolen property.

Is this what we've been reduced to? Apologizing to people who stole from us for years? "Sorry, but I can't let you steal from me anymore"?

I blame the Manhattan Marxists who came to nearly destroying New York in the second half of the 20th century the way they destroyed Russia in the first. Victory will be achieved when the UWS and the Village are 100% yuppified and free of rent-controls and rent-stabbers.

[A_Better_Bronx_2morrow]

Originally Posted by SeventhFloor

since im not a landlord, i'll bite....what are your expenses for the month for running your building? and another question...your building is in the bronx...what do you think tenants should be paying to live for a 2 bedroom in your building for example? where is your building located? dont need specific address but just the neighborhood will do fine.

My building is located in the Norwood section of the Bronx by Montefiore Hospital. It's a 50 unit building.

Market rent for my area is:

1 Bedroom= $1,000-$1,100
2 Bedroom= $1,200-$1,300
3 Bedroom= $1,500-$1,680

My monthly rent roll if every tenant pays is about 34K a month.

You do the math and tell me if 34K for a 50 unit building is a sign of a successful business. Thats less than $1,000 per unit!!!!

80K a year in oil expenses
67K a year in property tax
36K a year in Water & Sewage
32K a year in Building Insurance
90K a year in salary (me and my wife only) We both have low salaries despite being owners...can't afford to give ourselves a raise.
21K a year in City & State taxes
Over 100K in Apt. renovations and maintanance



Someone living in the other 4 boroughs are looking at these market rents in the Bronx and thinking to themselves how cheap rent is in the Bronx...lol

[mathjak107]

Originally Posted by SeventhFloor

since im not a landlord, i'll bite....what are your expenses for the month for running your building? and another question...your building is in the bronx...what do you think tenants should be paying to live for a 2 bedroom in your building for example? where is your building located? dont need specific address but just the neighborhood will do fine.

its not just about expenses for the month its about total return at the end of the year. its also about repairs,renovations ,maintaince and property appreciation or now depriciation and legal fees ,accounting fees etc . its all about ROI or return on investment and how it compares to other asset classes with less grief,less risk and greater return.

a building may be profitable but if its surpassed by a treasury bond then its a poor investment

its like why work for someone paying you 1/3 of what you can earn from a competitor across the street assuming they treat you the same or better.

[quelinda]

Originally Posted by Woozle

Good lord, don't apologize. THEY are the thieves. Not your father who only claimed back some stolen property.

Is this what we've been reduced to? Apologizing to people who stole from us for years? "Sorry, but I can't let you steal from me anymore"?

I blame the Manhattan Marxists who came to nearly destroying New York in the second half of the 20th century the way they destroyed Russia in the first. Victory will be achieved when the UWS and the Village are 100% yuppified and free of rent-controls and rent-stabbers.

Thanks Woozle . I was being sarcastic. But I dont agree this city will be great when it is "100% yuppified". I just think private landlords should not be the ones bearing the brunt of a subsidy to the public. I believe more in government assistance when needed and deserved, not handouts from private landlords, often to high income earners who dont even need their rent to be stabilized.